The rigger is the easiest PC class to do without in the group. Depending on the group (And the GM's payscale) the rigger can replace Sammys though.

I've never had it happen, but I suspect going up against a million Y Rigger is a lot scarier than facing a million Y Chromejob. At least you have some idea where the guy is atacking you from, and he can't fight you again if you fill him with enough metal.

In my experience, deckers are the easiest ones to do without. If you need some matrix work done, just call a contact and wait. Riggers, however, are masters of surveillance and reconnaissance, and failing that they get to pull ut the biggest guns of anyone in the game. They're definitely worth having on a run. Necessary? No. But more useful in more situations than a traditional decker is.

Whilst I agree that deckers in person are easy to do without, and in fact we generally do, I do understand what the OP is getting at.

Remove magic, and it's not Shadowrun any more.

Remove the Matrix, and it's not Shadowrun any more.

Remove rigging, and I honestly think hardly anybody will notice - or even care.

Having a decker contact do the matrix legwork for you is one thing, and it's something that 8 out of 10 groups I've played with do. But the Matrix is still there and still important. Rigging, on the other hand, rarely if ever raises its head unless there's a rigger actually in the party.

Perhaps the most damning point from where I'm sitting is this: in all the years I've played Shadowrun, I've only seen maybe half a dozen PC deckers. But I have only seen one PC rigger, and that was in the very last game I reffed; and that was only because it was a one-off and the player was looking for something completely different to do.

I don´t know if your wrong or not. But I think you should be right. Rigging is fine, just let the sams use their improved initiative when driving. We don´t want to blend riggers and samurai so that every sam is a rigger and the other way around. Which is what would happen if riggers automaticly got a general boost to initiative and sams only had to buy some really cheap extra cyber to be a rigger too. That would really screw with game ballance. And I agree with many of the previous posters, riggers are extremely usefull and there are just as good roleplaying opportunities as with any other character. My only problem with them is the "to the riggermobile, we´re going for a pint. Oh schush" problem. Riggers need more illigal equipment than any other character. How do you solve that?

<<<edit>>> oops. Missed a few pages. My post is regarding a discussion on the first and second page.

Yea. But I meen when it´s crusial to keep a low profile. Riggers tend to be very powerful in the countryside and the barrens, but they have a hard time doing any good in downtown areas.

I guess it ballances out if I do my job as a GM.

Yes this is possible. So you can make a low profile rigger just as you can make a low profile samurai. But at least if you´re starting from scrach it might be hard to afford both a low profile vehicle and one with lots of guns. And all the consealment in the world wouldn´t hide the fact that a Citymaster stands out in some situations. As a GM I must admit that having a rigger for the first time on a team uped the stakes. It lets the team use much more high-tech methods. And it also increases the complexity of every run. There´s more money involved, and more angles to cover. Both for the GM and the players.

I guess your right

The rigger's best friend in this case is a Shaman or mage - both of which can almost compete with the rigger for doing vehicle stunts. But combine them and you get a fairly unstoppable combo. I mean what better anti missle system than an air elemental on standby? Not to mention the movement powers of some elementals and nature spirits. Need to mak a clean getaway? Summon a city spirit to give you that extra bursts of speed or use its accident or concealment powers. And as good as ruthenium polymers are, nothing beats an invisibility spell for stealth.

In most of my games as well its usually the rigger who gets to monitor the mage/shaman who's out and about astrally as he's strapped into the seat beside him. Put a biomonitor on him which ties into the vehicle you're rigging and if the mage gets in trouble astrally, you give him a punch to the jaw and bring him back to his body.

For vans, a top-mounted pop-up turret can be quite concealable. How many pedestrians look at the top of the van?

~J

Keep in mind that a single success against Concealability doesn't mean you'll be interupted. It's the Legality code that determines whether or not you're going to get harrassed about it... and as far as I know, Pop-Up Turrets don't have a tremendously horrible Legality Code. Fixed mounts and normal turrets only have a code of 3P-V, and Pintle Mounts have a Legal code.

So, basically, they have to spot the Pop-Up Turrent, then make a Police/Security Procedures Test with at least 2 or more successes in order to begin hassling you about it. A single success against the Legality Code only means that they've figured out what it is. If you have a permit, the most they'll do is ask you to see it and maybe hassle you a little. For normal pedestrians, that means two Intelligence Tests, one with a TN of 6, the other with a TN of 7 and the requirement of 2 or more successes to do anything about it.

Armor, on the other hand, is completely legal. Doesn't matter if they notice it or not; it may raise some suspicions, but the armor itself isn't going to get you into trouble... especially if it's Concealable Armor (even if the Conceal is 2). Like I said before, it's mostly an aesthetic choice.

Possession is nine-tenths of the law. Specifically, if you've got the drone, they're going to want to see your permit to have that drone.

~J

On a side tangent, Transponder Libraries don't quite work the way a lot of people think they do (even though they should include that functionality). By the rules, the only thing it does is randomly change your transponder code on a rapid basis so as to confuse things like GridLink.