OK, I apologize for "self-administering". I started this thread with the intention of giving this sort of conversatino a place to happen, so it wouldn't drift other threads off topic, because I realize this isn't appropriate for all games. I didn't want to spend the entire time defending the existence of the 'ware.

I'd like to ask, though, what the practical difference between having canon rules and letting the DM house rule it is, in terms of "appropriateness?" Some are saying that they're fine with letting a player request these for his character, but they don't want them in the main book. Is this because you think canon rules give this some sort of legitimacy, and you don't want it to have that?

Here's a question, though. Considering that SR Joe Consumer can have a dizzying array of superreal sexual experiences by playing simsense through his commlink, how much demand would there be for expensive and invasive body modifications?

Oh, and - betrayal has always been one of the legs cyberpunk fiction stands on. Dosing someone with carcerand nanites via intercourse ranks pretty high.

The implications of the Electroshock upgrade for Orthoskin are nasty, too.

Matrix sex isn't superreal, it's sub-real. you can program experiences that don't exist in real life, but if you stack a sex act in the matrix against the same sex act in real life, the real version in better.

Unless you get off on the unreality of the act. Some dudes I've known would turn down real sex to watch porn, because that was their bag.

No, I just quite simply don't see where they are neeed, as you said, sex and punk has always gone together hand in hand, that is something that everyone knows, and is one of the reasons that I say you really don't need "rules" for cyberdicks, all you need to do is mention them in fluff a time or two and you get the same impact and free up wordcount for something that quite frankly is cooler then cyberdicks.

And besides, if you are going to include cybercocks for men then why in the nine hells didn't they also include cyberpussies for women? How about cyberwombs that could be removed as the user wished? Rules for Sixth World birth control and abortions?

Please note that I'm not protesting because I think cyberdicks are immature or silly, just that they fall under the same catagory of the other things I listed, which in my opinion are things that everyone should understand exist in the Sixth World and that I woul love to appear in the fluff, but that I don't think we need "rules" for.

*Edit*

And I may not be sure on "regular" cybersex, but BTL sex should be better then the real deal. And perhaps Astral Sex as well.

Yes, there is a reason why it is called Better than Life. Hot Sim is super-real.

Rules for cyberwombs would be great really. How many players have attempted to create pregnant male PCs but just given up due to a lack of rules that support it? Certainly, the character concept deserves some support.

See, I could apply the same logic to anything. I mean, do we really need rules for drugs ? we could just mention it in fluff a few times, and get the same effect. Why do we really need prices for food and clothes? So what you say comes off to me as "I admit it should exist, but why do we have to talk about it?"

Anything players might want for their characters should have more foundation than that. For the wordcount, I don't think it matters if it's in the tables or in the shadowtalk. Fluff happens. If it had been in shadowtalk, people like me would be asking what essence they cost.

If hot sim is super-real, then why is it a big deal that ultraviolet nodes are so realistic that you can't tell the difference between it and real life? Sure, in hor-sim you can experience peaks that are boosted higher than real sensory input, but its, for lack of a better term, "Grainy"

Sim is hyperreal, because if you want to have sixpack abs and sex with three blond teenagers on a beach or two goats in a bathtub, you can buy it in a sim program. Yes, it's a sim experience - but it cost only 50 nuyen and is ready on demand in your commlink 24/7.

RL porn is popular for the same reason. If I want an experience of sex with an Asian woman on a subway car, somewhere there's a porn video that will allow me that experience, conveniently, cheaply, and repeatedly.

No, I don't mind people talking about it at all, in fact I'm planning on running with a couple of the ideas presented, namely playing "repo-man" for some poor slob's ex-wife and hunting down the street doc who decided that it would be funny to give a mobster a cyberdick in an "odd" place.


As for drugs and the like, I disagree because drugs, ect have actual rules and in-game effects, cyberdicks quite frankly don't aside from the Essence cost.

..actually, making cosmetic things that don't have Game Effect costs Essence was the biggest mistake.

*chuckles*

Naw, I'd need a whole sourcebook devoted to the subject, as well as a fluff explanation as to why the majority of women running the shadows are "hot-lesbian-elf-stripper-ninjas".

And we'd also need rules about dikoting your Ally Spirit and having sex with it too.

All right, since I'm the one who threw the cyberpenis (as well as the breasts) in the ring during development (at least AFAIR... ), I possibly should try to tell you why I do such dirty things...

- Players asked for them: I regularly visit quite a lot of RPG-conventions in Germany and one thing that was asked now and then was "Why are there rules for almost everything cyber, but no tits or dicks? Its mentioned in almost novel!"
And well, they were right, sex and Cyberpunk-/Dark Near Future-settings belong to each other...

Another question was "will the players like them /want them to be included"? Well, we were pretty sure (and proven right, IMHO), that some would and some would not...
but everyone pays the same prize for their books (or at least should), and so its just like with a good DJ, everyone in the club should have some of his prefered music (as long as it fits into the general evening's theme)... some want killerware, they got it... some want fluff-oriented 'ware, they got it (or at least I hope so).

- It is logical: When there's some new technology dawning, people want to know if it supports one of three things: Can I kill/subdue someone with it? Negates it one of the needs that usually requires me to lift myself from the sofa? Can I use it in sex/does it make "my kind of sex" better?

Sex sells! A l w a y s !

And you can bet your sorry ass that the corps know it and take advantage of it!

- Can we describe it in an generally unoffending/mature way? Well, I think we did... Its just a piece of cyber as everything else... Name, basic function, stats, that's it.
Sure, some (possibly younger) groups will giggle about it, make jokes and/or "abuse" it.
But I think there's nothing wrong with it. I think we've all been in an age where we behaved as such.
Kids grow up and even giggling adults will see that these jokes will be out quite soon (since they become boring rather quickly).

No, the book of erotic fantasy.

Damn good book, too.

..uhm... can you see the board breaking, too?

You were joking?!? I'm shocked, just shocked I say!!!

wow, I take it all back, you were right! Talking about cybersex broke the internet!

Roll 4D100/4 -1 +modifiers to determine vaginal circumference potential then divide her height by 12 and add (2d20)% to the result to determine her vaginal depth potential. Damage taken from penetrations exceeding these stats is determined by the Maim Master. Hymen resistance is determined by rolling 5d20. Once intercourse is completed, roll 1d100 and multiply the resulting percentage (-30% for every ejaculation within the past 24 hourss) by 200 million to determine sperm count. A sperm count of 80 million (20%) or less is insufficient to impregnate a woman. If the modified roll is greater than 20% then the woman rolls 1d00 and becomes pregnant only on a natural 1.
Women who are fertile but are not pregnant menstruate for for 3+(1d6 -1) days. Roll 1d100. On a result of 50 or less, the woman experiences tender breasts and bloating prior to menstruation. A result of 40 or less indicates full blown PMS, as well. A result of 10 or less indicates that the woman also suffers from menstrual cramps.
The length of the male appendage is determined by dividing his height by 12 and then rolling 4d100/2 -1 and consulting the table on page 77. Note that this is the shortest measurable length, taken from the top or belly-button side and represents the maximum a woman can take in the missionary position. However, if she were to mount the Manhood from above facing her partner and leaning back she would actually take 1.15 times the base length, accounting for the remainder. To determine the circumference of the male member member, divide his height by 12, multiply the result by 0.85, roll 4d100/2 -1 and consult the table on page 78.

If you need rules for sex, there you go.

I don't think they are strictly necessary.

I do, however, think that these accessories would be a really good excuse to make the Quattro Assasini Superiori from Bananna Games.
In particular, one could actually make El Gato, a Spanish catgirl (achieved through mostly cybernetic body modification) with two sets of non-retractible hand razors, matching set of foot razors, six razor sharp spikes along her milk-lines to simulate a cat's extra mammary glands, metal whiskers, a phallic cyber-tail mounted so that it comes out of her rectum, and a very large spiked cyberpenis with a kay-bar blade mounted on the tip of the penis and two smaller secondary blades pointing off to the sides with their cutting edges pointed inward. This spiked and bladed cyberpenis is her primary weapon, by the way.

Yes, it sounds terrible, but in the context of the comic book she is featured in, she is a cool yet short-lived character (she's accidentally shot when her trench-coated (but otherwise naked) female nazi (with swastika areola piercings) opens up with a LMG in a narrow hallway).


And actually, it was quoting -Nyx- that broke the internet.

Posts edited to un-break the internet.

Might be a good idea to quote Nyx manually. The auto-quote function grabs ahold of the "-" characters and goes nuts.

yay! eidolon saved the internet!

Hyzmarca, I hate the fact that I know what game you're referencing. It is, in fact, the single worst game ever written in the history of RPGs. And reading reviews of it is just a fine and dandy way to spend an afternoon.

Personally? I'm just happy that they made them have costs. So that people have to decide between being ultimately twinked or having giganto-robo-schlongs with tit-missiles.

Maybe you're supposed to put points of Body Enhancement in there...

im tempted to ask where i can find said game

http://atrocities.primaryerror.net/fatal.html

Also good reading material on the subject.

yeah, faced with the review (and having read the review for spawn of fashan) i have to agree with knasser, here... i have a really hard time imagining anything as horrifically disturbing as FATAL appears to be...

seriously, it's like some horrid plague on humanity... the horrors have clearly returned, and they have designed an RPG system... merely gazing upon it will reduce you to insanity. Cthulhu backs away from the book, terrified of what it might do if he lets it out of his sight.

Actually, I've just had a look at the PDF and it's not as bad as I remember. Is it a second edition?

I feel bad about using the game to show off my piss-taking skills. The author did write a 900 page role-playing game on his own! It's quite impressive in its way. And anything that includes the rule "pregnent women acquire 2d4 of the following symptoms... symptoms last 1d20 weeks" can be pretty amusing.

I wish the author good luck in getting it published as he says he wants to.

i dunno. i mean, spawn of fashan is mind-boggling, but FATAL sounds like it makes you want to claw your own eyes out from having read it.

We've got a solid page of completely off topic discussion here. If you really want to discuss FATAL, please do so in the General Gaming Forum.

So, could you get a cyberpenis with the modular option (or whatever it's called) so you could be like the King Missile song?

Oh, and a further attempt to rerail this thread.

It was mentioned that there is a cyberpenis but no cyber-va-jay-jay, but I would imagine the cyberpenis is really just a fancy name for cybergenitals, and either type would use the exact same stats.
Was this already covered?

I don't remember it being directly covered in that manner. I think it would work as a rule though.

edit: never mind...

Just as a side topic, this was apparently just re-released.
This is the PDF version of the Book of Erotic Fantasy.

http://www.rpgnow.com/p.php?pid=12517&SRC=Newsletter

Just in case anyone wanted more rules on sex and rpg's, here ya go.
If you didn't, please ignore this post.

gawd, as if it wasn't bad enough seeing some of what they've submitted for patents, I really don't want to imagine what they can do in shadowrun.

If I knew what was good for me, I'd stay away from this thread, but it's like watching a train wreck. The horrors and such, yet strangely fascinating in seeing what people can come up with.