Look at that! The GM takes pity on a player/PC in the first run of a campaign. Thanks!

I/Willie will try to be more thoughtful in future, even if automatic gunfire is sweet music to Willie's ears.

That last post took a ridiculous amount of time to make between having to look up rules and character sheets. I'll get the rust off eventually. Maybe start remember folks stats. Well, I guess we'll see if you even want to try and bring these two in on future runs.

I need help.

Did Willie Surprise any of the three in the water on his side? I believe that any who were Surprised could not act directly against Willie in the first Initiative pass.

You surprised a bunch of them, but they're still delaying actions that trigger at the start of the second pass right?

I guess with Willie's high initiative it feels a bit the same. Although if they had managed to surprise Willie that would have changed things.

It's possible one could argue Flatline and Lenny should have missed out on going. But Willie did yell out in the first pass. Feels fair to let them go.

Wow. I have prided myself on finding cool little dodges in the rules. In all the years I have played, though, I never thought to use a delayed action to circumvent at least some of the restrictions of Surprise. So these squidgy things, even if they have only one IP, still get to attack Willie. I will have to be less reliant on his speed from now on.

I bow to you, master.

So, do those two engulf attacks come before Willie's second IP, or after it?

Before.

I don't know if I can take particular credit for that. The rules description of surprise mentions the situation where people are using delayed actions to jump someone. If anything the surprise rules help the defender, versus the usual way delayed actions get to go first.

However as I mentioned I suspect most GMs just avoid the fiddly surprise rules.

Awwww damn. Surely Lenny isn't going to use the electrical shocker on the one in the water near Willie, is he?

It's a good thought. Maybe that new processor again.

But you'll have to wait to find out Mr. speedy pants.

Actually I did give Flatline the initiative spell, but he didn't want to mess with it given the invisibility spells. Probably would have been worth it still, but hey, maybe players should stick around

Against things that have only one IP, as in this case, Willie will sometimes strike/shoot first and go to Full Defense, using up his second IP, and then attack again on the third IP.

In this case, since he has a knife out anyway and his Knife Skill is better than his Dodge, a Full Parry gives him 19 dice against the first attack of his opponent(s). Seeing as this last attack isn't likely to down the creature in the water, that is likely what Willie will do.

I built Willie originally for a 300 BP low level game years ago. I managed to pack a lot into those 300 BP.

I reincarnated him for a campaign here on DS which didn't last long. There are a few players here in Charm City who were in that one too. They will attest, I'm sure, that the GM's ruling to make timing and mechanics easier for him by allowing PCs with multiple IPs to do them all at once was not a good idea. I argued against that idea, saying that a fast PC would have an inordinate advantage and skew combat, but to no avail.

So I made sure Willie was, indeed, "Mr. Speedy Pants". It was ugly. Six bursts of automatic fire before anybody else got to do anything. It wasn't fun for GM or the players. As I say, the game didn't last long.

It could occasionally be like that in old editions, where speed was definitely king. Though never that extreme. Speed is still a big deal of course.

I could see perhaps re-interpreting the rules that you have to declare all your actions for a turn when you take your first, with actions being wasted if the no longer make sense by the time they come around. But that would be a notable speed nerf. Also I think people play crunchy games in part to enjoy the wargaming that modern pen and paper RPGs grew from, even if your character is realistically making split second decisions and with minimal ability to even look around. That means letting a player think for a moment on their strategy. Though your full defense strategy seems like a solid one right at the moment.

In terms of the action, engulf is another one of those poorly worded powers. I'm kinda willing to lean into the "rule" that the exact workings of powers may very and have some differing GM tweaks. In this case I take the "can't move" not as them being paralyzed and free to hit, but like the subduing melee combat rules which the engulf rules seem to be trying to mimic. Take a -3 (not cumulative so still only -3 if engulfed twice) to defense rolls against melee while engulfed.

I put the rules down earlier for convenience, but just to avoid scrolling it's base DV4, plus net hits, against body + 1/2 impact armor and then a complex action strength + body check to break free.

Yeah, a high Initiative score really subsumes a quick REA, which it actually does, and a quick Perception to allow someone with 3 IP to switch targets after shooting and assessing damage in all of 1 second.

A lot of the time, I play an Awakened PC, but once in a while it is fun to go full cyber and be the tank.

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Until some mage melts Willie's brain from two clicks out.

Speaking of Awakened PCs, I've been thinking about Bongo Slade and Initiation.

The books are pretty sketchy about time needed, mechanism, etc. There is a section in Street Magic about it, including ways to reduce the karma cost. Joining a group is definitely not Bongo's way, but doing a thesis/masterpiece (p. 52) is very much his style, especially if the alternate form for an artisan is available. There is timing for an Extended Test for that described, but not for the whole shebang.

Sunnyside, can you fill me in on how you would like to manage this for Bongo, should I decide to go that way? However long it would take, he would have to fit it in among jobs, gigs, and nights out with admiring women.

Initiation is more for a long-term goal of Bongo, that bit about playing the heartbeat of Gaia, but there are more immediate benefits, too. I wasn't too sure what Metamagic might be attractive to him, but a closer read of Adept Centering, particularly in light of his Artist's Way Quality (Way of the Adept p. 13), would allow him to enhance several skills that the team can use: Perception, Shadowing, Infiltration, Palming, Survival, Escape Artist, as well as Combat Skills.

I'd have to figure out an appropriate method of centering.

I was hoping Thanee was going to post. But between mission stuff is a key good time to be asynchronous and I think she's wondering some of the same questions. I think I'll have time tomorrow to make a post advancing time and maybe laying down some hooks and OOC timeframes.

Was busy with preparations for vacation (I will be gone the next two weeks, but will have internet, and should be able to check in and post, especially in the evening).

Bye
Thanee

Willie's never met a Hellhound before. What are the chances, eh? In a forest full of paranormals?

Actually Hellhounds are so famous I'd give Willie credit or at least a roll to know ehat it is. Ditto Gargoyles, ghouls, and dragons.

These guys just don't get that kinda press coverage.

Also I meant to add a comment that, due to only holding a knife, I'm assuming Willie is just carrying a shovel.

Oh, and I owe everyone a post, and need to get to some dice for Willie.

But I just wanted to remind you of the funky way SR handles movement across multiple initiative passes.

I think that might have always been the case? Commonly ignored though. Anyway the doggos will "help" Willie put with closing the distance so it should work out.

Well, I had hoped that with the Running rolls, Willie could cover the distance in one IP. Whatever happens, this should be fun.

I'm reminded of what they did in Cyberpunk 2077. I'm finally playing it now. Hey I'm a dad with a job. Anyway they put in a lot of work since it launched and I've experienced few of the problems people were making fun of it for. They've also added a lot of extra content.

One thing they changed was that they just sort of suspended disbelief when it came to clothing and armor. People were running around everywhere generally looking like they ride the short bus and get to dress themselves, including needing to wear a helmet when eating at a restaurant, because they want the best bonuses from whatever they've been able to find. Eventually the game designers just gave up and let you have the bonus as long as your own and select the gear, but you can separately have your character wear whatever they want.

This is coming up due to Willie apparently having been wearing a hood and helmet the entire time. Lenny was too actually, but that was part of his creators thing about him being paranoid and uncool.

Maybe Willie needs to ask around for something like this but cooler:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tewqsenq1g0

Plenty of similar concepts in sci fi:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9VgGGFvrLE
Well and these days everything marvel.

Or something, I'm just musing.

The 'encumbrance' to which I was referring was the metric on p. 161 about the effect of multiple layers of armour on AGI and REA. The 14/8 encumbrance I calculated is based on the helmet and PPP system being described as not adding to this metric. Am I wrong in that?

I see the bit about STR 8 being able to carry 80 kilograms and think that is OK.

Yeah, he wouldn't wear all this shit into a restaurant. But out in the wild woods, you bet. Here in the frozen north, it is common to see a bicyclist wearing a hoodie pulled up under their helmet a good half of the year. And the FF Full body suit is described as fitting under stuff. If I am overreaching, let me know.

I like to do an Initiative roll anyway, even if it seems obvious Willie will be first. That way, when he actually is damaged, I can figure out the result.

Hey, if that Marvel thing exists, Willie is all in for that! Not so much the air bag.

It seems like there ought to be some models evolved from the state of the art today.

However Willie making some comments to the group about wanting something like that but finding the options unattractive, especially the "air bags" That might give Selina some ideas. Either on her own to help Willie out or maybe to pitch as an idea to Frank, who is working on an armor line. Selina does have character generation points spent on being a fashion designer which we should work back in somehow. Conceivably Paul could get in on it as he's something of an afficionado on soft body stuff, which might be able to operate on similar principle but be cooler than the airbags. I don't know if any of you are remotely interested in that, but just letting you know I'm open to such.

Anyway I think you can combine the armor, but my read is that PP and helmet modify the armor rating. I.e. if you had a 5/5 piece of armor and put on a helmet it's the same as having 6/7 armor, and will be a problem if you only have body 3. Form fitting is just a gift to get better numbers, but PP seems to exist to allow heavy body folk to leverage that. Also filling in the gap that usually the impact rating is lower. But anyway with body 8 Willie still wouldn't have penalties.

As a side note since Shadowrun doesn't track encumbrance generally I have players use strength instead of body as what you compare against the armor value. That seems to make a lot more sense than being able to wear more armor because you're healthy. However I figured I already had too many house rules, and while getting extra points might be fun and not interfere with using existing characters, this one would make existing character builds and plans not work.

At least Willie is getting a lot of use out of his strength in any case.

BTW, are there elevated streets in the "uptown", or is all traffic on ground level in "downtown"?

Bye
Thanee

Thanks for pointing out the error in damage code. He's actually closer to being out with stun damage, as he only has 10 boxes of those, whereas he has 12 of physical.

Ok, I'm confused now. I thought "that's their shtick" meant Willie didn't get a chance to resist. Should he have done so?

I'm zonked from a weekend of sheep trialling, so please just tell me what I missed and what I should do next. I'll be more with it after some rest ... and wine.

If a rewrite of my post is necessary, I can do that.

Well, true. The difference being that if he does go down to stun, even if there's overflow, he wouldn't be dead. Just down. Assuming there isn't a TPK nor critters ignoring the rest of the team to continually lay into Willie, he could be back on his feet pretty quick.

They're fresh and full of edge. I don't think many folks in the SR world understand karma and edge enough to talk about them, but they might figure out or Willie could clue them in that they can't just rely on ol' Willie to handle everything and need to give this their all.




That's a one time thing entering combat. They'd have to disengage and spend time setting it up to do that again, and, since he'd be expecting the same trick, I'd give Willie some bonuses. Willie understands this to the extent that he appreciates the attacks from the newcomers seemed to come out of nowhere, making him unable to block, but now he can see them clearly enough. The critters all look pretty similar, no extra large ones with cool scars or anything.



Well, Shadowrun is crunchy enough you're sort of in a wargaming place, though with stealth and other considerations that you figured out. The pieces are on the table. I just wanted to make sure you had full and correct information before finalizing choices.

They are starting to get interconnected by a network of skywalks in some areas. There are courier drones and mobility scooter type things traveling those paths. But no cars or trucks up there yet. The exception being the Ares HQ "Archology" covering the Station North arts district, where Gatsby's is. But that's for Ares employees only.

So, with many "downtown" areas being pretty bad, there is not a lot of driving around happening and people mostly stay closer to their home (than they might usually do)?

I guess, there is an unusually high amount of supply drones flying around, then.

I would assume, that larger deliveries, that are made by truck, have armed escorts then? Or they will get robbed... a lot, if their route takes them through not-so-nice neighborhoods.

Bye
Thanee

So long as you stay in the "L" things aren't that bad on the ground. You'll see visitors and tourists walking around, especially around the inner harbor or in the arts district, but in between too. But the streets don't have barricades and bad might not be very many blocks away. A Go Gang might come tearing through, and the tourists won't be out late at night most places. You never know when a crazy might be on your stoop.

Uptown structures provide a layer of almost antiseptic protection from the streets, since you can't barge into an elevator the way you can a lobby or emergency exit. Cars stored in the automated parking systems from the car elevators are more secure than a dark underground parking garage. Though you can't necessarily just jump in your car and peel out at a moments notice.

The places Brewster is linking have apartments in the middle class or high lifestyle price ranges. It seems even their penthouses aren't really pushing into Shadowrun's luxury ranges, though they don't seem overly spacious either. You could lay out something about what you're looking for if nothing catches your eye.

That 414 Light Street building is very cool.

There is a website with floor plans of all the apartments in the building also.

https://414lightstreet.com/floorplans/

This one here would be really nice, I think.

https://images1.apartments.com/i2/6Voa024pW...oorplan.jpg?p=1

That is a 2-bedroom apartment in the upper area (the somewhat smaller top of the building; they are on seven floors, 35th - 41st; the two top floors are reserved for the penthouses) on the south-east corner. I really like that one that has a terrace (only the 35th floor one has that).

It's missing an extra room (usually called "Den" here), which would be useful for the Magical Lodge (but that can also go into Selina's bedroom), and a guest bathroom (you can only get to one through one of the bedrooms), but otherwise pretty perfect.

Compared to what Runner's Companion lists for High Necessities (like a 300 m² condo; but that always seemed a little absurd to me, anyways; that is crazy huge for an apartment), they are actually quite small (about 1/3 of that), but realistically that is a pretty good size. And, of course, the location also marks the price up considerably.

Bye
Thanee

I edited the last IC post for Willie ( Post #161) to reflect the new info. Thanks for that 'heads up'.

Now you've got me looking at the building in more detail. The virtual tour is a nice feature, and now I'm tempted to hit up one of the restaurants there to see what might stop me from going on a little self guided tour.

Interesting you found that room. It's the only one like it in the building! The layout is a bit odd. Their other 2 bedroom plans are more normal, with a den and more public bathroom. Maybe the terrace situation complicated the layout? Anyway there are reasons a spot like that might be less popular in the sixth world. Let's say it's open. It would represent a "high" lifestyle.

The building is right inside the edge of where Japanacorp security and organized/unorganized crime groups start their territory. Selina already speaks some Japanese though, so she may regularly get some use out of that. Mostly she just needs to appear to belong to avoid harassment. On the plus side they tend to keep other nefarious elements away, but they can't do all that much. Tourists flock around the inner harbor, plenty of traffic needs to go back and forth, and the Baltimore Police Union still holds jurisdiction. The Japanese security can't really stop anybody. This area doesn't even have that many Japanese people living in it. It's just if criminals get up to anything down in the peninsula this is the direction they'd have the best chance of escaping, and this is the choke point.

One someone gets past Conway street, the Japanacorps tend to have to rely on the BPU trying to catch criminals that may have done their crimes in externational Japanese facilities. The BPU success rate in these situations in not known to be high.

(Mostly that's a recap of some of the earlier Baltimore info, but Selina could find people talking about it at that fuzzy level of detail in matrix queries about the place.)

Oh, and I'm going on travel for a few days. Only phone replies at most. Also I reaaallly should be going to sleep instead of all this posting, but oh well, I tend to sleep well on planes.

I had Selina's lifestyle written down like this:

High Lifestyle (Comforts 4, Entertainment 4, Necessities 4, Neighborhood 4, Security 4; Friendly Neighbors, No Privacy: Physical 1; +10% Shared Lifestyle)

So, basically just regular High with the two small qualities (better be on good terms with your neighbors, especially who lives in "Basil" on 35th, the south-west corner apartment and they have the western half of the terrace; and with all those common amenities in the building, I assume that there is a bit of a building-community there, so you can always meet some of the other residents that way; and with the big windows all around the side, No Privacy: Physical (just level 1) also makes sense), and then the extra cost for a roommate (Dawn).

Would that work?

Bye
Thanee

P.S.

They want that large, open living space, which is cool, of course. I just don't know why you wouldn't want to have at least one (smaller) bathroom that is directly accessible, so you do not have to have every guest walk through your bedroom.

No idea, why they didn't do this (maybe structural reasons), but there seems to be enough free space right on top of the entrance, just make the walk-in closet there a bit deeper and narrower, and you could fit a small bathroom in there right below it (left-hand wall, if you enter the apartment).

As for the IDs... I was thinking about the "legal way". Selina has no legal SIN, so that is not an option for her (that is what she meant in the text to Brewster).
She has to use a Fake SIN. That is why the upgrade seems like a good idea.

I would just upgrade all four of her SINs.

If we take Brewster's offer for two of them for 2.5k, and then 10% off the rest, that would be...

2,500¥ (2x R4 -> R6)
1,800¥ + 180¥ (R4 + R4 license -> R6)
1,800¥ + 180¥ (R4 + R4 license -> R6)

One thing, I just realized... with the Magical Lodge and some magical security in the building for sure, does she need a license for being awakened on the SIN she is using there (which would be Kim, the Fashion Designer)? Then I would need to add that one at R6 (540¥ with a 10% discount) as well.

Bye
Thanee

I suppose in the dystopian future it might be more realistic to have a whole slew of licenses for everything.

However in practice I consider a basic drivers license to be part of a fake SIN and haven't charge for it, and then a single license for concealing and possessing ® weapons and then a single license for ® spellcasting equipment. Perhaps just consider for the price you're actually getting a bundle of related licenses.

The lodge materials aren't restricted though. 414 Light doesn't charge extra for that. There might be particular concerns, for example setting off a fire alarm with smoke.


As a note on rooms, during the pandemic, when my co-workers suddenly needed home offices in houses that didn't have them, or didn't have enough of them, some turned to setting up room dividers. The Japanese have long used them, but now there are a lot of designs and styles.

Yeah, I generally assume that "normal" licenses (stuff that an everyday person has, like drivers license and such) are just part of the SIN.

The licenses you can buy are only for restricted stuff and something unusual, I think.

The part where I am not quite sure is, whether being awakened needs to be registered (probably does). And while a lodge itself is legal, it also means that there is someone using it. So, if your SIN does not say you are awakened, but you have that big Magical Lodge in your place... that might raise some questions.

Bye
Thanee

It would be a very good idea to have a license. Even if the materials and lodge aren't restricted, most anything you'd actually do with it would require a license. It might be hard to convince anybody that it's just for meditating and putting up wards.

Yep, that was what I was wondering, since that stuff is all quite vague in the rules, it is mostly relevant how you see it.

I will update my sheet then, accordingly.

2,500¥ (2x R4 -> R6)
540¥ additional R6 license
1,800¥ + 180¥ (R4 + R4 license -> R6)
1,800¥ + 180¥ (R4 + R4 license -> R6)

So, in total, 7,000¥ for the SIN upgrades.

Looking at them all, I am thinking about adding another license to one of the other SINs (which already has a magician license), making her an occult investigator (i.e. private investigator license).

Bye
Thanee

I'm playing in another game on DS in which a teammate is a private investigator. It has come in handy several times in only 8 days of game time.

Just for giggles I checked if the core books occult investigator pregen has any such license. Of course they don't.

However PIs do need licensure across the US even today. But that's to legally perform the work. It doesn't give you additional rights or privileges like being a police office does. So it might make you seem more official in certain settings, which would help talk through issues, or allow entirely legal jobs outside of a fixer. If you're looking for more than that you should discuss your expectations, or if you know some rules somewhere.

Yeah, those are not exactly the best example characters.



Wouldn't that be covered by adding the appropriate license to the SIN?



Don't need a second day job.

It's just to help open some doors, which might be handy here and there.

Bye
Thanee

For obvious reasons, I looked into Willie's equipment list for stim patches. He has a couple! I'm a little confused by what I wrote in his character sheet.

Stim patches cost Rating X 25 . He has 2 stim patches, rating (2), which should cost 100 , but he has paid 175 for them. I would like to rationalize this error. There are three options:

1) Suck it up, loser. You made the mistake. Pay for it. I would be happy to accept this option.

2) You have the two patches at Rating (2), and an extra 75 . I would be happier with this option.

3) You spent the money, so have a stim patch at rating (4), and one at rating (3). I would be happiest with this option.

Waddaya think, nice GM person?

How about a rating 6 and 25 back?

As a GM it's a pain to track the time until the effect wears off and you take an extra box of stun. Not only is there the bookkeeping, but also having to deal with players who are potentially hypersensitive about exactly how long things take.

Option 4 it is!

The lifestyle payment during character generation is meant for Baltimore, already. The previous iteration of the character had the lifestyle in Seattle, of course, but that is just background now.



Not entirely sure what to do with that, just yet. There is, of course, plenty to spend Karma on.
One thing, that might be nice would be finding a Magical Group to join (which will help keep the cost for further initiations down).

Bye
Thanee

I'm willing to lax on the transfer, and that might be a thing for the others too. Well, Paul already has a place.






There's some stuff on that in one of my replies to pbangarth.



On that note something I thought was standard, but might just have come from the Sega Genesis Shadowrun game, is being able to "buy" access to new contacts. That is getting the first contact vouch for both sides and connect them for a fee. In any case I treat it as part of the culture.

Beyond that I'm not quite sure what sort of a response you're expecting to your last post. I guess Brewster could send another reply. But people don't generally say goodbye in text conversations.

Don't think he really needs to reply.

Bye
Thanee

Bongo can pick up the requisite 'instruments' relatively surreptitiously with his Nimble Fingers and Palming. He'll have 9 dice, so that could buy 2 hits. I'll roll if you want.

I'll consider that plenty so long as you aren't trying to swipe anybody's food.

Is Lenny's AR waypoint in the location of that circle of trees down the path?

###

And, holy shit. 38 dice and only 3 hits. Bongo, Bongo, Bongo. Hang your head in shame.

Hey, I got some work that needs to be done at my place. Can Paul come over after he's finished the union job?