Oh, I see what you meant. Sorry, I misread you as saying 'BTLs only come on chips'. Oops!

Trodes = datajack....

More 4e fluff rape.

One of the frequent posters in the Shadowlands of the books is a 14 year old corp kid that now runs the shadows. She's got a datajack and skillsofts installed already. They mention them once or twice an once where she slotted a surgery one and took a bullet out of someone or an implant or something. I forget which book it was in. I read them all pretty close together but it's in there.

So to answer the original poster, 13 doesn't seem too young. They're not the sort of thing that's going to move alot with growth. You might have to have it adjusted every now and then but "upkeep' for cyberware is built into the game now too.

Considering people go down to the mall on their lunch hours, have perfectly good meat eyes scooped out and cyber eyes installed then go back to work for the rest of the day. Implantation of cyberware isn't what it once was. Augmentation states that all sorts of body augmentations are main stream now and some are a means of fashion. It's not strange in the least for teens to want such.

14 for a born ork is 21. But assumign any other "race" it dose show that implantation at younger ages is perfectly doable if maybe a bit more expencive with replacements and such.

I can see a few non fashion related reasons for a 12/13 year old girl to want a Datajack.
1) Built in memory to store her diary, pictures, etc where mommy could never find them.
2) Passing notes is so last century, just plug in one end of a fiberoptic cable, and have your friend plug in the other end, and you can have a completely silent conversation that the teacher can never make you stand up and read to the class.
3) Big test and you were up all night talking about boys, or having a pillow fight, or whatever it is 12 year old girls do all night? Plug in a Knowsoft, or Datasoft before you get to class.

And a couple reasons the parents might like it.
1) Tutorsofts, plugged in all the time so no excuses about not having time to study.
2) Mapsofts, so she'll never get lost.

If going around showing off the datajack would get weird looks or something, couldn't you get a removable plug/covering made of the same faux flesh that can be used cover cyber limbs to hide the datajack?

Lets at to this. By RAW datajack even have wireless though short range signal 0 DIN for a comlink no wires. You can even skinlink them to anchor a PAN to communicate to another persons skinlinked datajack mental by just touch. Also datajacks are so normal in society as they have been vital for computer use up to quite recently I can't see them being seen as a bad thing buy any bar some one against all cyber.

I just want to mention, again, that trodes can do all of that.

I'm definitely not arguing that the datajack would have some kind of particular stigma. I'm just saying, 'why bother?'; I think the teen would see trodes as more desirable.

ANNOUNCER: Poor little Debbie didn't have time to pick up her commlink and call for help when she was grabbed off the street by go-gangers.

Sad music plays while we flash images from the scene of her brutal murder, and then images of her family crying at her funeral.

ANNOUNCER: She might be alive today if only she'd had a direct neural interface to a Transys Avalon commlink, the fastest commlink on the market, with the best connectivity of all models tested by five independent consumer advisory groups. Transys Avalon, the only commlink built from the ground up to take advantage of Novatech Navi ™. Transys Avalon: don't let your daughter get raped by orks.

Or just have the datajack implanted at the base of her spine, so the cable to her hip little commlink isn't visible.

Cheers, -- N

Nifft your math SPU is acting up again. Please go get it checked out.

I don't think a removable headband is quite as secure a hiding spot for a diary.

And could you give me a page reference for where you see trodes doing all the things a datajack does?
The only description of trodes I can find (in SR4A) seems to be.

>.> Actually they've proven that the vacuum tubes do differ from more modern speakers, and produce pleasent feelings in the listener, vinyl is superior in that it doesn't cut sounds out of the upper and lower registers of the music (not everyone can hear that, I can.) ..I don't know about the cables, but the other two examples really -are- superior.


Obviously people can enjoy music, and feel they're not missing out on anything by not using those things, so for the majority of users its ~fine~, especially if they don't have very sensitive hearing.

Can be the same with Trodes vs Datajack.. The Datajack -is- superior, but the differences in quality are not such that it actually impacts every day use, and some people either can't tell, or don't care.


Also I'm with Whipstitch, Kids are -stupid- about body mods, and they'll want to get whatever mods the folks they think are 'cool' have, and most older folks have a datajack. (I got my first tat two days after my 18th, but my ears were pierced .. a multitude of times between the age six and then, with moms full blessing [my older cousin had a lot of ink and metal ])

No, vinyl degrades and has its own compression issues. Maybe vinyl beats MP3s, but that's not what I was comparing it to. Vacuum tubes do have a smoother curve, but they're also expensive and fragile. You're right, though: I was mixing my analogies there. Tubes are worse because of practical concerns, vinyl is worse (than digital) because of actual quality.

Like I told Whipstitch, I agree. Kids do act like that. But, kids don't get crappy old phones because their parents have them, or ThinkPads because dad's got one for work. They get the new hotness.

Kids also do shit to piss their parents off, and nothing says an angry parent like unauthorized augmentations, lol.

Yes, but: "My character is very pro-cyberware and really has no problem with this".

Heh, I was mostly comparing them to MP3s, myself, which drive me crazy (and I do find I prefer the sound of well kept vinyl, though yes, the scratches and skipping and augh...but I -still- have some of the ones I was given as a child to listen to, in good condition soo...). You're right about the upkeep on the vaccum tubes, but I think its worth it, myself. (So I guess I'm one of those morons ).

To me it depends on the environment the kid was raised in, honestly, not every tweeny wants 'the new hotness', when I was younger I spent -all- my money to get paper books. To me it depends on what the kids actual interests are, and what kinds of things her parents and social group is actual into. (And yes there is a huge difference between social circles in what they'll want, or have you forgotten being that age?)

Again, yes, but I'm specifically focusing on consumer electronics, see? It's different from clothes, piercings, books. In general, 12-year-olds don't aspire to their parents' version of the Walkman, etc. I absolutely agree (and have repeatedly stated) that there are multiple valid options (because kids are crazy), but I feel like the historical evidence of this specific category of item for this particular age (and gender) has a 'new hotness' bias.

I donno, I see it as maybe something that'd have a class bias going on, like kids would want the datajack because more expensive and its a permanent alteration so its ~edgy~, thus better than the cheep disposable stuff (trodes)

That's possible. On the other hand, I'm certain that luxury versions of the gear listing trodes do exist. All segments of the market exist, but the book doesn't often show us that. It could well go the other way: getting a datajack is something for wageslaves, so it's unfashionable. Give it ten years, and then it'll be fashionable *because* it used to be unfashionable, though. It really is a toss-up when you start thinking about tastes and trends.

I know we've gone way (well, a little) off-topic. Sorry, OP. I thought (Dumori?) had the best point: there's enough nano-craziness to fix things if the kid 'grows out of it', and it's not like it's a big deal to remove/replace the old one for a new one anyway. As for middle-class, it seems like cyberware is certainly a normal part of their wageslave life mode (whether or not a teen would *prefer* it).

I agree I have very sensitive hearing but can't afford the good stuff so I just try and see every band I liek live at least once so I can at least feel it as close to real as I can.

Make if this what you want, but in the novel Burning Bright at the end of the opening chapter in a discussion between Main character and his ex-wife there little 8 yr old human girl wants a datajack, and he figures that his wife will get it for her on the next X-mas. This is a novel of course, but it does give some incite into the life of the times (that was 2055)

For once this is a point we can safely say novel schmovle it's not contering any fluff or crunch if any thing it renforcing it. I mean cyber has always been a bit part of SR and datajacks the most need item of cyber all the way up to matrix 2.0 and even then its not with out uses as already stated. Also the a comlink is better than a datajack line some one was toting is inrelivent comlinks are more perveliant that mobile phones in 207X even the begger on the street will likely have a bargen bucket second hand one. Its like ask if your 13 year old child would have a phone or not. Implanting one is more dicey but even then it's not too bad bar prciy and inconvenient if you want to keep up with SOTA something not ruled but we can assume that while big hardware advancements might be slower in 2070 they'll still happen now and then on the fluff side.

If the child has a 95% likelthood of goblinizing, I think most implants would be strongly advised against because of the massive changes in body size, bone structure, muscle mass and metabolism that happens during the process.