Has anyone ever tried to run a campaign with extraterrestrial elements in it? if so, how did it go?

Hmm... xenomorphs as low-grade Horrors...

Insect spirits.

I wanna do an X-COM Vs. Shadowrun game, but the real trick is how you handle the alien's psychic powers with the fact that Shadowrun canon says psychics are a huge load of bollocks. Also, how the aliens interact with magic.

Isn't there a Psychic tradition for magic? because that could kill two birds with one full auto burst of ground-to-air guided missiles.

Depending on realities, magic could really screw things up. If the aliens *truly* threatened the world?



Even assuming the most conservative of numbers, there's a few million people on the planet who could summon a spirit.

So I guess the aliens bring anti-magic devices? I dunno.

Critter Powers. Problem solved.


Perhaps make them resonance-based in nature - just using tricks that the frankly infantile earth-based resonance culture hasn't had time to develop yet - to avoid the whole Magic In Space thing.
Also R&D opportunities.

Still, x-com vs shadowrun is what I came in here to suggest, and hey look someone did it already. Good job.

The only official mention of ETs in Shadowrund was in the Shadowrun: Trading Card Game, where there was an "Abducted" card.

Hrm...

What if being in the presence of one of the alien's reactors counted as being in the presence of both a -12 Mana Void and a +12 Mana Warp, with their effects stacked numerically; IE, every round of exposure, everything which is astrally-active has to resist 24P damage, and the Magic rating of all characters in the area is reduced by 24, while the effective Force of all spells is raised by 24 for drain purposes, and you roll on the Mana Surge table.

A Great Dragon might survive spellcasting in the vicinity of an elerium reactor... But he wouldn't want to! (Naturally, the aliens themselves are completely unaffected by this.)

They'd be dangerous, and "lol spirit swarm from everybody on Earth capable of summoning even a Force 2 spirit" wouldn't be the answer (since the spirits would get torn apart before they could do jack shit,) but if you ran into some sectoids down Redmond way, you could whip up some mojo and electro-fry them same as any punk steppin' in your turf.

I'd be more inclined to make the alien's technology based around a partial working solution to the magic<->matter conversion problem.

We already know that some free spirits can convert mana to real objects(wealth), so it's theoretically(in the plausable sense, not the optimization sense) possible to bridge the astral and the mundane.

That is to say, I'm suggesting that another possible solution is to make certain parts of the aliens tech 'work on magic'. Not everything, but perhaps reactors, rayguns, and defensive shields have unpredictable effects on the astral in their general vicinity. perhaps the power sources themselves produce astral shallows in their vicinity, and then spirits are introduced to the unpleasant surprise of being shot by alien blasters. Something that shouldn't normally be possible.



And then every corporation starts fumbling over each other to be the first to put together a successful retrieval team for alien gadgets, because holy shit they break physics and metaphysics as we know it.

Between extraplanar enemies of several kinds, Matrix 'magic' and a ton of secret societies, what do you need Aliens for?

So that the runners can be neuralized by the Men In Black, obviously!

Or maybe it's just that I was curious to see if anyone had run something like that before. An alien invasion is one of the few things that could plausibly unite the megacorps (though only until the threat was gone, at which point they'd start squabbling like children over salvaging whatever tech the invaders left behind), and I was interested in how people had run with this concept in the past.

Does that technically means this thread was trolling, as its sole purpose was to gather replies?

Neutralized by the MiBs - or else recruited by the X-Com Project for being one of the first and few groups to successfully fight off the aliens. (Alien abduction squad shows up near the players' doss, and by the time the X-Com Project assault team lands, the players have already mopped up.)

Stupid: Flying halfway across the galaxy to kidnap an individual and perform tests... that have already been performed by the species themselves and are easily accessed.
Really stupid: Doing this to humanity, who combine in one species staggering belligerence and enough stupidity that you could probably find someone who'd volunteer.
Too dumb to live: Attempting to kidnap the streetsam instead of the bum loitering outside his safehouse.

What I meant to say is, I don't see a need to toss in cliché aliens into the menangerie we already have in shadowrun. They fill no specific role, have nothing interesting to offer, and, on a personal note, are an utterly retarded idea to begin with.

I initially agreed with you. The idea that life just happens somewhere is a mathematical impossibility. But then It's shadowrun. You've got magic, dragons, vampires, zombies, ghosts, trolls, elves, dwarves, and quantum entanglement communications. Mathematical impossibilities are pretty common here. Might as well embrace it.

I would probably never do this. My reasoning isn't as snarky as some of the replies here, but I do think there is more than enough in SR to play around with without tossing in aliens. Also, they seem out of theme. Yes, something that doesn't actually fit into SR!

But as an interesing discussion: The reasons that alien life is likely to exist elsewhere in the universe don't really change once you introduce magic, IMO. So, one of these societies could figure out how to visit our planet. Some things to think about: what is the mana level on their planet? Most of the posters so far assume none, but it's equally possible that aliens come from a world with an even higher level of mana than ours. How does their world connect to the metaplanes? Maybe they have regular contact with spirits that are very different from Earth's. Maybe they don't have a problem with nasty spirits like toxics and insects. Maybe theirs are worse. Maybe they never had a problem with Horrors. Maybe they killed them all with tech, like some speculate humanity might be able to do this time around.

In fact, maybe this has something to do with why they're visiting Earth.

According to SR, deep space is supposed to be a mana void, right? If they are awakened, then they will have to deal with this some how, either by finding a way for their magic to survive the trip or by keeping it alive somehow- maybe through the use of a "living ship" or by carrying a portable source of astral energy. Maybe they don't travel through space, but instead through the metaplanes. This could allow them to skip over the mana voids completely.

If you don't want the aliens to be awakened, and you want them to be antagonists, you could make them and their tech create a mana warp or void. I would probably not make it a complete void, but at least cause problems for mages. You could also look at Cyberzombies for some ideas. It could be that the have a negative essence rating- either for natural reasons- because they are simply not compatable with Earth, or because they are so thoroughly genetically engineered. I can see this being quite likely from a highly advanced race.

Alternatively, magic might be more effective against them, as they have no way of dealing with it. Like in War of the Worlds, where they were unprepared to deal with our microbes, they could be unprepared to deal with our magic. The above mentioned scenario, where mages all over the world drop spirits on them could work nicely once the Earth manages to figure it out and coordinate an attack. In the mean time, the PCs could dealing with the panic and helping to figure this out.

Additionally, I would take the opportunity to introduce all manner of mysterious technology. Wreak havoc on your tech-based PCs by making none of their gizmos and weapons recognizable. If their physiolgoy is different enough, then there's no reason their devices will look like ours. It will be a struggle to figure out what they're even doing, and harder to develop any strategy for dealing with it. Armor and armor modifications could be less effective against their weapons, while their weapons more so against our armor. Also, they can of course do all kinds of things even the advanced tech of SR can't. Energy weapons, force shields, teleporters... You can go crazy.

A fun thought experiment, at least.

Some considerations.
Space is huge, like really huge, like... (you get the idea)
Which means going anywhere in space takes a very long time unless you somehow bypasses the FTL barrier. So likely visitors would be.
Machines: Machines dont age or lose track of their goal, they're ideal explorers and settlers, finding habitable worlds and establishing them for when their masters eventually arrive
Habitats: Let's assume that these aliens haven't unlocked things like cryosleep or immortality, that means in order to go somewhere they would need self sustaining colony ships that would arrive generations after they first left the homeworld
FTL capable: This alien race is so advanced that were basically fucked regardless.

Although I would tend to agree that insect spirits and horrors make more then good stand-ins for aliens.

Had an idea a while back of making a insect spirit invasion on an deep space platform brought on by an SURGE event that would temporarily open the metaplanes on the space habitat... presto, space horror.

To address your points:

Stupid: Not all of the tests they want to perform have been performed by metahumanity In Shadowrun, they might be testing for something like that, or they might be testing for something the corps have tested for before, but their technology is much better at it, so where the corps declare "not happening," they can discern the differences. (Such as predicting with 100% accuracy who will Awaken as what.)
Stupid (Point 2): They may not actually be able to access all the info they want, even if it's already in metahuman hands, whether from simple communications barriers to the information not being hackable from the 'trix.

Really Stupid: It's entirely possible that "asking for volunteers" never occurs to a species which is used to conquering for what it needs. I mean, how often do the megas ask for volunteers, as opposed to just kidnapping folk?

To Dumb to Live: They probably have all the street bums they need by now; now, they want an example of a cybernetically-augmented or otherwise unusual specimen; especially if they're doing research to see what they can come up with that kills those pesky pink apes dead.

Aliens invade the matrix......
Unable to travel the distance required for a physical invasion. The aliens have long ago launched a signal that seeks to subvert matrix/resonance capable cultures.
This could allow an ongoing meta plot in a home game without disrupting cannon too badly.
Facing off against mysterious alien AI's plotting in the background.

What do they gain from that? Cultural hegemony on an interstellar scale is pointless (and, indeed, impossible) without FTL communications... and if they have FTL comms, they probably have FTL drives, which invalidates your premise.

If decades of serial sci-fi have taught us anything, it's that you don't need air-tight reasoning. You can always justify these things later. IMO, the standards are even lower in an RPG for such things, as long as you have fun. I think people are getting too caught up in the holes here. We all know Prometheus didn't make sense, but it still would have made an awesome RPG adventure.

Fixed that for you. Any properly paranoid group of PCs would have burned that temple to the ground the instant they discovered the black goo. Failing that, the instant dead bodies started cropping up without explanation.

I picked a bad example for the Dumpshock Forums

Same reason they probe people, because most alien "invaders" are really bored teenagers.

However I wouldn't say that FTL communication makes it logical to assume FTL travel.
First off you can attach information to a mass less particle, pushing something already moving at the speed of light beyond it surely is easier then trying to do the same to something that isn't.
Second of all, quantum entanglement, like in Mass effect. Is a real thing and is the closest we managed to teleportation

...Maybe.

Seriously, we don't know. It should, but it might not. It's like how we can break the speed of light sometimes, but only on a small scale.

Sizes screw with things. I'd like to see a probe launched with an entangled particle, and see how it works the further it goes out.

True, the intent was however to explain how a civilisation with FTL communication wouldn't have FTL travel. In theory

Makes sense. If they get a foothold, we're doomed, but until then we've got a chance.

never thought of Aliens inside the SR universe, could be pretty cool.

I never remember, how did that plotline of the comet probe resolve? could be some alien hook in the lore there. Maybe take a look at "Rendezvous with Rama" or research Von Neumann devices, for the mothership/interstellar transportation concepts.

the sentient, interstellar AI is a possibliity too (planet-sized AI's need to procreate, too). Gibson's novels allude to that (isn't it the alien intelligence merging with the matrix what causes 'everything to change' and give birth to the technomancer concept?)

I would say that your aliens should be more technology focused (as magical aliens already exist in the form of Horrors & Insect Spirits). I like the concept that Udoshi put forward, of incorporating Resonance into the alien's ability set. Remember Asimov's rule: any sufficiently advanced technology will be indistinguisable from magic.

In all likelyhood, the Corps would probably be more interested in whatever tech the aliens possessed, however, you could play it where the aliens don't naturally have access to magic, and are abducting the awakened & experiementing on them in hopes of finding a way to awaken thier own species.

*SOME* type of alien life? Sure. Even spacefaring things? Maybe. Rosswell Greys? Fuck off. And even then, interstellar travel makes next to no sense, IRL as well as in SR, which has no supertechnology that handwaives just how incredibly big and empty the galaxy is.

And please keep in mind life does in no way equal an anthropomorphic race who forms large organisations and tools the same way we do.

Also,

THIS.


It is NOT a real thing. It hasn't even been properly replicated.


Why? Seriously, why is that stated as some sort of law?


Based on PowerPC technology/MacOS, for it's superior compatibility with xenos computers, I bet (sorry, I had to ).

Well, physics say both is impossible...


Quantum entanglement means that both parties have the same information once they measure their particle. But they have no control over what that information is, therefore no communication

Well... it IS a real thing, absolutely, but hasn't been demonstrated that you can transmit information using entanglement - or even that we can manipulate entanglement in a meaningful way. But the the thing itself is definitely real.

Something else to keep in mind when discussing aliens: Space is a vast and lonely place. In a scale model where the sun has a diameter of 1 m, earth would be ~1 cm across and 100 m away, while the distance to our nearest neighboring stars would already be in the ten thousands of kilometers...

If aliens were out there, they'd still only stumble upon us by dumb luck

are you a planet-sized AI? Would you know?

I'm just saying I could conciveably see a basically immortal super-inteligence deciding to send off copies of itself into the interstellar medium on the mathmatically small (but in the incredible scale of the galaxy, mathmatically probable) chance that another inteligent species has developed computers sophisticated enough to detect & understand it's transmission.

It maybe a way to wipe out potential competition by turning a technological civilisation's toys against itself - or to prepare the area for the day teh far slower colonisation ships move in the area. Anoter possiblity could be a machien culture using it as fast track propagation system - hijack the local organics infrastructure to your own end - once again, information is probably easier to move tha nhardware.

Or a worse (from the repcipent's side) : there's no logic beyond the attack, it's merely a fallout effect from some interstellar war fought half a galaxy away, a viral weapon that's drifting out millenias after the war that relesaed it is finsihed (and the protagonists all dead...)

Are you? Unlike you, I don't claim to know.

And why should an AI based on alien technology act like the christian idea of a human being? Be fruitful and multiply?

because it makes for an interesting plot to a science fiction game

Given how over used it is (Seriously, how many movies, books and games use this premise? I can think of several.), I would disagree. And even if you think so, it would definitly work better with Eclipse Phase or Traveller than Shadowrun.

OK didn't read through all the posts, but here's my take:

First off, Shadowrun was designed by the creators grabbing the "Big Book of Stereotypes" to decide what they want in SR, taking one look, and then going "Yes". So Aliens is not that much of a stretch.

Second, Psychic powers... why not use the magic system, assign a few powers, but have it that it works in space, and is NOT tied to the Mana sphere? I wrote a rule set for true Psychic powers... not the insulting crap the creators wrote in Street Magic.

Third, these guys are Aliens... they DON'T think like humans. What seems totally sane to you might be the height of insanity to Them.

I quite like the "psychics as deluded magicians" concept.

I despise it with a passion.

Also with Technomancers doing their thing, Psionic abilities are very real in Shadowrun. I mean let's think about it. Their powers are unexplained and their abilities work in space.

Why? What distinguishes psionics from magic?

Psionics works outside of the Mana Sphere and Magic does not. Simple as that.

Let's look at it another way. With a Resonance 6 Technomancer with two levels of Amplification*, the Technomancer can transmit a wireless signal 4 kilometer with nothing more than the power of his mind. If that isn't Psionics then what is?


* == This is VERY simple to do. Most starting Technomancer will have Resonance 6, because to have less would be asinine. It also only cost 30 Karma to get the two levels of Amplification.

If you want aliens in Shadowrun, just rip off Stargate and say one of the megacorps was the one that found the gate.

Sez who? In SR psionics are (and always have been) magic users who believe their powers are some kind of mental energy, but in reality they still work magic just like anybody else. A psionic in space would face the same consequences as all other Awakened.


...or a testament to the fact that TMs are incredible BP sinks

So say the rules he himself designed because he couldn't bear psionics not working like in Star Trek. Which, incidentally, has it's own rules system, if you desire to play Star Trek, Kitsune.


So psionics, to you, is basically the ability to send radio signals through organic processes (that are so far not explained)? Also, 4 km is literally nothing in Space. Nothing at all.

Although I've yet to see any rules printed on it (since nobody's printed Shadows of Low Orbit, to my knowledge,) presumably Signal rating goes a lot farther in space since there's going to be orders of orders of magnitude less to soak up your signal. Forget about real-time VR, though.

Ever hear of drake's equation? not really an impossibility at all. In fact, its more of a probability.

Whether said race would be capable of FTL depends on if you believe FTL is possible at all.

Some recent findings show that making a vehicle capable of FTL may be a lot easier than initially suspected, requiring far smaller amount of energy. So just because we havn't found a way to do it, doesn't mean someone else couldn't have either.

Quantum entanglement is a real thing, and just because we havn't found a way to reliably transfer data with it, doesn't mean that its impossible. Magic and Resonance are unbelievable enough that this is a small jump of believability to me. I do however find such concept as a planetary AI launching self replicating probes as unlikely though.

On the subject of psionics, obviously magic is not psionics, and saying that psionics is actually deluded magicians, does not preclude the existence of real psionics. And Resonance, does sound a lot like it could be a precursor to psionics.

All that said, any alien race coming to earth in invasion style isn't coming here to abduct us, they're coming for our resources. Planets with breathable atmospheres, regular seasons, lots of water, and the perfect distance from the sun are hard to come by. And a race thats sufficiently advanced to have developed FTL has to be a pretty old race and is probably having a big problem with overpopulation.

Finally, does shadowrun need aliens? No. Can you put them in if you want them? Why the heck not? I think dealing with an alien invasion in a world with magic and resonance could be pretty interesting.

Interdimensional travelers might be more interesting...possibly from an alternate earth where the horrors won the last cycle.

Drake's Equation depends on three constants that are actually arbitrarily predicted variables which may be significantly off, skewing the whole "equation" radically. It's essentially a hope and a dream that was published by a scientist.


It seems that KCKitsune is simply insulted that psionics in SR does not match their view of what psionics should be. What about werewolves? Or the Infected? Ghouls being zombies? Trolls having regeneration and only being harmed by fire and/or acid?

My point being that SR has taken popular ideas and then stated that they've always existed, but the ancient lore from the last mana tide is exaggerated or wrong. This is how SR says that loup-garou are actually werewolves of legend, or any number of other things. The same is true for psionics. There could be something out there that is actually psionics, but there is a psionic tradition and that doesn't have to be psionics as you see it - it's what the game has declared is psionics.

Also, having a system of magic that does not function in relation to mana fields is a broken system - Backround Count, Astral Hazing (by extention) and Arcane Arrestor would have no effect against it, neither would any of a number of other defenses against standard magic. No defense against a superior system = broken.

Except that by the time you build a ship big enough to move a number of people large enough to have a noticeable impact on your overpopulation problem, you've built a ship big enough to be self-sustaining more or less indefinitely. Why fight somebody else for their planet when you can tour the universe instead? The same applies to resources: any ship large enough to carry a significant amount will be more expensive than the stuff it carries. This is a primary symptom of sci-fi writers having no sense of scale.

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