When it says "If the GM allows it" they are saying the rule. So if a gm says you can not use this rule, then the rule is out and you are still playing canon SR.

Also, although there is indeed an exception to the Force limiting Hits rule, I wouldn't allow a Sustaining Focus to handle the stress of such a jacked up spell.

That alone tends to solve so many headaches down the road...

A little late, but I just wanna stick up for the min/maxers and point out that just because we have high dice pools doesn't mean we aren't good players.

It's when you start looking at everything else that you find out. 20 dice in pistols? Inconclusive.

20 dice in pistols, 1 in all mental stats, allergies to 3 kinds of shell fish, and no skils that aren't gun related?

Okay, munchkin.

Power level is relative to the game. In my games, 16 dice is a very skilled, but not amazingly skilled, professional runner. 20 dice is amazingly skilled. Over that is legendary.

It's really not that hard to get combat skills in the high teens. Agi 5, Skill 6, Spec 2, Weapon Focus/Smart Link 2, Reflex Recorder/Adept skill focus 1, and you're already at 16 without a huge investment (because Agi 5 is good for so freakin' many things).

The main issue I see Dayhawk having is that he's inexperienced GMing SR, and is running up against a player that is clearly very familiar with the rules, but not enough to make a legal character. So the player will push him and push him, and Dayhawk won't know when to say "That's not right" and how to push back (and those sorts of players do see the GM as an adversary. Cause he is).

That's where the boards come in.

It very well could. I was thinking because the "If the GM allows it" comes before the explanation of the rule, that meant the rule. You could however be correct.

Lorechaser: Absolutely. When I first started GMing Shadowrun(2e was my first time), i didnt know just what the hell people could get away with...that was a little in the grey market area. As you learn the rules, you become better at reigning in the people who are trying to abuse the system.

And yes, a large die pool does not mean powergamer, or munchkin, and also remember min maxing in an of itself is not a bad thing.

Also as Lorechaser pointed out, looking at the whole gives a much bigger picture than looking at one or even two pools.

And also, keep in mind other little odds and ends. Too many stats at 1 should raise a red flag. Another tactic people try to push buy is the take low attributes, and buy them up with ware, and much less BP in the end. Players should be encouraged to play what they see in their heads. Surely not EVERY player's ideal Sam has a natural 5 Agl and 1 Str, which is purchased up. Numerically sure, but realistically?

Heavy purchased attributes with tons of low skills is another tactic to be able to do everything...keep in mind if a character twinks Agility, Reaction, Logic and Charisma up to high levels(and it can go pretty high for a starting character if they dont care for their other stats)they will be able to buy up to around 2 or 3 a LOOOT of skills(Physical, Social, Technical, and Vehicle are mainly covered with these four stats, with some exceptions). Keep a look out for stuff like this as well. Being well rounded is one thing but twinking to get a one-man party who can do everyone's job might step on some toes.

This character would cause a hell of a lot more trouble than the human samurai who happens to throw 16 dice in Automatics and 14 in Blades.

@Dayhawk

Yeah, stay away from houserules until you at least run a few sessions. About everything that has ever come up during my games (running for close to a year) have had some sort of discussion on these forums. So, when we run into a problem, I rule on a short term fix and then come here, look up the discussion and then bring that back to my players out of game then make a final ruling.

You will find that hardly any discussion here has a single answer, but multiple sides are always discussed and I've always found one side that I gravitated towards and then enough to make a solid ruling.

Also, if you do limit skills, the rules on page 69 (under "Grittier Gameplay) are more balanced - limiting hits to (Skill x 2). This penalizes low skills until 3 or 4, which is how it should be, since a skill of 3 is considered professional level.

Be careful about gimping high Attribute/low skill combos, though, because the game already rewards hyper-specialists over generalists. Like Deek said, it's probably better to wait a few sessions, to see if you even need to implement house rules.