I take it you have played with something similar then?

i have and it worked very well..

So stingray anything you would change just with the cyberware.

Thank You,
Cyberjocky

I just thought of something.

You say you're playing the stealth character.
But you weigh something like 800 pounds and glow like a christmas tree.

I'm not sure how that makes you a steatlh character.
and you're paying a rediculous amount for that 7 Intuition, and I'm not sure it gets you that much.

In what way does the character glow? Stands out from a crowd, sure, but doesn't actually glow. How much you stand out from the norm doesn't really matter if you're sneaking into a place where no one is supposed to see you anyway.

I was wondering about the weight but I couldn't find a list that actually says how much a cyber limb weighs.
I only glow to sensors which could probably be turned off by my teams hacker.

Thank you,
Cyberjocky

I don't know about anything exact, but there is a swimming penalty for cyberlimbs as I recall, which means they are heavier than natural limbs.

Generally quite a bit - I do recall some fluff from 3rd that suggested that a kitted-out street sam with mods like the ones you proposed can run up into Troll weight territory. I would assume that the higher the grade, the lighter the equipment.

After some digging I'm thinking some bioware might give me a larger boost in the direction I am wanting.

Thank you,
Cyberjocky

Full body Deltaware?

Jebus.

Most SR campaigns I've seen, even just getting Betaware is a huge deal. Like, "Hey, you just saved an entire city from being turned into bug spirits! Here's a couple pieces of Betaware. Oh, and if you ever mention you were involved in this incident, we'll kill you all."

You might see one piece of Deltaware. Ever. In the life of the entire campaign.



-karma

Cyberlimbs are a trap, anyhow. You can get nearly everything you might want out of a cyberlimb by using other stuff instead. Strength and Agility from Muscle Replacement/Augmentation/Toner. Body from Dermal armor and skeletal reinforcement. And so on.

The ONLY thing that Cyberlimbs get you, that nothing else will, is Cyberarmor. And you can already get stupidly high armor ratings with just wearing regular armor.




-karma

Thanks for the help everyone im leaning towards this at Chargen now

Base / With Enhancements
Bod 4 / 8
Agi 4 / 6
Rct 3 / 7
Str 4 / 6
Cha 1 / 1
Int 6 / 6
Log 3 / 5
Will 1 / 1

Enhancments
- Bone Density (Rating 4)
- Muscle Toner (Rating 2) plans to get rating 4 later
- Reaction Enhancer (Rating 2) plans to get rating 3 later
- Wired Reflexes (Rating 2)
- Muscle Augmentation (Rating 2) plans to get rating 4 later
- Cerebral Booster (Rating 2) plans to get rating 3 later

- Additionally want to try to get a Suprathyroid

The only positive quality I have found I need so far is Type O System.

but at creation the enhancements should cost 182,000
Bioware essence cost 2.4 which becomes 1.2 due to quality and then .6 due to being my second highest
Cyberware essence cost 3.6

Thank you,
Cyberjocky

* edited to clean up

What? Really? no.

No essence nanohives at 2 capacity. Gyromounts. Enhancements of +1 to a physical stat for 200Y. MADscanners and Radar sensors that have(stupidly) less Restrictedness than their accessory counterparts. Autoinjectors that have no essence or capacity costs. In terms of minmaxing essence loss and cost, agility 9 cyberhands are excellent.

Its not just that you *can potentially* get equivalent bonuses through other augmentations, its that cyberlimbs do so very cheaply, and very effectively.

What do the Agility 9 hands do? I wouldn't allow that to count for Firearms, for example.

Cyberlimbs can do a couple things effectively, and it's usually just via capacity. I like to get hands or lower legs in some situations. As a general rule, though, they're not a *great* idea, esp. full limbs.

Okay, granted, Cyberarms makes some stuff cheaper/easier to get.

But most of what you just listed can be done with just a single partial cyberlimb.

I was more saying that replacing most of your body with cyberlimbs/parts to become Super Wired Dude is just inefficient. Okay, get a single partial cyberlimb. Then get muscle mods, skeletal mods, etc. instead of a bunch of other cyberlimbs.



-karma

Why do you hardmax INT? For only one die less you would get 25 addittional BP for other good stuff, REA 5 for example.
WIL 1??? I hope no one casts a spell at you. Or you never see anything scary (cf. Composure Test)

What do you need the Cerebral Booster for? Do you plan to take many skills linked to LOG?

Type O System only works for Basic Bioware. The Cerebral Booster is Cultured Bioware. Since Bioware Essence cost generally is quite low I don't think the quality is worth the 30 BP. If money permits, I'd prefer Restricted Gear for Muscle Toner 4, Muscle Augmentation 4 and/or Suprathyroid Gland

Agility 9 cyberhands are excellent for one-handed weapons, such as machine pistols. And yeah - lower limbs are rather cost effective compared to just hands/feet or full limbs.

Yeah if you can sucker your GM to letting you use just your hands stat.

Your GM would have to be quite a sucker.

Agreed, a single partial limb can be fun if you want some Capacity items. For the hell of it, my last character had those hydraulic Jump jacks on partial legs, but that was basically a lark.

Rule no1: Kill them before they kill you.
Rule n02: Only the best survive.
Rule n03: Don't wait to be the best tomorrow, be the best today.

Wasn't that
Rule 1: Watch your back.
Rule 2: Shoot straight.
Rule 3: Save ammo.
Rule 4: Never ever deal with a dragon.
?

No. Its never CUT a deal with a dragon. Deals with dragons can be quite lucrative, if you know your place and your boundaries.

I have a habit of creating the Bionic Commando every time I have a character with a cyberarm.

Bionic Commando?

It makes more sense that way, but I'm pretty sure I quoted it correctly from the Secrets of Power Trilogy. Can't check though, since I don't have the books anymore.

Bionic Commando. I'll throw in a miniwelder, shock palm, and grappling hook to the arm, and if I've got capacity left a cyberarm gun slide and a gyromount.

Yeah that is somethink i agree they'r good for, like that falling adept i build 2 lower legs with rating 6 hydraulic jack and freefall 4, thats 20m of from falling damage when shecking for falling damage and she has 30 to resist that so that other 10m she should survie without damage.
Beign able to jump down from the roof of 8 floor building without having to worry about damage adds some new tacticall options, most corp security guys arent gonna follow if you jump out of eight floor window.

The reason for Type 0 System is because if I understand it right if I get 8 essence worth of basic bioware and 3.9 in cyberware from wired reflexes 2 and reaction enhancer 3 given the rules of on calculating essence loss I will only use up 5.95 essence. the bioware would drop to 4 essence loss due to type 0 system and cyberware would drop to 1.95 due to being second highest. I know some bioware is excluding from that but that just requires me to watch that part of it but this is just a rough example. This was all done with standard wares.

Logic is boosted for busting maglocks if im the only one able to at the time since they are Hardware + Logic. Since my niche in the group is gaining access to places.

I could cover my Willpower im still fleshing out my character.

Again im not using the build in my first post as I saw a poster think the two were the same build.


Thank you,
Cyberjocky

Cyberlimbs as mentioned have spiffy things like essence free implants (comlinks, nanohives, biomonitors, etc), gyromounts, and cyberholsters.

I run a troll in my current game with two custom cyber arms, and cyber holsters in each. Pistol held in the left, and a modified holster for 5 ammo clips in the right. I'm *never* without my weapon.

Back on topic, glad to see you went the bioware route instead. It's a much more subtle way of being augmented, and as you can see, much more essence friendly. I'd still recommend knocking down your Intuition to 5, and boosting something else instead. Those 25 points are usually better spent elsewhere, and that 1 die isn't going to make that much of a difference in game.

I'm never without my weapons in normal holsters, but whatever's cool and fun for you.

Yeah, Doc, it's nice to have a bunch of little widgets. The thing is, esp. with SR4, there are very few items that you can't just get as accessories and velcro to your chest instead. Some of those few things are cool, though.

Oh, he's got a normal holstered pistol as well. But for those times when we're forced to disarm for a meet or an undercover op or whatever, having that backup if/when the drek hits the fan is a necessity.

But really, his primary weapon is a modified Ares Stoner MMG called Bubba.

Gunrunners should be called Bubba not MMGs

Interesting. The german version of the saying is translated to "Never cut a deal with a dragon"...

If your forced to disarm for a meet, they most likely have scanners at the door and the bouncer tells you to hand over the hidden gun as well.

SR4A has that quote in the beginning as
"Watch your back.
Shoot straight.
Conserve ammo.
And never, ever, cut a deal with a dragon"

Actually, a partial Ceramic Plasteel 1 modded weapon (-2 mad) in a cyberarm slide (threshold 4 perception to spot) is a pretty easy way to sneak stuff past security. Even a cyberware scanner, with a ton of bonus dice for having multiple implants, isn't likely to get 4 hits. Ultrawideband radar, which can work like a cyberware scanner, is just as unlikely to yahtzee on you.

Cyberware scanner needs 1 hit to detect weapons.

Does a cyberware scanner even detect normal i.e. not implanted weapons?

Yes, its just an other name for millimeter wave detection systems.

I read the description now, but what energy does a turned off gun emit?

Millimeter wave radar doesn't detect energy.

Think of it as x-ray vision.



-np

I agree with that statement but the BBB never says that the scanner is mm wave RADAR:
This means that unlike RADAR it does not emit radiation and detects the reflection of that radiation, it only detects radiation form other sources
It goes on that the scanner can identify items by its shape, no matter whether the item emits or not. Weird.

Dakka read the last paragraph of this, about passive imaging

Would a metal gun in a metal cyberlimb give much contrast? Can mm waves even penetrate metal?

Yo Cyberjocky.

I'm going to assume you've got Augmentation, yeah?

So, on that note, let me say what I say to everyone who wants to build a cybermonster.
Move-by-Wire.
Move-by-Wire. Move-by-Wire. Move-by-Wire.

Skillsofts are still cheaper than real skills. If you need Hardware skill, slot a chip and download it. True of most any technical skill. Your barrier to excellence is your 200,000¥ money cap, not your Essence. Leave Essence room for the more expansive and useful bonuses from Geneware and Nanoware. Payoffs turn to upgrades real quick when you don't have to upgrade your existing ware just to move up in the world.

As to nano, read up on it. It's the best there is for economy. Getting a hive in a cyberhand/foot will cost you .25 essence (for the limb) and earn you things like +3 Logic and +3 Intuition for 15,000¥ a piece (plus hive and limb costs.)

Radar's another boss thing for a sneaker to have. Eyes thorough walls. Drop it in your hand/foot. Magical.

Just to avoid any missunderstanding, those are bonuses to dice pools when using skills linked to logic and intuitio , not actual attribute bonuses.

Yeah, which is actually better in a lot of cases since it goes beyond the Attribute max. Not helpful for initiative, and the bonuses don't apply to combat or high stress stuff, but if you need to crack a door lock, it'll help just fine.

Do not get implanted radar. Get the accessory version, silly.

The skillwire looks good may end up getting one to raise a skill.

I'm not sure about the nano when I read in the book that one needed my character to foucs without distractions and other only worked if I wasnt doing anything stressful.... I think the GM may claim breaking and entering is stressful.

I've adjusted alot of stuff on my guy and right now I'm getting equipment I may post it to get any insight on if I am missing any essentials.

Just incase anyone is wondering the GM gave us a few weeks to sit down to figure out how our team will work together and what our characters will do just send him an e-mail of what they look like so he can make stuff more appropiately.

Thank You,
Cyberjocky

Wired skills replace real ones. Raising does not work.

I meant as in raising one from zero..... but if replacing it is the proper symantic then I guess I will use it to get rid of a zero to replace with a higher number.

Thank You,
Cyberjocky

*edit to make more precise.

Attributes Base / Augmentated

Body 4 / 9
Agility 1 / 4
Reaction 1 / 6
Strength 1 / 4
Charisma 5 / 5
Intuition 5 / 5
Logic 5 / 7
Willpower 5 / 5

BP Cost= 190

May put my last point into Edge

Augmentations
- Bone Density Augmentation (Rating 4) +4 Body 80,000 -1.2 essence Basic Bioware
- Muscle Toner (Rating 2) +2 Agility 16,000 -0.4 essence Basic Bioware
- Reaction Enhancer (Rating 2) +2 Reaction 20,000 -0.6 essence Cyberware
- Wired Reflexes (Rating 2) +2 Reaction +2 Initiative Passes 32,000 -2.0 essence Cyberware
- Muscle Augmentation (Rating 2) +2 Strength 14,000 -0.4 essence Basic Bioware
- Cerebral booster (Rating 2) +2 Logic 20,000 -0.4 essence Cultured Bioware
- Suprathyroid +1 Body, Agility, Reaction, Strength 45,000 -0.7 Basic Bioware (Restricted Gear)

Will later Upgrade the Muscle Toner, Muscle Augmentation and Cerebral Booster to max ratings.

Total 227,000
BP Equivalent = 45.4
Basic Bioware Essence= -1.35 (Type O System)
Cultured Bioware Essence= -0.7
Cyberware Essence= -3.6

Total Bioware= - 2.05 (will be halved to 1.025 due to be my second highest essence cost source)
Total Cyberware= -3.6
Total Essence Cost= -4.625

Is an Adrenal Gland Rating 3 worth getting for after creation?

Is this solid enough stat wise?

Still working on rest of equipment and skills which is skillwire is not up there.