Full Version: Wha huh?
At the risk of being at the front of the line for a very early and elaborate April Fool's joke, are we going to be getting samples of just what changes are being made to the ruleset? Nothing about the evolving story, just about how the rules are going to change.
There will be a dev blog starting soon on the official site. I imagine you'll be getting previews of the rules changes there.
It's not an early April Fool's joke though, I can tell you that much.
It's not an early April Fool's joke though, I can tell you that much.
When?
Definitely not an April Fool's joke, like Demonseed Elite said. I would normally have left an announcement like this to Adam but he's at GAMA.
Check out the sticky post in this forum for all of the details that are currently publically available. I'll try to keep that post updated as more information is declassified.
Check out the sticky post in this forum for all of the details that are currently publically available. I'll try to keep that post updated as more information is declassified.
This week is what we were told.
RSN.
(Real Soon Now)
(Real Soon Now)
4th Ed?
Oh. My. God.
I don't know what to say.
"Damn that new marketing guy" is one thought in my mind right now.
Well, what's decided is decided. Where can we send threatning letters to make sure cyberlimbs and vehicule rules get the love they desperatly need?
Oh. My. God.
I don't know what to say.
"Damn that new marketing guy" is one thought in my mind right now.
Well, what's decided is decided. Where can we send threatning letters to make sure cyberlimbs and vehicule rules get the love they desperatly need?
It's probably a bit late for that.
If it wasn't an April Fools Day joke, you'd think they'd release it AFTER April 1st! And look, the only people who are saying it's real all know each other! It's just like them to plan out an elaborate hoax like this... *shives in the corner*
[Is currently in denial]
[Is currently in denial]
lol
Well, today is the Ides of March... but no, it's still real. Not a joke.
Yeah, and "Beware the Ides of March" turned out to be idle chatter and not good advice. 
| QUOTE |
| Well, today is the Ides of March... but no, it's still real. Not a joke. |
Et Tu, Fanpro?
i go away for a week and come back to SR4 , omg... im honestly speechless.
It just dawned on me that when this hits the shelf ill be in the middle of my thesis... ill barely be able to find time to read it
.... or ill read it cover to cover THEN start my thesis <--- this is more likely.
It just dawned on me that when this hits the shelf ill be in the middle of my thesis... ill barely be able to find time to read it
.... or ill read it cover to cover THEN start my thesis <--- this is more likely.
Figures it would be released on the Ides of March
Death of Caesar - AND 3E!!!
Buzzards return to Hinkley (Oh) - maybe to pick over the carcass of 3e
My bday - was thinking of replacing my 3e "hobbit snot" bound softcover with a new one. Guess i won't be doing THAT!!!!!
/sigh
Death of Caesar - AND 3E!!!
Buzzards return to Hinkley (Oh) - maybe to pick over the carcass of 3e
My bday - was thinking of replacing my 3e "hobbit snot" bound softcover with a new one. Guess i won't be doing THAT!!!!!
/sigh
The Gama Trade Show is currently going on, which means companies are revealing their new product for the year to retailers and distributors.
Hard to keep SR4 under wraps after that. Thus the announcement. April fool's had nothing to do with it.
Bull
Hard to keep SR4 under wraps after that. Thus the announcement. April fool's had nothing to do with it.
Bull
Look at it this way: Everything everyone's been complaining about now has the perfect opportunity to be addressed.
All we can hope for is that the number of things that are fixed exceeds the number of new things screwed up.
I'm encouraged, and looking forward to seeing it.
I'm encouraged, and looking forward to seeing it.
| QUOTE (Smed) |
| All we can hope for is that the number of things that are fixed exceeds the number of new things screwed up. I'm encouraged, and looking forward to seeing it. |
You sound like an engineer looking at a new gadget...
LOL
If most of it's already written, how can things be addressed?
| QUOTE (Jrayjoker @ Mar 16 2005, 10:28 AM) | ||
You sound like an engineer looking at a new gadget... LOL |
I am an engineer.
Me too.
If this is true (and I'm doubting it is) I won't buy it. Just out of spite.
| QUOTE (Rajaat99) |
| If this is true (and I'm doubting it is) I won't buy it. Just out of spite. |
Why would you think it isn't true? It was announced at GAMA. It's on the front of ShadowrunRPG.com and FanPro.com. April 1st isn't for another three weeks.
My only reason for thinking it couldn't be true is because I hate to think that I was lied to at GenCon So Cal. I asked several people and was told that there was no plan for an updated system. They pointed to the agrgessive book line that was being pushed this year.
So SOTA:64, MJLBB, every book that has hit the market this year, has it all been a waste and every word said a lie?
This really isn't meant to be inflammatory, I just can't believe that this could be in the works and have it completely and utterly denied when asked a perfectly straight-forward question.
So SOTA:64, MJLBB, every book that has hit the market this year, has it all been a waste and every word said a lie?
This really isn't meant to be inflammatory, I just can't believe that this could be in the works and have it completely and utterly denied when asked a perfectly straight-forward question.
Umm... because they weren't ready to make the announcement, and have to deal with this kind of uproar?
| QUOTE |
| So SOTA:64, MJLBB, every book that has hit the market this year, has it all been a waste and every word said a lie? |
What the HELL are you talking about? I don't know how you think this whole new edition things works, but FanPro is not going to be sending around death squads to blow away everyone they catch still playing 3rd Edition. There will be no ultimatums of, "From this point on, you will play 4th Edition, and all games will take place in 2070 OR ELSE!" There is going to be five years of story going on between 3rd and 4th, and if you don't want to immedaitely jump onto the new system, there's going to be lots for you to do (and I'm sure suggestions as to what you can do with the current system).
Sandoval--That question was more rhetorical since it was the justification for why a new system wouldn't be produced.
| QUOTE (Sandoval Smith) |
| ...but FanPro is not going to be sending around death squads to blow away everyone they catch still playing 3rd Edition. There will be no ultimatums of, "From this point on, you will play 4th Edition, and all games will take place in 2070 OR ELSE!"... |
Dammit.
Should've read this before sending my job application.
Sandoval: I don't think he's saying he's upset that the sourcebooks are wasted, just upset that he'd been lied too.
If what he's saying is true, its is a pretty despicable thing for someone to do. A simple I don't know, or No comment is a better answer than an outright lie.
If what he's saying is true, its is a pretty despicable thing for someone to do. A simple I don't know, or No comment is a better answer than an outright lie.
| QUOTE (McQuillan @ Mar 16 2005, 10:35 PM) |
| My only reason for thinking it couldn't be true is because I hate to think that I was lied to at GenCon So Cal. I asked several people and was told that there was no plan for an updated system. They pointed to the agrgessive book line that was being pushed this year. |
Well, it depends on who you asked. AFAIK, the freelancers weren't even told until last week.
I believe the term is called, "plausible deniability."
| QUOTE (Smed) |
| Sandoval: I don't think he's saying he's upset that the sourcebooks are wasted, just upset that he'd been lied too. If what he's saying is true, its is a pretty despicable thing for someone to do. A simple I don't know, or No comment is a better answer than an outright lie. |
Allow me to posit the following scenario:
Fan comes up to booth (or sends email, etc.) He or she asks, "So, what about that 4th edition?" Rob says, as was suggested, "I don't know," or "no comment," as he is thinking about 4th edition but doesn't want to have everyone know about it.
What is the fan likely to think? I'd say that fan would be fully justified in thinking, "Okay, a 4th edition's in the works!" After all, Rob didn't say no.
Suppose that fan gets on, say, Dumpshock and starts saying that, without anything from FanPro to show what the plans are or what the direction for the edition might be. Mass Hysteria ensues, most of it damaging for the company and the planned edition. Damage control has to be done, and people get generally unhappy because news broke before the company was ready for it.
Perhaps that fan would never post something somewhere, though. Now multiply that one query by a thousand, and tell me which ones they should tell, and which ones they shouldn't?
This is the way business works. There has to be information management, and that means that you make announcements when you are ready to make them, not whenever someone asks. Hopefully you have good timing and can keep to your promised schedules and content. Hopefully you have a plan for keeping people informed once you're committed to something.
I am sorry if someone feels lied to, but I can't help but feel somewhat bemused by the reaction. This is not a failed personal relationship. Nobody changed the locks to your house and gave your cat to the animal shelter. The books still coming out will be useful up to the change and beyond.... if that weren't the case, there'd be no point in printing them, as (surprise) retailers are also loathe to stock stuff that has an expiration date.
It's still a lie, and remains a lie regardless of hurtful intentions or business practices.
So you think that businesses should throw their secrets around, just because someone asks them too?
There's a reason for why people have to sign NDA's, you know?
There's a reason for why people have to sign NDA's, you know?
No, I didn't say or think any such thing.
But stating a lie, means you lied, regardless of the reasons.
I'm a member of the 'Just Say Nothing' camp.
But stating a lie, means you lied, regardless of the reasons.
I'm a member of the 'Just Say Nothing' camp.
But as Lady Anaka said:
If you say nothing or "no comment", it's as good as saying "yes".
*shrugs*
It ain't pretty, but there's no other way.
If you say nothing or "no comment", it's as good as saying "yes".
*shrugs*
It ain't pretty, but there's no other way.
There is another way, but the situation ain't perfect in either case.
Lies or not, the siuation is as it stands. You can either be offended and get over it, be offended and not get over it, or not be offended.
It don't make me no nevermind what been said before, just what is.
It don't make me no nevermind what been said before, just what is.
If we're talking about the FAQ, they could have simply taken the question out subtle-like as soon as they heard the faintest rumors of a fourth edition. I do agree, I don't appreciate the fact that not two weeks after it's retracted from the FAQ they anounce it. Assuming they knew (and I think that's only fair, if they're in playtesting now), it's unfair to their players to say one thing and mean another. Dishonesty to your customers is not normally a good business plan.
Then again, I thought all the rest of the FAQ was pretty worthless anyway.
Then again, I thought all the rest of the FAQ was pretty worthless anyway.
Not the FAQ. He's referring to asking someone face-to-face whether SR4 would be released.
| QUOTE (Lady Anaka) |
| This is the way business works. There has to be information management, and that means that you make announcements when you are ready to make them, not whenever someone asks. |
Amen.
| QUOTE (The_Sarge @ Mar 17 2005, 02:55 PM) |
| But as Lady Anaka said: If you say nothing or "no comment", it's as good as saying "yes". *shrugs* It ain't pretty, but there's no other way. |
That's bull. "No comment" should always be the response, even if there's no fourth edition in the works and won't be for a decade. No comment only means yes if there's already no information management.
~J
Echo that. Having been on both sides, and especially having become intimately familiar with the idea of confidentiality, I have no qualms about this being kept under wraps even if it meant Rob or someone else lied to your face.
I'd much prefer "even if we were working on that, I couldn't tell you." But, even that could turn into "OMG 4e is on the way!!" given some time in the grapevine.
Fans who think there is even a chance of a new edition simply won't accept anything short of a yes or a no, and if the company line is to not release or confirm any information about said new edition? That leaves the choices as far as answers go pretty slim.
Not perfect, but understandable (IMHO).
Fans who think there is even a chance of a new edition simply won't accept anything short of a yes or a no, and if the company line is to not release or confirm any information about said new edition? That leaves the choices as far as answers go pretty slim.
Not perfect, but understandable (IMHO).
You're all brainwashed. I'd be pissed if I was lied to. I don't lie to people and I expect the same from others in return, it's called Integrity. Companies need it, just as people do.
CD will cost less, gas prices will go down, I didn't have sexual relations with that woman, SR4 is not planned @,@
| QUOTE (Rajaat99 @ Mar 17 2005, 10:50 PM) |
| You're all brainwashed. I'd be pissed if I was lied to. I don't lie to people and I expect the same from others in return, it's called Integrity. Companies need it, just as people do. |
You weren't lied to.
The book is coming out in August, which would indicate that it is currently still far from complete. 1: How do you know that the person you talked to was fully informed about EVERY project in the works? 2: Looks at all the uproar that' occuring right now. So what happens if they tell everyone and sundry that 'yeah, we're thinking about doing it,' when at that point all they have is a few rough outlines. People are demanding to know what's going to be in it, what changes there'll be, when it'll be out, and it's going to piss even more people off if they say, "It will have words, and be released when we're done with it." Now they've got the basic book down, they've got a schedule, they can say, "we've got SR 4 concretely in the works."
The development blog isn't even up yet, so maybe up until a week or so ago, there wasn't an SR4, just a plan being bounced around.
Irrespective of that, it's still bad practice.
~J
~J
yes. brainwashed by our understanding of human nature, and the nature of rabid gamers particularly.
it's worth pointing out that it's just as fair to say you're brainwashed by your black-and-white view of human interactions, rajaat. though i guess that'd be more along the lines of self-delusion than brainwashing, technically.
it's worth pointing out that it's just as fair to say you're brainwashed by your black-and-white view of human interactions, rajaat. though i guess that'd be more along the lines of self-delusion than brainwashing, technically.
| QUOTE (Kagetenshi) |
| Irrespective of that, it's still bad practice. ~J |
No, it's distasteful. But it's very good practice.
No, it's very bad practice. Again, the answer should always be "no comment". It should have been "no comment" for the past seven years.
~J
~J
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