hurray!?

The site of the future capital of the Aztec Empire was chosen when the Mexica high priest was told by the god Huitzilopochtli to look for an eagle holding a serpent and perched on a cactus. That this sign was found on a highly defensible island in the middle of soon-to-be-conquered peoples sitting on incredibly fertile land could be mere coincidence.

Just to give an example that might help. CZ's are 'things' not places but the magic around them creates astral hazing-a moveable object capable of affecting the magical environment.

OH As I was writing htis I just had a thought. powerful religous items 'clenase' the astral hazing. hmmm. lots of potential for runs there. Corps that fail to understand faith just see this as product.

miricales may have been mana spikes OR like the IE's the Saints/prophets may have been so powerful that they could do magic even in a limited mana period, meaning their elements in a period were mana is common...wow.

See...that's the fun of the game. It's what keeps me playing after 20 years! The material is still as fresh as the day i first picked it up!

Imagine stealing the Shroud of Turine and using it for Taliscrafting, should be pretty neat stuff when you consider the millions of people focusing all there believe and hope on it.

Assuming it isn't already a potent artifact

If you have a group that wouldn't be too offended by it: Plot Idea Team is hired by an organization within The Church to investigate an entity that claims to be Jesus Christ but in fact turns out to be (Pick One an Immortal Elf, Free Spirit, Earthdawn Horror, Construct, or Great Dragon in Human Guise)

Imagine the hit squad that the Catholic Church would send after you.

SpecOps Monks trained just for battle and making wine for special occasions within the Church, with a vow of silence. And are possibly adepts and magicians in the Christian Tradition.

And that's just their own team. The ones they'd hire... Oh yeah. Count the days you got left, and my God have mercy upon you, for they certainly will not.

I've always pictured old angry nuns would be the ones to show up, yet be far more horrifying...

The scariest thing I threw at the group was a Nun that summoned a bunch of watcher spirits, and a Spirit of Man in the form of Jesus on the Crucifix.

Jesus got off his cross, dragged it up to the group doing no good, and used it to beat five kinds of holy hell out of them.

The Female Elf Jailbait Bio-Ninja jumpkicked and broke a nun's neck on the way out.

Adepts with weapon focus rulers?

Here's a thought. We know the RCC has artifacts and more importantly knowledge from the 4th world thanks to the Vigilia Evangelica. We also know that relics (especially those of saints) were prepared according to rituals of the church. So what if those "rituals" were in fact Arcana methods for the production of foci/artifacts? Yes they were done in a low mana cycle but the worship focused at the churches and cathedrals where the rituals were carried out could have been just enough to allow the items to "take" but not exhibit powers. Fast forward to 2072 and suddenly these items start exhibiting all sorts of abilities.

In conjunction with that it was also mentioned that allot of these "relics" if nothing else could be telesma. If that is true I was wondering about the catacombs under Paris as the skeletons there were dismembered and stacked according to the Roman Catholic Church rituals that could easily be twisted for Shadowrun. Indeed the bones were used to build a place of worship in the catacombs which is (I believe) still used today. I may be wrong on that as it has been eight years sense my last visit. On top of that all the bones were consecrated when they were moved to the catacombs. So just saying Paris could be sitting on the largest load of Telesma outside of Amazonia.

I'll just leave this here.

Right where it started in my mind.

The idea of the sort of Church recovery team can be seen in one of the Harry Dresden books- Death Masks- where the shroud has been stolen and Harry is hired to find it if it shows in Chicago, and when it does there are other teams looking to retake it since it's now out from under the chruch's defenses. A great SR cross/double cross.


Sister Mary-Elephant, a 60 year old virgin in an itchy woolen habbit.- and guys i went to Catholic School, I'd rather face the vampire CZ with a sliver gun

Oh dear goodness. One of my Catholic schools had this big field that you were never EVER supposed to walk on, right in front of the convent. I swear to this day I saw the glint off The Sniper Nun's scope.

Only place I ever got the strap was in a Catholic school. I can't say whether the Devil has been beaten out of me.

It took me less than a week to get expelled from Catholic School.

I still can't figure out if my Stepfather was proud of me or pissed off.

After serving my whole life in Catholic school, let me tell you: Nothing will drive faith out of you faster.

Oh, I'm well aware. My Stepfather had to go to a French-Catholic school.

We were amazed on the few occasions he went onto holy ground (Weddings and baptisms) that he didn't burst into flames.

It took 3 years in elementary school for me.

Actually, Catholic schools are good at brainwashing. I went to one for 12 years. They never taught critical thinking skills. I had to learn 'em after I graduated. Even using them I still catch myself, 22 years later, thinking "Catholic thoughts" at times. Very frustrating.

Can't seem to change your mind?

Well, on the surface I think I have. Then I hear somethig in the news, let's say, perhaps about euthenasia and a "terminal success" and I think, "Uh oh... mortal sin." Then I think, "Why did I just think that? I'm not Catholic and haven't really ever been." It's like it has become an instinct that I try and fight past if I find it to be harmful or negative to me.

Funny, I got seven years of good Catholic education, and I think I ended up with too many 'critical thinking' skills for my own good (including reaching the sort of awkward questions that make you wonder why you're going to church).

Still, just about the best education I could've gotten without some MAJOR outside help.

It's also interesting to note how many 'Catholic' universities are around here (some of which aren't Catholic any more). Georgetown and Catholic University are the big two. The RCC does seem to have a thing for education.

Southerner here. Folks of Catholic persuasion are a teensy scrap of the population, and Jewish folks are almost non-existant. Both seem to have some interesting schoolastic approaches, from Rabbinical studies to the Jesuits, but a downside in some other areas... like most things in life, you get positives, you get negatives.

Shadowrun as a whole has always been a bit gunshy in terms of religion. It pretty much *has* to come up, here or there, but it rarely gets fixated on.

Hrm.

Might be an idea for a future PDF-styled book, maybe. Faith in the 6th world, with a breakdown of major religions and how they handle things. It could step on many a toe, but it could also turn up rather keen. Goodness knows that there're some interesting ideas that have come together just in this thread, and I'm sure that there're plenty more out there as well.

Islamics learned that declaring holy war on all magical creatures is a bad idea...

Well, more the Iranians in that situation... recall that the Middle East isn't the largest section of Muslims, just as neither the US nor Europe is the seat of the majority of Christians. (Muslims' largest populations are in SE Asia, especially Indonesia and India, fo rinstance, while the most populus Christian countries are in Africa, then South America.) ... and in Shadowrun, the Pope took a hard line against the Awakened for a short while as well.

The current pontiff has had, what, fifty years in power now? The Cardinals will be stacked with those who share his philosophy, most likely, so we'll probably get a continuation of his overall policies, rather than a return to regressive roots. Then again, anything can happen.

The idea for "ShadowReligion" as a PDF sourcebook is looking more and more interesting.

Sorry, meant "Radical Islamics" when I typed that. It was late when I typed that, and really did not mean to imply that all Islamics declair holy war at the drop of a hat. Sorry.

Yeah, and the Pope took a hard line as well, and see how long he lasted. (IIRC, not long.), damage was still done to previously strongly Catholic Countries (*Cough*Ireland*Cough*).

Yes, "Faith In The Shadows" does sound like a good PDF product.

I'd say the message was clear to everyone regardless of faith and nationality, and also intended to be that.

There are major differences in Catholic education depending on the Order that runs the school. Jesuit run schools will b very different than Franciscan run and Dominican run would be different from the other two. The Catholic church is far less monolithic than many think, but nowhere near as fractious as the Protestant Christian religions are.

All I know is that it took me less than a week to get expelled from a Catholic School.

Depending on which monastic order ran it this is somewhere between an incredible feat of misbehavior and par for the course.

It was the Jesuits, wasn't it?

Quite possibly!

Apparently, they considered it an incredible feat, and proof you should never try and rehabilitate any of those damned "Welfare Kids". I'm amazed they didn't break out the old priest and a young priest, some holy water, and try to beat the evil out of me, to be honest.No idea, could care less.

Canray, what the fragging hell did you do to get kicked out so quickly? If you don't mind me asking?

PS: Definitely not Franciscans.

Man, it was so long ago, I barely remember. I remember the punishment from home more than what it was I "did" to get kicked out.

...

Being myself? Best I got. It's probably in my three-inch thick permanent file somewhere in the school's records.

Well, that sounds like my local Jesuit school. They were the crazy strict, super funded by Nike, SUCCEED AT ALL COSTS, Evil Team from a sports movie, Will only accept those who have proven to be successful already school. It got so bad one of the local protestant churches had an "Even God hates Jesuit" sign out after they lost a football game. Their only loss that year.

Nah, no funding in my home town... Not enough of a market to bother.

Yeah, these guys were 10 minutes from Nike HQ. Quite a bit of market in the Portland suburbs.

Closest we got to marketing was vending machines in high school and the colleges and university.

My high school had soda machines, but then they got replaced with a big glowing green Gatorade machine that was just perfectly that 'radioactive' green glow. It didn't sell very well.

To continue the derailment, I had occasion to try Inca Cola in Peru years ago. A 'radioactive'-yellow drink whose taste defies description beyond sweet and cloying. Ten hours walk from the nearest town, there would be a trail-side farmer's home cum 'convenience store' that would have one soft drink. So I tried it.

The original topic is too interesting (and this thread has generated a couple of cool ideas for use in-game), so please stop further off-topic posts.

Hear, hear.

To get back on topic. We all know the RCC doesn't get along with Aztechnology. How would their relations with the other megas be?

They have their own opiates for the masses, thank you very much, and don't need any more.

But, if it helps keep the citizens in line and civilized, as well as reduce stress, that can't be a bad thing either.

Well, I don't see them getting along with the japana-corps.
Or Wuxing either.
Or Saeder-Krupp...
Or Evo...


Heck, this leaves only 3 AAA: Ares, Horizon and NeoNET.
They could have good relationship with Horizon, specially if Horizon begins to star some of those masses through television with really charismatic priests.
Ares seems too beligerent to have good relationship directly, perhaps through some of its subsidiaries and NeoNET I don't see any reason directly to like or not like.

For friendly relations, I think it begins and ends at NeoNET.

Boston's own Megacorp and the Vaitican are bound to be friendly with one another. Boston has, you know, one or two Catholics in it, and a long history of supporting the Church. Boston is also one of the arch-dioscese, with the bishop there sometimes called the American Pope, due to the influence he holds over the US believers.

The US church has always been more liberal than Rome, so is likely a big supporter of the current Pope, but I'm not certain just how liberal he might have been. We know that he's friendly to metahumans and magic, but has the CHurch of 2073 stepped up and allowed married priests or female priests? It might be a Thing now. (For the record, my personal game has female priests, but still forbids marriage, but Your Game May Vary.)

I think it's safe to say that the Vatican has some astoundingly good deckers, as well as some powerful traditions, both in terms of casting and of adepts. They probably allowed Fuchi (Back when Villers ran a third of it) to bring them the tech and train their initial crew, but have since gone on and gotten bigger. The Seraphim might even have had a connection.

Late for work, aie!

Lightning round! Horizon and ARes also get support due to anti-Aztlan stances.

More when I get home!

*dash*

Female priests or marriage? no, the catholic church does not change that fast or in that way. They already have a position for women interested in church service, the nunnery.

How about the fact that by 2050 homosexual partnerships are considered just another thing? Oh man, the amount of Alka-Seltzer alone...

*Goes off to find out who makes Alka-Seltzer in Italy and buy shares*