Full Version: Shadowrun . . . alas, it fades
| QUOTE (Shrike30) | ||
Man, I was so pissed off when SR2 came out. They abandoned 1st ed! Those of us who wouldn't switch were just going on with the stuff we had and no incentive to switch over to 2nd ed...  |
SR2 and SR3 were incremental improvements on SR1. They're not fully back-compatible, but you can port stuff from one to the next with a reasonable degree of success, and the changes were small enough that it was only the few people whose particular sacred cow got gored (initiative and grounding are probably the most common ones for SR2->3) who wouldn't upgrade... and even then, many of them upgraded and just kept the old rule in place, because, as an incremental upgrade, you could do that.
SR4 is not incremental. Whether it's an improvement is a matter of opinion.
Jeez, people, my tongue was in my cheek the whole time. I wasn't serious.
And nobody answered my question... can anybody name another game publisher that made a new edition of a game, but kept putting out products for the old edition? I don't see a precedent here.
And nobody answered my question... can anybody name another game publisher that made a new edition of a game, but kept putting out products for the old edition? I don't see a precedent here.
| QUOTE (Shrike30) |
| Jeez, people, my tongue was in my cheek the whole time. I wasn't serious. And nobody answered my question... can anybody name another game publisher that made a new edition of a game, but kept putting out products for the old edition? I don't see a precedent here. |
The closest I can think of is ICE with HARP and RoleMaster.
Not really what you're asking for but HARP is kinda like a watered down basic set of RM.
Personally, I would have loved to see the SR4 core come out and then all the rules supplements (Street Magic, Unwired, etc.) come out within the year, at most. But there are logistics to consider that have been mentioned already. A good chunk of the freelancers were neck-deep in the writing/testing of SR4 Core and therefore wouldn't have been available to be writing the supplements at the same time. Most of the remaining freelancers who weren't writing SR4 Core (like myself) were writing System Failure at the time. Not to mention the Fourth Edition development was secret even to some of us, so we couldn't have been working on SR4 books (since we didn't know there'd be an SR4!). I started my System Failure writing completely unaware it would be the last SR3 book. 
Street Magic is taking longer than I'd like as a fan. But I also know how much work we're putting into and how much playtesting is required for it to come out solid. Being privy to that, I feel it's worth it. The delay is better than half-assing a book like that, in my opinion.
Personally, I also think we need a bigger freelancer pool so we can be writing more material simultaneously. All I can recommend there is that people who are interested do stuff like get involved in the website fiction so you come to the notice of Rob and the assistant devs.
Street Magic is taking longer than I'd like as a fan. But I also know how much work we're putting into and how much playtesting is required for it to come out solid. Being privy to that, I feel it's worth it. The delay is better than half-assing a book like that, in my opinion.
Personally, I also think we need a bigger freelancer pool so we can be writing more material simultaneously. All I can recommend there is that people who are interested do stuff like get involved in the website fiction so you come to the notice of Rob and the assistant devs.
| QUOTE |
| ...Can anybody name another game publisher that made a new edition of a game, but kept putting out products for the old edition? |
Well, we could argue Classic Battletech vs Mechwarrior, or Earthdawn and Earthdawn - but those are different publishers.
How soon did Magic in the Shadows come after SR3 core?
SR3 came out in August 1998; Magic in the Shadows was roughly March 1999. The last SR3 rulebook was Rigger 3, rushed out the door when FASA was closing in early 2001.
Ya, I remember that Rigger 3 took a long time to come out. Then got re-release a year or two later. Matrix took a couple years too, or at least year and a half don't remember what time of year it came out in 2000. Cannon Companion was in 2000 as well.
Was magic the first one out for SR3 too? Checking the copyrights at the front of the books Man & Machine, MitS, and SR Comp all came out the calendar year following the BBB.
Was magic the first one out for SR3 too? Checking the copyrights at the front of the books Man & Machine, MitS, and SR Comp all came out the calendar year following the BBB.
If I'm remembering things correctly, the SR3 Companion was first, then MitS, then Man & Machine, Matrix, Cannon Companion, Rigger 3. FASA's story was that they never intended to update the Companion to SR3, but changed their minds in the middle of '98 and fast-tracked it for a release early the next year.
| QUOTE (blakkie) | ||||
I can just imagine the ruckus, not to mention lack of sales, that would be raised with an US$100 retail price on Street Magic.  
I personally find SR4 very playable without the extra books, and would hate to see Fanpro take the attitude of "getting them out of the way". But then i don't play with canon junkies and am comfortable with converted stuff and stuff just made up, especially things NPC. Nor do we play a really high powered game, we started new 400BP characters with this edition. P.S. Fanpro is already, i believe, in the editting process for the first setting book. Not to mention the numerous ones already out that are largely still relavent and are virtually edition independant. |
Lack of sales? What? Many of you freaks would kill for Street Magic. And why would it have to be $100.00? You make no sense.
Besides, like I said, not our problem. I don't care how many people work for Fan Pro, I want my books. If they can't release them fast enough, then I won't wait 4 years to get one, I'll do it myself and then they lose money.
I want them to "get them out of the way", because I'm not buying the rule books, I want to buy setting books.
And I didn't mention anything about the numerous ones already out, I have them, I've read them and I want more.
Where'd you find the info on the setting book that's in editting?
| QUOTE (blakkie) |
I personally find SR4 very playable without the extra books, and would hate to see Fanpro take the attitude of "getting them out of the way". But then i don't play with canon junkies and am comfortable with converted stuff and stuff just made up, especially things NPC. Nor do we play a really high powered game, we started new 400BP characters with this edition. |
....I feel the same way about canon & CJs. After the aforementioned aborted TT campaign, I pretty much now stand by the Shadowrun world as I see it. Yeah I still get complaints from time to time (like when I introduced the "Sensitive" [Empath] archetype as an NPC in my last campaign). However, I find much of the fun of working up a campaign is personalising it to a degree. I have successfully ran several "single session" missions and was satisfied with how they went. I am currently working on a slightly longer scenario (3 - 4 session depending on what the characters do) but am not looking to do a major arc on the level of "Drivetime" (SR1 - 2) or "Rhapsody in Shadow" (SR3 - which by the way I would still like to get published) until some of the other supplements are released.
The only thng I still have difficulty with is when there is a much needed mechanic - such as vehicle design - that has not been re-introduced in SR4 yet. Extrapolating from, Rigger 3 really doesn't work very well since the basis for vehicle attributes and performance has been changed.
On the other hand, things, like new Adept Powers, Character Qualities, weapons & basic gear (or old ones that were not included in the base rules) are somewhat easier to work up by simply using the same framework from SR3 and adjusting for the SR4 mechanic (BPs, Power Points, DV etc.).
I can see why FanPro doesn't continue supporting SR3. SR4 is the way they intend to go. I don't like it which is why I have taken my gaming dollars (or pounds in my case) elsewhere.
| QUOTE (Shrike30 @ May 12 2006, 04:36 PM) |
| Jeez, people, my tongue was in my cheek the whole time. I wasn't serious. |
The irony was apparent, but it wasn't obvious which direction you were going with it.
| QUOTE |
| And nobody answered my question... can anybody name another game publisher that made a new edition of a game, but kept putting out products for the old edition? I don't see a precedent here. |
TSR ran the D&D and AD&D lines in parallel for quite some years. (Though I don't think I've ever actually met anyone who played D&D much after AD&D came out... but someone must have been, or they wouldn't have kept producing stuff for it.)
Battletech and MW:DA (does anyone play Clickywarrior anymore?) might qualify, too, though that's a rather more extreme case than even a radically altered new edition.
I seem to recall that one of the old games that switched to d20 has dual stat sets in its sourcebooks, for d20 and the older system, but I don't remember which it was...
| QUOTE (John Campbell) |
| TSR ran the D&D and AD&D lines in parallel for quite some years. (Though I don't think I've ever actually met anyone who played D&D much after AD&D came out... but someone must have been, or they wouldn't have kept producing stuff for it.) |
Bite your tounge!
D&D Rules Cyclopedia - basically the basic, companion, expert, master, and immortal sets combined into one hardback. Great for running one shot games when you didn't want to break out the countless 1e books.
| QUOTE (John Campbell) |
| I seem to recall that one of the old games that switched to d20 has dual stat sets in its sourcebooks, for d20 and the older system, but I don't remember which it was... |
at least two that i know of--Deadlands and L5R. L5R has stopped doing so, since WotC basically bent them over the table. i don't believe Deadlands does it anymore either, as they're switching over to Savage Worlds.
Fading suns for the trifecta
| QUOTE (Smilin_Jack) |
| D&D Rules Cyclopedia - basically the basic, companion, expert, master, and immortal sets combined into one hardback. Great for running one shot games when you didn't want to break out the countless 1e books. |
I once had my d20 group hurled backwards through time. I simulated it by converting the characters to the D&D Cyclopedia and running Sabre River (the campaign was just barely in the epic range, so it worked out pretty well). By the end of it they were begging to get back tot he world they knew.
| QUOTE (James McMurray) |
| I once had my d20 group hurled backwards through time. I simulated it by converting the characters to the D&D Cyclopedia and running Sabre River (the campaign was just barely in the epic range, so it worked out pretty well). By the end of it they were begging to get back tot he world they knew. |
Heh.
Introducing d20 players to the mechanics of basic/1e d&d is just cruel.
It turned out to be pretty fun. Sabre River is a pretty neat adventure if you don't mind having to do a little railroading. I never did, because they knew their only route home lay in solving the mystery, but a GM without that built in motivator might have to.
| QUOTE (Smilin_Jack @ May 13 2006, 07:10 PM) | ||
Heh. Introducing d20 players to the mechanics of basic/1e d&d is just cruel. |
I would have quit playing. Just glacing in those old books, which i have around, brings back too much rules pain.
You know, near where is live there is a river than legend says holds the rotting corpse of a GM who tried tht on his players
Guardians of order have a Tri-Stat system and a D20 system for many of their games. The Tri-Stat system was first, so D20 was another edition, per se. Thy still support both.
With the exception of Silver Age Sentinels [and the deluxe A Game of Thrones RPG], GoO didn't dual-stat any game lines; almost all their properties that had both d20 and Tri-Stat versions had distinct products, even if they carried the same name.
Eh, we had fun. Besides, if it would have made blakkie quit my game I'd have done it the first time he sat at the table.
I understand it makes no sense to keep 3rd Ed going when you've borught out 4th ed. I understand completely. BUT My point was they ended 3rd ed. Brought out 4th Ed's core book and then....well? Runners Havens does have my interest but none of the other stuff.
My complaint was that they know they needed to do core books- magic, matrix, cyberware, wheels, weapons, but didn't. they didn't have them on the lnie and not releasing them. Just convert the wheel and weapons books the way they converted almost unchanged the "companion" between 2nd and 3rd ed's. Yes long time posters will remember I was pissed at that but there are poeplew who are playing 4th ed and want the back up. Drawing it out like this is losing the market they might have otherwise capitalized. I predict people will get tired of waiting, drift back to 3rd ed with the bits they liked from 4, like the matrix which seems to be the best thing, and use the 3rd ed rules since htose are well developed.
Anyone suprised to learn I haven't bought 4th ed yet and I don't feel like I'm missing anything. anyone? anyone at all?
Adam, sleep. That's an order. Or else i shall torment you over every flaw the editor misses.
My complaint was that they know they needed to do core books- magic, matrix, cyberware, wheels, weapons, but didn't. they didn't have them on the lnie and not releasing them. Just convert the wheel and weapons books the way they converted almost unchanged the "companion" between 2nd and 3rd ed's. Yes long time posters will remember I was pissed at that but there are poeplew who are playing 4th ed and want the back up. Drawing it out like this is losing the market they might have otherwise capitalized. I predict people will get tired of waiting, drift back to 3rd ed with the bits they liked from 4, like the matrix which seems to be the best thing, and use the 3rd ed rules since htose are well developed.
Anyone suprised to learn I haven't bought 4th ed yet and I don't feel like I'm missing anything. anyone? anyone at all?
Adam, sleep. That's an order. Or else i shall torment you over every flaw the editor misses.
| QUOTE (Adam @ May 14 2006, 06:37 PM) |
| With the exception of Silver Age Sentinels [and the deluxe A Game of Thrones RPG], GoO didn't dual-stat any game lines; almost all their properties that had both d20 and Tri-Stat versions had distinct products, even if they carried the same name. |
BESM has a tri-stat and a D20 also. I don't know about how different they are, I only play tri-stat.
So, they're different "editions" then, huh?
| QUOTE (James McMurray @ May 14 2006, 02:37 PM) |
| Eh, we had fun. Besides, if it would have made blakkie quit my game I'd have done it the first time he sat at the table. |
You'd have to have beer on tap and free hookers (and quality ones; none of those cheap $20 trash, or your sister) to get me to sit at any table you were at. You'd then have to cut your tongue out to get me to stay.
At that point you could decide to use whatever rules you wanted, I'd just drink, "socialize", and generally ignore both you and the game.
| QUOTE (Rajaat99) |
| Lack of sales? What? Many of you freaks would kill for Street Magic. And why would it have to be $100.00? You make no sense. |
You suggest staffing up. Where do you expect the money to come from? If you think that FanPro would see two or three times the sales by bringing out all the books at once (faster than D&D 3e) instead of over a range of time similar to SR3 then you are seriously delusional. You might get an initial surge somewhat higher than just releasing one book, but you'll see trailing off. Meanwhile you now have 2 or 3 times the payroll to feed. So you what? Turf these guys you just hired on and got up to speed?
Snow Fox: I'm getting at least 4 hours a day, I promise. I'm actually crunching hard to finish the new Classic BattleTech core book, as it's being printed overseas, so it needs to go to press before the end of the month.
| QUOTE (Rajaat99) |
| BESM has a tri-stat and a D20 also. I don't know about how different they are, I only play tri-stat. So, they're different "editions" then, huh? |
Yes. There are only two books that are available for both BESM Tri-Stat [second edition] and BESM d20, and those are Centauri Knights and Uresia, both setting books with minimal game mechanics content. In terms of original content, the BESM Second Edition line was more or less stagnant by the time BESM d20 came out ... I think the only non-licensed BESM Tri-Stat book that came out after BESM d20 was BESM Space Fantasy.
There were also a couple licensed anime books [Hellsing and Trigun] that shared the same source material, but had rules/stats for each system, and a series of licensed anime books [Slayers] that had Tri-Stat and d20 versions that were entirely different, even the source material.
[I worked for Guardians of Order full-time for about two years, from late 2002 to late 2004, which is why I can remember all this stuff just like I was there -- because I was.
]
| QUOTE (blakkie) |
| You'd have to have beer on tap and free hookers (and quality ones; none of those cheap $20 trash, or your sister) to get me to sit at any table you were at. You'd then have to cut your tongue out to get me to stay. At that point you could decide to use whatever rules you wanted, I'd just drink, "socialize", and generally ignore both you and the game. |
Woo hoo! There's no chance blakkie will ever come to one of my gaming sessions! Scratch that one off the nightmares list. Whew!
Out of curiosity, what's so wrong with you that you'd have to get high priced hookers drunk to get some? I mean apart from your social and intellectual autism? -zing!-
| QUOTE (James McMurray @ May 14 2006, 09:13 PM) | ||
Woo hoo! There's no chance blakkie will ever come to one of my gaming sessions! Scratch that one off the nightmares list. Whew! Out of curiosity, what's so wrong with you that you'd have to get high priced hookers drunk to get some? I mean apart from your social and intellectual autism? -zing!- |
"Zing"? :/
Sorry, I suppose that flew over your intellectual radar.
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=zing
Look at the third block, first definition. If you need any of the bigger words explained I'l be happy to help.
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=zing
Look at the third block, first definition. If you need any of the bigger words explained I'l be happy to help.
Admin post: Both of you will be zinging and zanging while I'm banning if this continues.
Sorry, it was all meant in fun (hence the smileys).
Back on topic: It would be great if FP could hire a few temporary folks to push the product out the door. I know my group would snatch them up as quick as possible. And as long as the people hired knew it was a temporary contrctual gig there'd be no concerns of unfair practices or anything like that. But I'm from the software world, where about 1/3 of any given business can be short term contractors. I'm not sure if freelance writing works the same or not.
Back on topic: It would be great if FP could hire a few temporary folks to push the product out the door. I know my group would snatch them up as quick as possible. And as long as the people hired knew it was a temporary contrctual gig there'd be no concerns of unfair practices or anything like that. But I'm from the software world, where about 1/3 of any given business can be short term contractors. I'm not sure if freelance writing works the same or not.
I'm sure that if it did, there'd be 300% more problems with canon.
Not as long as the final product was put through a rigorous approval process by the bigwigs in charge. Heck, even just a "this is how to convert stuff" and a "here are your 4 chapters" could speed the process up greatly by putting the tedious conversion process into other hands while the primary differences between the editions (major rules changes and unwired for example) were left in more canon-capable hands.
I know it won't happen though. It's just a dream of mine to be able to stroll into my FLGS and grab every Shadowrun book on the to be released list.
I know it won't happen though. It's just a dream of mine to be able to stroll into my FLGS and grab every Shadowrun book on the to be released list.
FanPro does use freelancers for many tasks, just like most gaming companies do. That's what I am; I have no salary, no benefits, nobody buying me a new office chair when it breaks [which sucks, because I'd really like a new chair]. There are, however, only so many people that are willing to work for game industry rates that also possess the necessary understanding/skills in order to do the work.
You can't just add people and expect stuff to magically get done faster. As I'm sure you've seen in your field, sometimes adding people can actually make the process slower and lower quality, and some processes simply can't be sped up all that much [I'm thinking specifically of writing, which, if you speed up by adding multiple people, requires more time to edit/develop into a more cohesive whole, and playtesting, which, no matter how many playtest groups you have, will still take a certain number of weeks to do -- and the more playtesters you have, the more work it is to take the feedback and integrate it...]
You can't just add people and expect stuff to magically get done faster. As I'm sure you've seen in your field, sometimes adding people can actually make the process slower and lower quality, and some processes simply can't be sped up all that much [I'm thinking specifically of writing, which, if you speed up by adding multiple people, requires more time to edit/develop into a more cohesive whole, and playtesting, which, no matter how many playtest groups you have, will still take a certain number of weeks to do -- and the more playtesters you have, the more work it is to take the feedback and integrate it...]
Brooks' law: adding more people to a late software project will only make it later. (Paraphrased: nine women cannot make one baby in one month). That applies to other kinds of projects, of course...
| QUOTE (blakkie @ May 15 2006, 03:08 AM) | ||
You suggest staffing up. Where do you expect the money to come from? If you think that FanPro would see two or three times the sales by bringing out all the books at once (faster than D&D 3e) instead of over a range of time similar to SR3 then you are seriously delusional. You might get an initial surge somewhat higher than just releasing one book, but you'll see trailing off. Meanwhile you now have 2 or 3 times the payroll to feed. So you what? Turf these guys you just hired on and got up to speed? |
Oh, you think SR has a low fan base. I see. I disagree, but then again, maybe I'm just "delusional".
If they produced books faster, they would make profit faster. Get it?
If you produced books and then stopped, you'd be correct. I'm talking about making books contantly, not stopping.
Stopping production stops profits. Slow production = slow profits. Fast production = fast profits. That makes more sense.
And besides, I've said it 3 times now, not my problem, I want my books now.
| QUOTE (Rajaat99 @ May 15 2006, 05:48 AM) |
| Oh, you think SR has a low fan base. I see. I disagree, but then again, maybe I'm just "delusional". |
Shadowrun does have a small fanbase, comparatively. There's a reason why, even with SR4, FanPro only climbed to 3rd in industry share last year (at least according to pundits). Compared to WotC and WW (together about 80% of the market), FanPro's SR market is small and print runs are planned accordingly.
Furthermore your analysis is incorrect because it fails to take into account elements like distribution, store presence, or the target audience's acquisition rate and a number of other realities of the speciality publisher's market and the current state of the RPG industry.
Releasing 1 book a month does not equate to 1 book on the shelves per month. Nor does it guarantee that "fast profits" since a) there is a time lapse between release and it showing up at the FLGS which is out of the publishers hands for the most part, and b) the fact that the book is on sale does not equate to immediate sales or even guaranteed sales. Having 2-3 books out in short order means you've got a significant amount of operational capital tied up in each which might or might not see fast returns.
Ideally, FanPro would like to release 4-6 books a year, and that's what they'll be going for as soon as they get over the initial core book hump.
| QUOTE (James McMurray @ May 14 2006, 09:30 PM) |
| Sorry, I suppose that flew over your intellectual radar. |
I am aware of the word. I was just dismayed by you thinking that YOUR inability to read constituted a "zing". I don't know, maybe your post would have more traction if i didn't personally know autistic kids that are still too young for grade school that would give your reading comprehension a run for it's money inspite of their difficulties with some literary devices.
Anyway, back to topic......
| QUOTE (Rajaat99) |
| Stopping production stops profits. Slow production = slow profits. Fast production = fast profits. That makes more sense. And besides, I've said it 3 times now, not my problem, I want my books now. |
You wanting their books now is indeed your problem.
Your simplistic model of everyone that normally buys SR books will buy whatever they put on the shelf. 12+ SR books per year @ $20-$30 a pop for an extended period? I don't spend $300/year on P&P in total, and certainly wouldn't. There might be a few "gotta catch them all" folks that might, but even among them a lot would become entirely disgusted by what they'd see as them being milked and step off the train entirely.
I'm with you that i'd like to have seen Street Magic early. Probably by about 2 months ago. But i'm partially consoled to hear that at least part of the reason is that they are delayed is they are attempting to have all those *books work with each other before releasing the first one.
| QUOTE (Synner) |
| Ideally, FanPro would like to release 4-6 books a year, and that's what they'll be going for as soon as they get over the initial core book hump. |
4-6 Shadowrun titles, of course. Certainly more than 6 books on the overall FanPro schedule this year...
I know where I work when they rush in new people I seem to spend most of my day correcting their problems. I think the complaint about the speed on the 4th ed is that they have planned the release poorly. That there are books they knew about needing. Books they could have had partially done when 4th ed came out, but did not.
| QUOTE (Synner) | ||
Shadowrun does have a small fanbase, comparatively. There's a reason why, even with SR4, FanPro only climbed to 3rd in industry share last year (at least according to pundits). Compared to WotC and WW (together about 80% of the market), FanPro's SR market is small and print runs are planned accordingly. |
Well, if I have to wait this long for every book, maybe SR's fanbase will shirnk a little smaller.
| QUOTE (blakkie @ May 15 2006, 11:39 AM) |
| Your simplistic model of everyone that normally buys SR books will buy whatever they put on the shelf. 12+ SR books per year @ $20-$30 a pop for an extended period? I don't spend $300/year on P&P in total, and certainly wouldn't. There might be a few "gotta catch them all" folks that might, but even among them a lot would become entirely disgusted by what they'd see as them being milked and step off the train entirely. |
I easily spend $300 a year on RPG stuff, maybe I'm just hardcore. I know a few "gotta catch them all" folks, I certainly was 1 with 3rd Ed. And I was disgusted with all the good stuff coming out, then the switch to 4th. I didn't really see it as being milked though, oh well.
Alright then, you guys win. I'll make up my own stuff and not wait around for Fan Pro to put out canon material. That way I know the setting won't suck and I'll have more money!
| QUOTE (blakkie) |
| YOUR inability to read |
This from a guy who apparently couldnt' read Adam's post.
| QUOTE |
| Brooks' law: adding more people to a late software project will only make it later. (Paraphrased: nine women cannot make one baby in one month). That applies to other kinds of projects, of course... |
Too true. I've seen it happen. What's really funny (or tragic, depending on your perspective) is when they add several new people without clearances to a cleared project, when that project is using a new tool that none of the new people have experience with. Then they start having a meeting every day to try and figure out why schedule keeps slipping.
I'm not sure where the cutoff line is for sourcebook creation, but a template [plus conversion standards might speed the process some, putting the editing of those sections more into a "check for spelling and grammar." But like I said, my experience with writing RPGs is practically nil. It's more of a "want more now!" then a "this is what I know would work."
| QUOTE |
| Well, if I have to wait this long for every book, maybe SR's fanbase will shirnk a little smaller. |
Truth there.
Gamer shows up to store with money, looks for newest SR product and doesn't find it. Most gamers I've seen, will look for something else - either in a another line they play, or will shop around for something new - Gamers can't hold onto money long, when they get it they want to buy something.
They go back a month later with more money, and still no New SR materiel. But look, theres something else in some other line they play. Pretty soon, the SR materiel drops down a few notches due to inactivity, and it won't be the first thing they look for anymore.
Or they could be buying other companys products to add into their existing SR Game; d20 cyber this, Gurps that, someone elses magic supplement, then shoe horn it into their game.
Pretty soon, they aren't even looking for SR because it does not seem that the company is supporting it anymore.
It seems a little insane that this two person show is adding another line, when they cannot seem to keep up with what they have.
The Degenesis line is being managed by someone who was not currently doing much work for FanPro -- Davidson Cole, who used to work for FASA.
| QUOTE (James McMurray) | ||
This from a guy who apparently couldnt' read Adam's post. |
Woooott!!!!!! Way to STFU!!!!
Bye.
LOL
What's the Degenesis line? I couldn't find a readily available link to it on fanpro.com.
What's the Degenesis line? I couldn't find a readily available link to it on fanpro.com.
FanPro.com is FanPro GmbH's site; FanProGames.com is FanPro LLC's site for English-language products.
http://www.fanprogames.com/?p=32 for the Degenesis press release.
http://www.fanprogames.com/?p=32 for the Degenesis press release.
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