So... Shifters/Vampires/etc are legal? Huh, first rumours of Techno-pets and now TECHNO-DRAGON!
The world will never be the same.

Ok, yes, this is insane, and no doubt errata'd/explained more clearly elsewhere, but the Trait description and the Technomancer section both say nothing about having a Magic score preventing entry. It could almost, almost make sense if they made a decision on if Resonance was/was not a breed of Magic.
But yeah, there it is. Point me to the rules banning this and put my mind at rest, so I can continue choose between a Shifter-rigger or Dronomancer build for my crazy single-drone assassin living in a bunker under the desert, with a 'body' in each major city of the world. Because if this is legal...I can take my cake, and not just simply eat it, but gnaw onwards through the bake-ways of the planet until all the cakiness in the world cowers beneath my icing-smeared grasp.

Sorry, overtired and m'thoughts are going a little crazy; that was supposed to say 'The last thing preventing total Technomancer dominance is gone.'

Runner's Companion p.88

Qualities
Shapeshifters can take every quality they qualify for except
those that grant Resonance.

EDIT: Dragon April Fools PC rules state there are no known dracoform technomancers
RC p. 76 says Drakes can't be TMs. p. 79 says Infected can't either. Nor can AIs(p.89) or Free Spirits(p.93)
It isn't strictly forbidden for critters, but the Uneducated Quality is going to make it difficult.

and for Drakes:
RC p76

Characters with any of the Infected qualities, any quality
that grants Resonance, and non-metahuman characters may not
take this quality. The Drake quality is also incompatible with the
Latent Dracomorphosis quality.

That's for drakes, not shifters.

How about:



And:

We not only had to kill this thought, but salt the earth so nothing would grow again.

Oh thank god. I'm already wondering if Technomacer brain-hacking is really that far off, considering the potential of unlimited-service Resonancex2 Sprites.

I think the rules support a view that these are incompatible backward and forward through time, even: if you ever had a Magic rating, you can never have Resonance, and vice versa.

There already is brain hacking. It's called Manipulation spells.
And who is this GM giving you unlimited service sprites? We need to go have a talk outside.

Brain-hacking ruins ShadowRun.

Simply because "hacking that guy's cyber" turns from the "worst idea to do in combat ever" into "the best idea to do in combat ever." Because you can hack anyone, regardless of cyber, including the mage, and turn them into a meat puppet. Without the requisite "stirrup" hardware. And you can make the mage cast spells.

Does Brain-Hacking mean an AI can possess Magical active people?

AIs can't possess people. It's not like that. You'd have to look up Frank's rules on hacking to see how far he let "brain hacking" go.

Yeah, i tried that once . . i freely admit that i do not understand these rules all that much i'm afraid ^^#

Check Running Wild, page 205.

So if you've ever expressed on one side (such as for critters, sapient or otherwise, or metahumans), you can never express the other side.

Clear.

So what happens when a Technomancer gets hit with the "let me bite my lip, then spit you in the mouth and open wounds" attack some feral ghoul might unleash on him?

Another interesting possibility: what happens if you'd give a sapient critter any ammount of deltaware gene therapy while in utero, thereby preventing it from ever being born with Magic?

First case he loses his technomantic abilities.
second case, it's still born.

Its worth noting that these rules CAN be used to make techno-critters, just by a very roundabout, loopholey method.

Remember the pixie-tm threads?

Burnout a your magic, THEN emerge.

And yes, its quite silly.

And you lose the best things about a pixie.
free flight and concealment.

Udoshi--As Draco pointed out with my quote, that loophole was specifically closed in Running Wild. It would be possible to discuss with your GM having a Pixie who never was born with Magic, and instead came with Resonance. This would lose all of the Paranormal critter abilities, and possibly be substituted with Emergent powers. But then, you're playing a 12-18" tall critter who resembles a pixie in form but not function.

Just WHY they felt the need to close that so called loop hole is beyond me . . it was allready impossible to combinertron magic and emergence due to needing the burnout before the emergence . .

That whole page was the end result of several discussions and unanswered questions amongst freelancers and fans. It was meant to provide clarity where the answer had been a little foggy before.

Indeed it was, hence my question about TMs and Ghouls.

My question about in utero (or even in vitro, for Gene Therapy) ware is aimed at the same thing as well, of course. Though more along a philosophical bent. If the fetus is not a separate living entity, it has no attributes of its own, and thus is born without Magic, if it's augmented before birth. Would this make a TM critter possible?

Also:

Is a Pixie's flight actually described as magic? It has wings. (ridiculously small as any flying humanoid's wings are bound to be) Other than that, it's a normal, independant mode of movement, with a separate Physical Active skill to use it better.

It's as magical as a dragons flight.

There's two catches at least:And to help answer Mardrax's question:There are similar lines for HMHVV I and HMHVV II about Resonance and Magic as well (essentially all the same). So it is possible to Emerge as a TM at the start of your life, and then flip around to becoming a magician, but you become a bane to society in general as a side effect.

Ooh! Fantastic. Score two for running wild.

I like how it took that book to fix Enhanced Senses to usefulness, too.

Thanks!

No magic means it's not a pixie.

Good point, Spellbinder: Infection specifically overrides. I was talking more 'mage burns out and decides he's a technomancer' (which is already doubly impossible because burnout gives you Magic 0, and you couldn't also get the Technomancer quality later).

No worries there. Figured and understood that part, that path of the burnout won't let you gain extra abilities of the other side. Just helping make sure that it's known HMHVV is an exception in one direction, where a TM could potentially become a magician (and have the potential to go insane from a rather radical switch).

Which another method of crossing from technomancer to magician came to mind, and I looked into it just to make sure. Augmentation, page 57 under "Dual Nature" for being a cyberzombie. The results are pretty much the same, you loose all Resonance and technomancer abilities and have a starting Magic of 1. But then you're going to have many of the same social issues as being HMHVV infected.

I think there is still a way to have some magic and yet may have technomancer abilities. AFB right now, so I have to go home to make sure the Is are dotted and Ts are crossed.

Definitely not. If there's some error in the rules, that'd be all it would be.

I do not do errors. If I can find a way, it is RAW and that'd be all it would be. If the writers are not happy with it, then they can change it in the next printing.

They're called loopholes, and they're errors. Do whatever you want.

The rules have no errors unless the writers state so. And until the writers state so, there are no loopholes.

They're the ones who put the errors there in the first place, so why trust them? The books are unequivocal, however, on the total fundamental incompatibility of Magic and Resonance. In fact, there *was* a potential loophole (as mentioned above) and they specifically closed it (again, above).

As a matter of fact I would let it fly without second thought.
I would only prohibit the combination of adept/mage with technomancer.

You can house rule literally anything you want, however completely wrong it might be. We're talking about the rules.

Well, the rules are quite clear on this one. No combination of magic and ressonance is allowed. Even if you burn out magic you are still unable to emerge.

But what if you had Magic but did not burn out, could you not emerge?


Which is why I trust them to put in more of such possible rules interactions.

If you had magic, you can't emerge. The only way to get otaku abilities and have a magic score is to be Leonardo, the Immortal Elf.

Precedent!

Can you give me a quote that specifically addresses this?

Bishop already did. Running Wild spells it out pretty clearly.

No, it did not.

Even if we accept that a metahuman can be refered to a critter for the purposes of this quote, it does not address whether or not/what happens when someone who is normally Emergent gains access to Paranormal powers without gaining a Magic attribute.

How would that work in the first place?
Well, smoking the regeneration drug, maybe endowment from a spirit . .
But still, you don't get to keep your cake and eat it too in these cases . .

Yeah, I'm with Stahlseele on this one, in that I'm a bit confused which scenario you are referencing.

In what way is this mage losing his Magic without burning out(working under the presumption they aren't synonyms); and which critter abilities are this Technomancer gaining that do not incur a Magic attribute?

Which is one of the cases what I was refering to.

The answer to your first question would be Tempo. The second Stahlsteele has already stated one case.

Isn't there a drug that gives Astral Perception as well? Or was that just for adepts? AFB atm.

Ghost Cartels p. 60
Technomancers who take tempo benefit from the drug’s empathic enhancing abilities and are subject to its addictive effects, but never quite manage to access astral
space

p.135
A spirit cannot access Resonance through possessing a technomancer. Since technomancers are immune to the effects and addicting properties of tempo, however, this is unlikely to crop up.

If you are, however, suggesting that losing one's Magic through Tempo doesn't constitute a burn out, I might point out that a tempo addict is referred to as a burnout in GC.

Leonardo is European, therefore he's a Civil Law elf and can't set precedents

What if a Latent Technomancer takes Tempo?

The spirit cannot access Resonance. But can a technomancer not gain critter powers through Endowment?

If the character is not addicted to Tempo, is he still a Tempo addict?

Aren't most critter powers kinda dependent on the magic attribute anyway?
So even if you have the power, you do not have the attribute to use it with?