If you're bringing in rules for having sex, then your game session has proven to fall into really juvenile trappings. I'd rather watch a real porno/hentai/whatever, than playing it out with other guys by rolling dices and comparing results.
I did heard from that one RPG which was absolutely terrible and did have terrible rules for everything, including having sex. F.A.T.A.L., I think it was called.

Meh...

First, you are making a huge mistake by assuming all gamers are men. While I am male, I know and play with several female players. And if your game focus' around sex, it is probably juvenile, as you say, but simply including sex does not make it so, and often makes it a more mature game. Finally, although it rarely comes up, it is useful for having a system for exactly how good your character is - there are circumstances where it can become important.

Having girls in your group doesn't make it a difference. In my regard, that's where playing a tabletop RPG is becoming... pathetic, if you really need to have to roll for sexual intercourse for your fictive characters. Of course, it's your group, and if you really think it's fun to do that, oh well, more power to you.
But it's not going to do away with the eye-rolling, and does affirm prejudices about roleplayers. Or is it rollplayers?

Sexual interactions in a game should be left vague. There are some things that should be role played, but sex... no thank you. That is something that you do with your partner. I don't want to know and don't need to know.

I never said it was detailed out in the games I play. It so far has been far more vague than the first version of this thread was. However, it is possible that something may come up eventually that it becomes important to know how to measure how good a character is, and even if no dice are involved, it is useful to know what it would be based off of. It is because of that possibility, and moreso general curiosity spawned by this thread, that I brought up game mechanics for sex.

Now I would ask that unless you have something productive relating to the topic, simply do not respond to it as it does not affect you.

So you think that discussing about rules for sexual intercourse in a thread dealing with sexual oddities partaining to the world of Shadowrun, and commenting about them being just sad is unproductive? Yeah, whatever. But as long as your group is okay with it, don't let this bother you. However, there is nothing wrong with pointing towards the sillyness of such things. That's why we're on a message board, after all.

A variety of different skills could be used for the roll, dependent on how things are going. Psychology would be a better base skill than Gymnastics on most occasions. The human mind is one of the most sexual organs in the body. Worst case scenario, your partner gets to choose what you roll - is he or she going to demand high rolls on Strength + Gymnastics, or will he or she be more touched by your attention to all the things they care about, from arranging a perfect evening to simply listening and caring about their feelings. I've been with some women that were brutally direct about their physical expectations. I've even known people who it only seemed possible they could make it if their partner was rich - little to do with their partner's attributes all together. I'm not going to say it's juvenile of a group to want a mechanic for this. For a start, I've never known the players and I don't know the context. I can easily enough see a player saying okay - "what do I roll?" There shouldn't be any condemnation for asking that in this thread? If prejudice and personal preference is to be suspended for discussion of tentacle rape and amputation fetishes, then it should certainly be suspended whether or not someone chooses to roll dice.

But I will say that finding a mechanic for the act of sex is going to be difficult. It's not a test like running the 100m in under 11 seconds (in fact that would be a very bad comparison ). It's a whole mishmash of preferences and expectations that can encompass ethnicity, social status, compassion, physique, hair colour and styles of clothing, circumstance, when you last had sex, whether there's someone else you really want, power relationships between each other... number of participants, even? I'm not saying don't do some sit-ups, but I'm saying that sexual satisfaction is far, far too complicated to be simulated by Attribute + Skill except for the most emotionally uninvolved and mechanical of lovers.

If anyone has ever seen the monstrosity that is the film A.I. (and I truly, truly pity them if so), you might remember Jude Law as "Gigolo Joe" the sex robot and his "I know what women want" programming - never questioning that his lounge music 'you're so special' routine could ever fail him.

I think playing a character that got persona-fixed might be fun.

Originally ended up biosculpted, or whatever, pimped out and persona-fixed, after a couple of years, persona fixed a second time to add in some spying/assassination additions for blackmailing clients/killing undesirables/dead beats.

The assassination protocol doesn't get reversed, and you get away, at least for now. Hope you dont get a phone call with that old activation command. Sounds like a negative quality to me. =)

I second everything that Hyzmarca has said. I actually stopped reading the last thread quite early on - I found some of the things that were being written there sick and off-putting. HOWEVER, I think Dumpshock can handle it. I understand the prevention of posting or linking to actual material that could get people into trouble if it suddenly popped up on their computer either at work, home or school, etc. But for simple discussion and description, I don't see any legal body coming along and slapping down Dumpshock. Which leaves personal taste of those that run the site and whether such material will drive people away from the boards. The latter is possible I suppose, but I very much doubt it. The material was very strictly contained in the thread and people are normally respectful enough not to post hideously violent sexual material in other threads so it's easy enough for someone such as myself to simply ignore that thread if I choose (which I did). That only leaves the desire of the site admins to run a "clean" site. This is very subjective and it should be noted that the US is a great deal more puritan than most of Europe. If you want to consider the greyness of basing things on your own preferences, consider that homosexual descriptions online back in Egypt could really mess your life up. Do people consider that repression acceptable in that case? (And I'm going to assume that the mods here would not). Then what is objectively different about censoring other material?

And to pick on Hyzmarca specifically, I personally find his ultra-rational take on his various depravities absolutely fascinating. (Though I'm still a fierce believer that making love with someone you care about is infinitely more fulfilling than any amount of tentacles).

There's some thought to whether some of your questions as to what is or is not acceptable is deliberately obtuse, or honestly asking for clarification. I think the best tact is to assume you mean what you say, and you honestly want some guidelines for how to handle material that falls into the 'questionable' category. Obviously, this doesn't only apply to sexual material, but violence as well, etc.

First, obviously, it's hard to make a definitive "you can do this, you can't do that" list, and pretty impractical. You asked for an opinion, so as a moderator, I'll give you mine, so that there's less a sense of 'secret police'. If you're going to be posting on questionable material, whatever the topic, remember that it's always going to be sujective. What's going to offend one person isn't goign to phase another. We've established that. Keep your discussion to the point, without going on at length on the sordid/grisly details. This applies to the subject of torture just as much as rape, sexual deviancy, etc. We've made judgement calls on threads and posts that were grisly and over the top in violence, so this is nothing new.

You are correct in that some posts make it by. This is sometimes because we simply don't see them, but most of the time, we try not to jump on things. Sometimes things go farther than we allow, but we understand that Shadowrun by it's nature is dsytopian and harsh and covers rough subject matter. That doesn't mean that just because a subject is tied to the Sixth World that it needs to be discussed in detail. So if we see a thread that discusses the most frequent contention points (sex, religion, politics) we watch it, and make sure it stays more subjective than detailed. Where things cross over with RL, they're obviously going to be more sensitive subjects. Sex is one of those.

So keep it to the point, without going into the sordid details. Dumpshock isn't the home site for torture tales or taboo fantasies to be explored. There are plenty of other sites for that. I could give you my personal list of things I think are too perverse, but reading over the "oddities" thread shows that it wouldn't be a complete list anyway, since there's things I hadn't even heard of. No big surprise there. So rather than "you can do this, you can't do that", leave out the sordid details that were the hallmark of the previous thread, as they're more what gets the thread locked than the topic in general.

As for moderators and the 'secret police', remember the purpose of moderators. Moderate- to reduce the excessiveness of; make less violent, severe, intense . As has been said, there's always going to be a certain amount of subjectiveness at work in dealing with subject matter like this, coming from things like background, religion, values, preferences, etc. As nathanross said, he's perfectly fine with tentacle porn. It's our job as moderators to establish a more even level on topics and what is an isn't acceptable. We discuss as a group what gets shut down because we all have differences of opinion, and we don't all agree. There are very few topics where we agree unanimously, and so it's left to a simple vote, and then how the issue is dealt with is taken up from there. We're not going to put it to a vote to all of DS on each issue, because it's impractical, and there's simply no way that we'd get a concise opinion. There will always be a vocal minority that thinks something is acceptable. So the final judgement is left to the moderators. If you're really that concerned, then we can require an account to have a moderator's approval before a submitted post will go up on the boards.

I know this is a long post, but this is a second thread off a topic that was already closed. Generally, we don't allow that either, following that a topic that was closed should stay closed and not immediately reopened. Like allowing a few questionable posts to slide, we do try to leave some slack and let things go a bit. That can look like inconsitancy. Really it's just that we don't want to go stomping around all over the place passing out warnings and locking threads. Believe me, most of us would rather just be able to browse the boards without having to deal with people bickering about whatever the issue of the day is. But again, people are too different for that too happen, and someone has to keep things in line.

Sorry for the long post, I help this helps clear up at least some things, or give you clarity to at least one opinion at work.

Edit: damn, that was a lot longer than I intended it to be. Sorry it that was too much rambling. It's early here.

I prefer to handle it this way in my games, too, but also realize that this pratice might even increase the need for a rules mechanic.
It's easily dismissable as juvenile, overly and ridiculously competetive ( anglophones might think about adding Schwanzvergleich to your list of loan words) and just plain silly, but without knowing the group, i wouldn't pass such judgement (i save that for the "real roleplayer" types ).

So, just in case your groups' face hits on an oversexed corporate exec and, for whatever reason, needs to know the number of net hits (really, really no pun intended...sorry) afterwards, i'd second what knasser said and expand on it by suggesting that you use one of those double attribute tests (you know, like composure tests or whatever).

Practically any attribute combination could apply, depending on personal taste and circumstances, from double charisma to strenght + constitution to even logic + reaction for screwbot rigging.
Or would that be pilot (kittyform)?

consider that violence can often be as taboo
consider this sytatement

"Violent interactions in a game should be left vague. There are some things that should be role played, but violence... no thank you. That is something that you do with your enemies. I don't want to know and don't need to know."

Violence and sex are from the same taboo area of human interaction. It happens but we feel uncomfortable talking about it, unless we are in some way abnormal.

Your statement should start with "sexual interactions in my games should be left vague," instead.

Is it the sort of thing everyone wants to role play out? Of course not.

Is it the sort of thing some people want to role play out? Yes, unarguably.

Your opinion is that such things aren't needed in a game. That's fine, but it's only your opinion. In some games I've played, things have stayed strictly PG and there wasn't a hint of sexual attraction to be found in an entire campaign. In some games I've played, we've had the stereotypical "and as the wizard goes to his room to memorize spells, the bard flirts with all the barkeeps, hee-hee" sort of nonsense and left it at that. In some, inter-party romances have been completely normal and party dynamics have shifted due to in-game relationships (that added quite substantially to the quality of the game, in the opinion of all involved). In some campaigns, you'd be lucky to squeak by with an 'R' rating if the game were made into a film, and it would be due to sexuality as much as violence.

In YOUR games, everything is vague and nothing graphic (except violence, one would assume) gets role-played out. Good for you. But don't go all puritanical and act like there's something innately wrong with games that are played differently, by different groups of people.

OH COME ON! IT'S A JOKE!


Hey now, some have sex like running the 100m others like running the marathon. Really depends now doesn't it?


Thanks fist. First off, I must say that you are right in assuming that I am deliberately obtuse, but I am also deliberately asking for clear limits. I am smart enough to know that some lines cannot be drawn, whether there is a line or not. Thank you for coming up with a, semi at least, concrete rule:

Don't go into detail.

I believe this can be handled. Thank you for your feedback.

The reason that this not the same is that Shadowrun without violence is a tad... boring IMO. Shadowrun without sex is doable. Also, I never said sex should be kept out... I said I wanted it to be kept vague. I think it would mean more and less of a porno movie. Whatever floats your boat. Have fun with it.



See my above post.




Excuse me Critias, when did I say that I wanted everybody else to play Shadowrun like I did? I don't remember, so please refresh my memory. If I implied it with my comment on sex should be kept vague, then I apologize. I prefer Shadowrun to be a game about people dealing with a bunch of corrupt corporations, the interaction between magic and technology, and the criminal exploits of those in the shadows.

Welcome. And again, I apologize to all for the long, rambling nature. It was very early and I just got off shift. Elequency is not always my strong suit, and less so when I'm half awake.

Actually, it was one of the most well-thought out moderator posts I've seen.

And I would say if I had a problem with it.

OK, so..now that we have the rules we can use...

Can people please get back to topic? The debate on if sex should or should not happen in game is something that has happened for years(there is even an RPG, Bacchanal, that makes sex its primary focus..), and is something that is up to individual GM style. I knew a GM once who had everyone roll for their characters gender, orientation, and then go through something like 100 pages of tables to determine the characters sexual kinks, fetishes, etc. I have had other GMs who did not have sex factor at all in their games, to the point where there were not even strip clubs, bunraku parlours, and ex-hooker was not even a viable part of the character background.

So, let's get back to the discussion of sexual oddities, and new kinks/fetishes in the 6th World?

To role play sex or not in shadow run should be left to the player's discretion. If the players don't feel comfortable, or are put off by the idea, then it shouldn't be implemented in the game. This is the same for most elements in a good campaign, sex or other. If your players aren't happy, it isn't much fun. That's not to say you can't smile when you kill them.

Some players, like me, aren't easily offended and are actually depraved at best.

Am I too late to make a cheap joke about how to spice up your sex life through roleplay?

As for me it is not about wether roleplaying sex at the game table is considered weird, it's just that it's completely unimportant. When I play SR, I want to break into high-security buildings, shoot stuff up, steal important research data and be doublecrossed by Mr. J. I want to be held up with the details of a sexual encounter as much as I want to roleplay waiting for the bus.

On the topic of new kinks: Well, I think we already explored it thoroughly in the last thread

It should pretty much be assumed that if you can think of it, its possible in SR with genetic engineering, upgraded tech, etc. And if you can't think of it, chances are someone else will. Sex has also been around since pretty much the beginning of SR. Even in the novels you have Twist causing problems with Ghost by hooking up with Sally, Hart luring an exec to his demise with promises of sex, etc.

I believe someone mentioned a while back that corporate execs would probably be looked down upon if they had spent 100k nuyen on a iving sex pet, but really, corporate morality has rarely ben that big of a factor in SR. Ohara, the exec that created the Uruk-hai (heh) is in a later book where he's addicted to (possibly) BTLs, and keeps twins as bedmates (and seems to have a penis implant).

So the moral probably should be, if you can think of it, its there. If you can't think of it, someone else will, and it can be created. As for the level of sex in games, it should be apparent by now that it all depends on the game. You can have it from absolutely no sex what so ever, to Tiger "Zag" Jackson doing a run and getting Rambo 20 with russian porn star Vita Reva uncut, to lesbian stripper elves fighting vampires and beyond.

How would I go about finding this hot elf sex? >.>
If you could PM me, that'd be great, I don't want to get this thread shut down again.


Also, so I actually contribute to the topic...

Sexuality in Shadowrun. Honestly, what happens when most kinks are mainstreamed? Or is that necessarily the case? Conservative megacorporations-like, say, Shiawase-might even still frown upon homosexuality. There are likely quite a few subcultures that are still really down on kinks that are nowhere near as extreme as some of the practices mentioned previously.

I would argue that it would actually be more in line with the dystopian setting that while a large percentage of the population is encouraged to go with whatever, that there is still a significant presence of people who want you to shut up and stay vanilla.

Nah, what would be dystopian would be the young boy and girl who just want to have a close, slow romantic relationship, be subjected to endless mockery and or advice from concerned peers, parents and psychologists.

How about a device that would installed to cause pain with unwanted sexual urges?

I had thought of pills that break in your mouth to check for STDs and/or drugs. If there is none then it colours the mouth red and tastes of strawberry and if there is then it tastes horrible and colours the mouth violet.

Hunh. There's this fun little Story by Bill Gibson ... there, psychotropuic conditioning is used in various ways to punish people. The main character cannot return to DC any more because he had gotten himself in trouble there and the cops had given him a Washington Moniment phobia (severe). Another character, a college student, had gotten something similar as a measure against her wasting precious studying time with having sex by her parents. That'd be much mor eapplicable in SR than complicated brain implant, a good old fashioned psychotropic IC effect ...

As for STDs, I like that Pills idea!

As for the rules on sex mentioned above, years ago, I came accross a document for SR3 covering sex rules in grweat detail. It was called, if I am not mistaken, Sex in the Shadows. I think I don't have it any more, and a quick google didn't show any hits. But there are detailed rules available *somewhere*, rules you surely can convert to SR4, if you absolutly must have them.


Actually, Shiawase's the most progressive Japanacorp, now that the Yamyams have left the country ... and Japan's current prudishness is, historically seen, an oddity rather than the rule. Traditionally, Japanese don't mind homosexuality much, so long as it's not in everyone's face.

Just in the case that it hasn't been mentioned already, there will be a significant portion of the population that has experienced sex from the perspective of the other gender using pornographic sims. A lot of people in 2070 will have experienced the body of the other gender unless they go out of their way to avoid such things, which is quite an interesting thing about the setting.

Supposedly - I read that in some book, unsure which one - about a fourth of the population doesn't hnadle that input too well. And sex scenes aren't limited to porno Sims, those just have more of them (and, likely, more energetic / athletic ones).

But yeah. Curious thought really.

Even though i have mentioned it elsewhere, it is also noteworthy that there will be a significant portion of the population that has experienced their own body to be a deficient, ugly piece of crap compared to the biosculpted, excessively modded (and carefully post-production-edited) self of the average simstar.
Which is why personal augmentation is such a growth industry.

Well, that's not too different from today, isn't it? Though propably a bit more intense.

It's a matter of scale, indeed.
But the problem got upscaled a lot, i think.
Not only because the sense of inferiority becomes more palpable when the dissatisfied consumer cannot only watch, but actually experience how pathetic he or she is, or because cosmetic mods are easier available and achieve better results, but because actual performance has become a matter of how many bucks you can put on the counter, in all aspects of life.
Just take implants like the cerebral booster- for 30.000 , a complete moron can become a veritable smartass.
Same is possible for most mental or physical attributes and in some cases with even more extreme effects.

I know that may sound promising, it does hold some great potential for actually alleviating a lot of humanitie's problems, but in the end, it leads to poor equaling decrepit.

I could see wageslaves insisting that their children have the bodies of models and will be implanting all sorts of devices so that their children conform with society. Think of giving your daughter a porsche and the biosculpt she always wanted for her sweet sixteen.

With biosculpts being such a growth industry I could see it becoming an issue with vice the problem of identifying the underaged from the legal. You could "biosculpt" yourself into having the body of a 12 year old girl or a 300lbs shaved gorilla.

It is true now. Those with more money have more options in life and if that option was a mistake more money can be poured into it to rectify it.

There's always The Joy of Awakened Sex.

Sue me! I posted a link.

Don't click it unless you want to read about ... duh ... awakened sex as it relates to Shadowrun.

There was this passage in ... I believe it was Biochips, the second Neuromancer sequel ... where one of the main characters, a simsense superstar, slotted a chip of her predecessor and wass all "damn, how could I ever replace you? Is that what I feel like for all the people out there?"

Simsense sensations are filtered, all the annoying stuff's out, little itches and pains filtered out, and everything feels just great. It's about as natural as a BMI 17 model's body. And propably has the same appeal. There're canon implants that go that way already - sensitive skin, silky skin, clean metabolism, pain editors and enhanced atriculation all could be used to come closer to the feel of such an ideal, unnatural body.


Well, seeing as how we're even in SR4 speaking about an investment of some 60.000 Nuyen, the average wage slave can't dream of affording this, any more than a Dynamit (granted, he can't have that anyway, because the devs deemed attack subs and segways more important than decent sports cars but meh ... I am digressing ...). But for upper class people, higher management, the upper 10%, that's a very believable assumption.


Yes, possibly. But changing your body that much requires severe issues with how it is - and neither 12 year olds nor shaved gorillas are SR's common beauty ideal (well, granted, shaved gorillas work for ork posers) - so these would be deviances and rather rare. But yeah, Vice in SR must be even less for the faint of heart than it's today.

Well, isn't that kind of the discussion of this thread, anyway? Though, that does raise a question: How does the bio-sculpting of a "Panner" work in SR? We know there chemical and such treatment in CP2020 that allowed it, but had to be done at a very early age(pretty much: you did not decide you were going to be a Panner, someone else did, was the impression I always got).

Admittedly, it WOULD seem easier to catch them at a young age, or use genetic tweaks to stop their physical aging and growth at 10, 11, 12, 13, whatever...if Genetech wasn't a new thing, that is.

It really makes you wonder, when you think about the closet lives of a lot of people in 2070. With SIMsense, they can experience almost any kink, tweak, or perversion in the privacy of their own heads, as often as they like. Slot a chip and take on any roll, any partner, any setting, completely guilt free (well, in many cases). With the open access to the Matrix, this sort of thing could be experimented from a much younger age, into a much older age than it would be to do physically. You don't need viagra when you're 85 because all you have to do is slot a chip. Parents don't have to worry about the "1 in 4 Teenages girls have an STD" that I read in the paper about the other day, because when theyir kids want to experiment and learn, they can DL something completely safe. Sex lives can become less about going to bars or clubs, and more of a hobby or passtime.

So how does that affect metahumanity? A lot of close couples find a sense of closeness from being intimate that could otherwise be lacking in a relationship. Would that feeling still be there if they'd been rasied on Sim-intimacy? Would the club culture we all take for granted, the proverbial meat market, even exist if all people needed was the next Plug-N-Play? Do you really need to go through all the trouble of the flesh doll and it's huge expense if you can get the download or a fraction of the cost?

Canon tells us that it's so, and certainly there's going to be people that prefer "the real thing". But as I watch my kids take more easily to video games can computers than I did, and recalling my parents watching as I did the same thing, as I watch my 6 year old boy doing things in video games that I never even thought of doing, can we really take it for granted that the youth of 2070, and those that grew up in the VR world of the 60's, will really care so much about "authentic" when sim technology and the matrix can offer them so much? Are otaku style kids really such an isolated incident?

How much different would a society be when that intimacy isn't so much needed, or the executive that sneers down his nose at his employees can go home and chip himself to become a submissive with a personafix, the bosses ork female secratary can be a troll male in the dominance roll, the janitor can use vanilla missionary style set in the old west, and they can all get together anonymously on a site and exchange downloads, all trying each other's flavors any time? How long before those closet lives and those realms of no ethical or moral limits spill over into their real lives? How many years of using a good-as-real sex slave or the catholic school girl fantasy will spill over into some middle managers real life and he tries it out for real? And would anyone really care, if they're all doing the same thing too?

Yeah, I think they would because it's one thing to be doing the nasty in VR... it's a whole different ballgame in the meat. The experiences would be "alien" because it's not the cleaned up Sim recording of "Catholic Schoolgirl Sex Slave 4".

There was a book written by Vonda McIntyre called "Starfarers." While I never completely read it, one of the characters in there inspired a character I played in a game. She was a Sense Recorder. She basicly had stuff so that she could experience something and record to sim-sense. One of the more interesting jobs I had with that character was a run for the sole purpose of recording skinny dipping in one of the lakes up in Salish territory, and I couldn't get official permission from the Salish government for it. One of my characters biggest sellers? Where I recorded a run on prototype Mitsuhama Zero Zone. Note: I did not make these BTL's with this character..they were just raw, uneditted(beyond the faces, names, etc of the rest of the team) Simsense experiences, that I would either be commissioned to make, or that I would record and sell..

Too bad you cannot do that in SR4(sim recording gear no longer exists)

There are simrigs to record simsense, cheaper even in SR4. My character in "Sink, Hollywood, Sink" has a simrig and is recording the run.

I thought Simrigs were just for playback, as there was no mention of recording in their game info?

Well, there has to still be some way to record, or no one would have anything to play back.

Simrigs record simsense (SR4, p. 46, p. 218 and p. 320). They can play back simsense recordings too, of course.

first thought, clockwork orange...

Biosculpting basically lobs together cosmetic surgery, cosmetic nanites, simple symbiotes (like that body odor modification stuff in 3rd, which essentially would be gene-modifies strands of skin bacteria producing different-smelling substances from sweat than natural skin bacteria) and simple cybernetics. The latter isn't consequetly applied, though, as breast implants apparently cost essence, whereas stuff like catgirl ears or fur in odd places, or removal of pubic hair save for certain patches, or biotattoos don't.

Lobbing all kinds of plastic and cosmetic surgery together is a good SR tradition, though, so le plus sa change, le plus c'est la meme chose (or something like that).


It isn't?


Odds are a child's body wouldn't be able to process the input from an orgasm, as the child's autonomic nervous system - where all these sensations come from, nd consequently, which has to be up to the task - just isn't. So all you'd get from that would be a severely confused child whith, possibly, some sort of nerve damage. Wouldn't stop them from trying, of course.

Besides, just because you can may not mean you want to. You can do a lot of things. You always take a ride and visit the nearest red lights district and buy yourself a transsexual whore there. Does that mean you want to?


Keep in mind that porn never strays beyond pure sex. There's no social component to porn. To sex, there is, though. Getting someone you want laid is a challenge many seek. Also, even with one-nighters, you have company even after the fuck for the most part, which is as important as the sex as such to most. Not everyone is cut out to be a loner nerd porn monger, though admittedly those are gonna love SR's insta-porn wireless matrix capabilities.

Now, there might also be Lenny Neroes, who relive their idealised past over and over again by simsnese recording, and the proverbial desperate housewife getting her quick sex fixes off simsense porn every once in a while when her husband is off to Dubai to oversee some project or another. Porn will porpably be much more mainstream than in today's culture. The difference between what's considered porn and what's considered normal entertainment will blur and society will become even more sexualised (canon says so too, just look at SotA '63 and '64's prime time shows listing and ask yoruself whether that would have any chance of being aired in that spot today).

One thing I find grossly underused in simsense is experiencing the good things in life in some sort of broadcast show - good things beyond sex, that is. Riches, fame, palaces and pristine holiday spots the ordinary wage slave cnan never dream to get into. Stuff like the "Upper 10.000" show from Neuromancer (or one of the sequel books). That'd be at least as addictive to some of the underclass as porn might be. Possibly even moreso, becuase I guess porn gets quite boring after a while.


Though there WILL definitly be an impact, I don't see Personafix beetles or BDSM practices becoming mainstream matters, simply because they're aqbout as much about hurting yourself as they are about pleasure. It takes a certain affinty to endorphine addiction to consider that fun, and that's an affinity not everyone has. It will be more common in SR's universe, but mainstream? Highly unlikely. Just as homosexuality will not stray vastly beyond 15% of the population.


No offense meant, but your character would be so dead if I was your GM. That's such an enormous offense to MCT that it will bring their whole apparatus, including their renowned combat mages, their buddies in the JIS, the Yaks and anyone they can hire down on that poor woman.


Yeap.

I think the cyberbreasts cost essence since they can change in size and shape upon command. Simple, "fixed" breast implants I fit under "cosmetic surgery", costing no essence.

Well, the character kind of DID get MCT after her...they ended up 'recruiting' her as a "Security Consultant"...if I recall, she died horribly on 3rd iteration Zero Zone testing...

I consider myself fairly Pink Mohawk , but recording the team is a sure fire way to ensure a bit of "friendly fire" in my campaigns, LA not withstanding...

You know, after spending some time in the "underneath" of the internet I met a lot of people with fantasies of girls with....guy parts. In Shadowrun that's completely possible O.o I wonder if this hidden fetish would come to life, with cyber-netic woo haas and all. O.o heh.

That's the trans part of the transhuman league, I guess ...

I'm wondering whether there're sex doll droids like in GitS. Propably, right? Otomos with Pilot 4-something and a Kamasutra 4 autosoft, maybe also a (insert appealing character type) simulation soft on top of that, and the usual analyse running so that the sexbot doesn't start strangling it's user with their own guts.

I'd assume there are. Reading through the book it makes mention that sex practices are common, so things like sexbots I can imagine, especially in Japan where they already have a program/peice of hardware that pretty much lets somebody else masturbate you over the internet. (Seriously, i've seen it)

In what used to be America I could see it quite a bit too, but I think here we'd see more old school prostitution and weird fetishs. And with the ability to stunt growth and alter the body we'd definitely see things considered immoral now, such as people pretending to be little girls and stuff. We don't do much sexual stuff in our group (usually) but I try to keep in mind that Shadowrun is just as sexual as it is violent, and most GMs leave that out. I generally don't.

Uhm, maybe I am missing something, but you have to practice sex somehow, don't you? ... or does 'practices' in English generally refer to deviant stuff?


Tried it? Not to offend, but because I seriously cannot see how that could work for anyone. It doesn't smell human, doesn't feel human, doesn't look and sound human, doesn't act like a human ... porn images at least (usually) look human.

Masturbauting over porn, okay, but use a machine to wank? Hello? Well how nerdy CAN you be? Okay, I know that there're those odd people who seel sexually attracted to (and fall in love with) oddest stuff, like train engines, cars, and buildings, but ... I dunno. A wank machine. Sheesh. What IS this world coming to. Next, we'll see people intubating voluntarily to not have to breate themselves or something.