nonono
I see the problem
MFB, it is the SURGEd Catgirl that sucks, and she is pretty good at it
Full Version: SURGErs
heh. the catgirl's only half... okay, maybe three-quarters of it. the catgirl makes SURGE an anime-esque thing, bringing to mind all kinds of cutesy crap that just doesn't fit very well. the other part of it is the fact that any elements of social issues and prejudice were completely undermined by the article about how popular changelings are. the hysterical and depressing part of that is that SURGE was, from what i understand, supposed to kickstart hate crime stuff in SR. it was supposed to be "oh no SURGE! kill the metahumans!" but instead, it became "zomg teh SURGE catgurl purpel hair w00t!"
Funny, I never thought of the japanese prepubescent catgirls from that article
I thought of the original catgirl
Catwoman
you know, the Batman Villainess
I thought of the original catgirl
Catwoman
you know, the Batman Villainess
that's a pretty weird leap. Catwoman doesn't have fur, or a tail. she's a thief who dresses in a funny costume, not a half-animal whose sole purpose is to look sexy.
dude
read her backstory
she has cat like abilities
read her backstory
she has cat like abilities
i've read her backstory. she's got a whip, a grudge, and a fetish. she doesn't have any superpowers--very few of Batman's major enemies do.
Is anyone here familiar with the comedy of Sarah Silverman? She wanted to avoid jury duty so she decided to write an etnic slur on the questionare. She was going to write "I hate chinks" but she didn't want anyone to think that she was a racist as she wrote "I love chinks" instead.
Around the middle of the 19th century Minstrel Shows and black folk music were rather popular in the United States. Now, the US at the time, both Narth and South, was a horrificly racist country with a horrificly racist culture. The fact that black and faux-black performers were popular does nothing to diminish this racism it mearly puts the racism in context.
The "We love changlings" sentiment is no less racist than the "We love niggers" sentiment of white Americans during and after the era of slavery.
The thing about racism is that it has nothing to do with hate. The whole hate stuff is a rather recent invention in response to percieved political injustices. The basis of racism is the belief that one ethnic group is simply inferior to your own.
That percieved inferiority can easily produce a facination with the inferior group and its culture but it can never produce identification.
The thoughts of the vast majority of the "OMG catgirls" crowd could easily be summed up as the fllowing:
Changlings can enterain us because they are freekish and inferior and we all want to gt to know one. We'd certainly fuck one if given half a chance. But we'd never take one seriously.
Now, just to round things out, honkey, spic, cracker, towel-head, slope,kike, eskimo. If I havn't offended your ethnic group please inform me and I'll add the appropriate slur. I try to be an equal-opportunity offender.
Around the middle of the 19th century Minstrel Shows and black folk music were rather popular in the United States. Now, the US at the time, both Narth and South, was a horrificly racist country with a horrificly racist culture. The fact that black and faux-black performers were popular does nothing to diminish this racism it mearly puts the racism in context.
The "We love changlings" sentiment is no less racist than the "We love niggers" sentiment of white Americans during and after the era of slavery.
The thing about racism is that it has nothing to do with hate. The whole hate stuff is a rather recent invention in response to percieved political injustices. The basis of racism is the belief that one ethnic group is simply inferior to your own.
That percieved inferiority can easily produce a facination with the inferior group and its culture but it can never produce identification.
The thoughts of the vast majority of the "OMG catgirls" crowd could easily be summed up as the fllowing:
Changlings can enterain us because they are freekish and inferior and we all want to gt to know one. We'd certainly fuck one if given half a chance. But we'd never take one seriously.
Now, just to round things out, honkey, spic, cracker, towel-head, slope,kike, eskimo. If I havn't offended your ethnic group please inform me and I'll add the appropriate slur. I try to be an equal-opportunity offender.
| QUOTE (hyzmarca) |
| Is anyone here familiar with the comedy of Sarah Silverman? She wanted to avoid jury duty so she decided to write an etnic slur on the questionare. She was going to write "I hate chinks" but she didn't want anyone to think that she was a racist as she wrote "I love chinks" instead. Around the middle of the 19th century Minstrel Shows and black folk music were rather popular in the United States. Now, the US at the time, both Narth and South, was a horrificly racist country with a horrificly racist culture. The fact that black and faux-black performers were popular does nothing to diminish this racism it mearly puts the racism in context. The "We love changlings" sentiment is no less racist than the "We love niggers" sentiment of white Americans during and after the era of slavery. The thing about racism is that it has nothing to do with hate. The whole hate stuff is a rather recent invention in response to percieved political injustices. The basis of racism is the belief that one ethnic group is simply inferior to your own. That percieved inferiority can easily produce a facination with the inferior group and its culture but it can never produce identification. The thoughts of the vast majority of the "OMG catgirls" crowd could easily be summed up as the fllowing: Changlings can enterain us because they are freekish and inferior and we all want to gt to know one. We'd certainly fuck one if given half a chance. But we'd never take one seriously. Now, just to round things out, honkey spic, cracker, towel-head. If I havn't offended your ethnic group please inform me and I'll add the appropriate slur. I try to be an equal-opportunity offender. |
You forgot slopes and kikes.
That aside, your post is extremely accurate and well-considered, and I applaud you.
I think you also missed Eskimos.
Good post Hyz.
Good post Hyz.
| QUOTE (hyzmarca) |
| The whole hate stuff is a rather recent invention in response to percieved political injustices. |
If by "recent" you mean "almost as long as recorded history."
[Deleted because I sounded too 'preachy'.]
| QUOTE (Geekkake) |
| Now, just to round things out, honkey spic, cracker, towel-head. If I havn't offended your ethnic group please inform me and I'll add the appropriate slur. I try to be an equal-opportunity offender. [/QUOTE] You forgot slopes and kikes. That aside, your post is extremely accurate and well-considered, and I applaud you. |
As a Nip, I put to you that slope is too general... I don't want to be confused with Chinks or Gooks.
You Round-Eyes are so funny.
Seriously, we talked on another thread about the racism in Japan (and most Asian countries) and I don't think America is nearly as bad... However, we also tend to think of ourselves as "Racist? Not me!" while continuing to show racist attitudes (But I have friends who are black!) It's this double-standard that drives me insane, and also keeps us from realizing just how racist we truly are.
| QUOTE (James McMurray @ May 2 2006, 06:27 PM) | ||
If by "recent" you mean "almost as long as recorded history." |
It is rare for oppressors to activly hate oppressed groups because the oppressors have all the power. Hate is generally a response to some percieved wrong or injustice or fear of such an wrong. Hate politics can only take root when the opressed group is given or tries to take some measure of equality on a wide scale.
When the the opressors have all the power they tend to see the relationship as a cooperative "Us and Them" With us being the benevolent masters an Them being the happy slaves because they can't be anything else. It is only when the oppressors are threatened that it turns into "Us vs Them" with Us being the bastion of civilization and Them being savages who will rape our wives and eat our babies then rape their wives and eat their babies.
| QUOTE (bustedkarma) |
I think you also missed Eskimos. Good post Hyz. |
Few people know that "Eskimo" is derived from a racial slur. Blame it on ignorant white people and their translators.
| QUOTE (hyzmarca) |
| Hate politics can only take root when the opressed group is given or tries to take some measure of equality on a wide scale. |
So you think the Romans loved all of the people they captured and took as slaves? Heck, you think they even liked them?
| QUOTE (James McMurray) | ||
So you think the Romans loved all of the people they captured and took as slaves? Heck, you think they even liked them? |
That's very black-and-white. The fact is, they regarded them as sub-Roman, which might as well mean sub-human. A dog is sub-human, but you don't hate it. You might not like it, either. A subject is a subject.
Regarding someone as subhuman isn't racial hatred? Okely dokely. I guess we'll just agree to disagree then.
| QUOTE (James McMurray @ May 2 2006, 06:54 PM) | ||
So you think the Romans loved all of the people they captured and took as slaves? Heck, you think they even liked them? |
Well, they certainly sexed up enough of them.
I imagine they felt several types of feelings, apathy, distain, pity, condescension, an docasionally fear. I don't believe that there were neo-nazi groups making political protests and randomly killing other people's slaves.
| QUOTE |
| Regarding someone as subhuman isn't racial hatred? Okely dokely. I guess we'll just agree to disagree then. |
Nope, not at all. It is posible to like someone you think is subhuman. Most people like dogs but few want to confer equal rights upon them.
Humanity or lackthereof is a value judgement often supported by pseudoscience and made with some dispassion. Hate is a pure visceral emotional reaction involving extreme longterm fear and anger.
Like I said, we'll have to agree to disagree. Well, we don't have to, but I have. 
I see what hyzmarca is saying. Sometimes prejudice doesn't manifest as hate or violence. Sometimes it manifests as a "pat on the head" for the poor person who isn't the "right" color/religion/whatever and a general attitude of "I'm sorry you're underprivileged, but that's how it is"
| QUOTE (hyzmarca) |
| Changlings can enterain us because they are freekish and inferior and we all want to gt to know one. We'd certainly fuck one if given half a chance. But we'd never take one seriously. |
if that's how they'd been presented, that would work. but they weren't. they were presented as being actually cool and popular. nary a word was said about how changelings can't get jobs in the shadows because nobody takes them seriously. from what was presented in YotC, there are two commonly-held views on changelings: either they're the work of the deevul and need to be burnt with fire (i kinda favor this one myself), or they're EXTREEEEEEEME and to be emulated.
| QUOTE (ronin3338) |
| I see what hyzmarca is saying. Sometimes prejudice doesn't manifest as hate or violence. Sometimes it manifests as a "pat on the head" for the poor person who isn't the "right" color/religion/whatever and a general attitude of "I'm sorry you're underprivileged, but that's how it is" |
I wasn't disagreeing with that, I was disagreeing with the idea that racial hatred is a new concept. It is definitely possible for racism to appear in ways that even look like kindness, affirmitive action for example.
Ah, I see... yep, hate's as old as it gets.
"Hey Abel, nice offering. Look over there!" *whack*
"Hey Abel, nice offering. Look over there!" *whack*
Just, wow.
I've read this page three times, now, and every time, my eyes just sort of glaze over.
I've seen this argument before on other messageboards, but it just never ceases to boggle my mind. Disliking (or liking) something imaginary is on the same scale as real-world racism.
I've read this page three times, now, and every time, my eyes just sort of glaze over.
I've seen this argument before on other messageboards, but it just never ceases to boggle my mind. Disliking (or liking) something imaginary is on the same scale as real-world racism.
hahah, okay. let's go home guys, Dissonance says we're not allowed to like things!
edit: i tried really hard to be offended at being compared to a racist because i dislike imaginary things, but it just doesn't work. can you come up with something that's a little less retarded? i'll make the effort, if you will.
edit: i tried really hard to be offended at being compared to a racist because i dislike imaginary things, but it just doesn't work. can you come up with something that's a little less retarded? i'll make the effort, if you will.
I'm not claiming that.
I thought that was the whole point of this discussion. If it's not, I apologize. However, I have seen such discussions where that _is_ the point.
My position is that such a position is batshit insane.
I thought that was the whole point of this discussion. If it's not, I apologize. However, I have seen such discussions where that _is_ the point.
My position is that such a position is batshit insane.
The racism parts were discussing imaginary racism by imaginary people against real-to-them imaginary people in their real-to-them imaginary world.
I hope that clears up any confusion.
I hope that clears up any confusion.
okay, i'm a bit confused. what exactly is it that you're saying it's batshit insane to like or dislike, Dissonance? because from what you've said, it sounds like you're bashing people who like or dislike fiction--a position which is, i have to say, batshit insane.
Clear as mud, hyzmarca.
Between encroaching finals and a fading eyeglass perscription, I'm lucky that I can make ramen without setting my hair on fire.
Okay. I'll try and clarify things.
I think the idea of real-world people who consider Imaginary People Racism with Real People Racism to be laughable.
I do not find anything wrong with using the former as a literary device. Using real world racism as a literary device makes me a bit uncomfortable, in all honesty, but I'm not about to burn a copy of Huck Finn.
Actually pulling a Fred Phelps and calling for the death of all mud people? Utterly reprehensible and vile.
In the current discussion? I find the idea of disliking SURGE equating to disliking a real world nationality to laughable.
And for the record? I don't care either way about SURGE. I think it's neat, but if I wanted to have fox ears and feathers, I'd use bioware.
Between encroaching finals and a fading eyeglass perscription, I'm lucky that I can make ramen without setting my hair on fire.
Okay. I'll try and clarify things.
I think the idea of real-world people who consider Imaginary People Racism with Real People Racism to be laughable.
I do not find anything wrong with using the former as a literary device. Using real world racism as a literary device makes me a bit uncomfortable, in all honesty, but I'm not about to burn a copy of Huck Finn.
Actually pulling a Fred Phelps and calling for the death of all mud people? Utterly reprehensible and vile.
In the current discussion? I find the idea of disliking SURGE equating to disliking a real world nationality to laughable.
And for the record? I don't care either way about SURGE. I think it's neat, but if I wanted to have fox ears and feathers, I'd use bioware.
oh, okay. well, that makes sense. i thought you meant something else completely. it confused me because it was completely out of line with everything else i've seen you post. sorry.
No harm, no foul. However, if you'd rather me be a slavening, tromping, pooping wildebeest on the forums, I'd happily oblige.
EDGE RUINS THE GAME.
FIREARMS ARE BROKEN.
MAGIC IS BETTER THAN MUNDANES.
MUNDANES ARE BETTER THAN MAGIC.
TECHNOMANCERS.
SWORDFISH MUSTARDBALL BUTTERY BROWN NIPPLES.
CANON.
Okay. I'm all done.
EDGE RUINS THE GAME.
FIREARMS ARE BROKEN.
MAGIC IS BETTER THAN MUNDANES.
MUNDANES ARE BETTER THAN MAGIC.
TECHNOMANCERS.
SWORDFISH MUSTARDBALL BUTTERY BROWN NIPPLES.
CANON.
Okay. I'm all done.
| QUOTE (Dissonance @ May 2 2006, 11:33 PM) |
| No harm, no foul. However, if you'd rather me be a slavening, tromping, pooping wildebeest on the forums, I'd happily oblige. EDGE RUINS THE GAME. FIREARMS ARE BROKEN. MAGIC IS BETTER THAN MUNDANES. MUNDANES ARE BETTER THAN MAGIC. TECHNOMANCERS. SWORDFISH MUSTARDBALL BUTTERY BROWN NIPPLES. CANON. Okay. I'm all done. |
You forgot us heavy roleplayers who gimp our characters for a challenge and/or to feel superior to other players.
I HAVE BEEN LEFT OUT
I WILL NEVER FORGIVE YOU
Feeling superior through your inferiority?
Just kidding. I love you. How can I not love somebody named Geekkake? That's the single greatest name ever.
Just kidding. I love you. How can I not love somebody named Geekkake? That's the single greatest name ever.
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