Ok nested is a misleading word, this isn't a ward on top of a ward with double ward bonuses. It is in fact two wards, one is a square-donut-shaped outer ward with a hole in the middle and the other ward is square-shaped inner ward that is in the hole of the other ward.

You can put a ward inside another astral barrier. Like a lodge.

Can you put a Lodge inside a Ward?

Ok how about 4 outer wards arranged like blocks: one big one on top, another big one on bottom, two L shaped wards on each side, then the inner ward in the middle of this arrangement of 4 outer wards.

I don't think you can make a 'magical seal' with that type of arrangement. There will still be cracks and other places to slip through the Ward(s).

I just thought of something, nested wards wouldn't do any good anyways. The range of 'touch' of the Mana Window spell only applies to transferring the use of the spell to someone else. There is no such thing as a touch range Detection spell, its range is in fact Force * Magic meters. With a high force Mana Window spell, he should be able to see Mr. Magoo from the sidewalk outside the estate! And as per the discussion on another thread, spell effects don't "travel" which means he can reach right into the inner ward without being blocked by the outer ward anyways. He would never need to see through a series of wards, only one.

Therefore, with a Mana Window spellcasting roll versus Ward rating roll, Tarantula knows exactly where Mr. Magoo is hiding and knows the entire layout of the bunker.

Still needs to see through the normal barriers (walls, etc), and the Earth (which he ain't going to do ... at least not easily).

Mana Window is not a one-spell-free-pass to view through everything.

Unfortunately it does:

Is there a limit to the number of 'barriers' magical or not, that the Mana Window spell can penetrate?

Astral Window is what I was thinking of. Does that Spell penetrate the aforementioned non-magical barriers?

Well since barriers can't overlap, each is a distinct volume, and since spells don't "travel", the Mana/Astral Window spell can reach right into a million layers of wards into the inner ward. He doesn't need to have a link to hit or have LOS (because that would defeat the whole point of the spell), so I guess he just picks coordinates and attempts to drop the spell at that point.

The text implies its cast against a single barrier. However, I'd argue that as you try to view "through" a barrier, the barrier tries to resist the spell, if its successful the spell ends (same as if a mage walks through one with a spell sustained), if the barrier fails, the spell is able to see through it.

Not to mention, if I can use astral window to assense magoo, I can mask my aura to look like his, and completely ignore the spirits (since they don't have physical sight).

Yeah I noticed that too, as far as I can see it would work. You would notice that there is no astral trail leading out of the bunker and since you're an initiate you could see that it doesn't redirect through a metaplane. Therefore, you would know that the trail would have to lead into the bunker. An Astral Window spell later, you'd be spoofing your way right into the inner sanctum.

This trick would work for ALL wards, because there is nowhere a ward builder can hide. Unless, as hyzmarca said, the wardcrafter can build a series of wards so wide that an astrally projecting mage could never swoop close enough to cast Astral Window on him.

So that's not just one, but two more kills for Tarantula, giving him a total of 3
Kewpie Dolls of Doom

Just a note, that mage can cast his extended astral window spell at a distance of 8 x 8 x 10 = 640 meters. Thats quite a bit.

I wonder if all really expensive magical security companies sequester their wardcrafters up in Le Grange point space stations. "Come to the off-world colonies! Make big money while just floating in space."

Considering they'd have to fly them up and down every few weeks, its unlikely. Figure they have 10 wardcrafters on staff. Each is specialized in wardmaking. Each makes their wards alone (to reduce valid signatures on it). Thats 10 (willpower + exceptional) + magic (maybe 8ish?). For 18 dice, average 6 hits, not bad for a force 8 ward. Now, they take 8s. Reduced down to probably 2-4s. Still, it hurts. Assuming they make a ward a day, average of 6 weeks a ward.... Once they've hit 42(6weeksx7days) contracts, they're time is spent maintaning the wards, and they can't support any more. So, they'd be landbased the entire time, though, they would probably either try to hide their link to a metaplane, or instead colaborate to make a very good ward in the corp HQ to hide in. (Adding its force (16) to thresholds to find them).

I just thought of something else, you aren't casting the Astral/Mana Window spell on the location it's targeting, you're casting it on yourself and the effect is targeting the location. Maybe the effect does "travel" and maybe layers of wards would help...

Ha, that's what they want you to think! One of the fluff stories details a mage team in just such a Le Grange green station. They weren't sequestered wardcrafters, just some sort of metaplanar strike team.

1 team, 6 runners (+200karma) +1 mill

at least one of them has the contacts to pull in a nightwraith or better modern bomber with a TacNuke Bunkerbuster as a favour

if not you just hack the military net and "order" one

if you really want to go the whole hog invest the team in being a military strike team with that level of call in. or possibly a bored Silo operator earning some money on the side.

After reading the cutting edge section of Arsenal, I've found the ultimate solution: bring a cute kitten with a bomb (secreted by the kitten to avoid detection) in front of the bunker and have it spend days and night scratching at the door and meowing... Even the paranoid Mr Magoo won't be able to resist this adorable little kitty (especially with willpower 1).

Another solution would be to send 1 milions nuyens worth of digging insect swarms. Equip some of them with some chemical that can melt the floor of the bunker and the others with poison. Have them come out in different places in the bunker, so that at least one swarm will be able to find Mr Magoo and execute him.

But I still think that someone who decide to seclude himself from the world by locking himself inside a totally hermetic bunker can be considered dead to the world.

The Killer Kitten and Deadly Deadly Swarm ideas are great. I designed the bunker before I got Augmentation, so the spirits don't have instructions to inspect animals, just to notice if they are behaving strangely. (I assumed any mage Shapechanged into critter form would also have Masking, so there was no point to inspect animals' auras)

In Bunker 2.0, I'll need to have the spirits assense the animals for cyberware. I haven't read the stats on biodrones too carefully, is there some way to use bioware so they can hide their nature from astral perception?

That makes sense, if you had more drones than multiple spirits have multiple actions in the time it takes between the spirits noticing the armada and the time it takes for the drones to hit the bunker, then one of the drones would make it to the bunker before getting fried.

If you had enough weight and speed a kinetic dive bomb might work (we don't have game rules on that though). And I think the thermite plane would work (do we have game rules on thermite?).

No matrix connections? Have him declared legally dead. His guards will go home when they can't get paid next shift. The electricity will get shut off, and his air circulators will stop working.

Already said it, but it looks like Buster only wants solutions that involves getting into the bunker to do the job.

Creative solutions are great, but they have to go with the information in the first post and the rest of the thread. Since we already know that the bunker has it's own power, air, and an army on the way within 24 hours, not to mention the fact that it takes months to get someone declared dead when there's no body, Tsuul's Bureaucracy-Fu fails.

Added a "Newcomers" section to the first post so people don't have to read through all 10 pages of this thread to see what works and what doesn't.