Help - Search - Members - Calendar
Full Version: Datajack?
Dumpshock Forums > Discussion > Shadowrun
Pages: 1, 2, 3, 4
Zen Shooter01
Does a datajack give wireless DNI control of the commlink, or not?
DWC
Pretty much everything has a wireless link, so buying a datajack, since it's hardwared into your brain, should allow you DNI of your wireless commlink. It's one of the things that should make a superb chokepoint for connecting all your cyberware to your commlink.
CanRay
It also allows for a great HARDWIRED connection! nyahnyah.gif
Ravor
Not to mention being able to run 'knowsofts....

Xiaan
let's not forget that it ties together that ever-so-popular retro look... man I gotta remember to pick up some shutter-shade sunglasses nyahnyah.gif
CanRay
Just saw those for sale the other day at an open-air market. I told the seller, "The '80s called, they're asking for their fashion back."

"They're coming back into fashion!"
Zen Shooter01
Does anyone have a page reference on that?
Heath Robinson
QUOTE (CanRay @ Aug 24 2008, 09:21 PM) *
Just saw those for sale the other day at an open-air market. I told the seller, "The '80s called, they're asking for their fashion back."

"They're coming back into fashion!"

Who gives a frag about how old fashioned they are? They don't fall off, they don't wash away and they don't transmit high power signals into the most sensitive organ in your body just because that's the only way to get it that far in.

Datajacks, they're just better. 'Trodes are for newbs and paranoid mages.
DWC
QUOTE (Zen Shooter01 @ Aug 24 2008, 04:35 PM) *
Does anyone have a page reference on that?


SR4 BBB pg 330 and 331. 330 states that most cyberware includes a DNI and a wireless link. That means you can connect to the datajack straight from your brain, and then subscribe it to your commlink, and communicate to your commlink wirelessly through your datajack.
Sir_Psycho
Agree. Trodes are for pussies.

man up and get a hole drilled in your skull.
CanRay
QUOTE (Heath Robinson @ Aug 24 2008, 06:10 PM) *
Datajacks, they're just better. 'Trodes are for newbs and paranoid mages.

And Adept Hackers using AR!

Scary buggers, them!
DWC
QUOTE (CanRay @ Aug 24 2008, 06:18 PM) *
And Adept Hackers using AR!

Scary buggers, them!


Bah. Hackers without datajacks are lame. Mostly because mechanically, they ARE just better.
Rotbart van Dainig
QUOTE (Zen Shooter01 @ Aug 24 2008, 06:49 PM) *
Does a datajack give wireless DNI control of the commlink, or not?

That's not the problem.

Per Unwired, a Datajack gives an intruder direct access to any implant equipped with DNI.
CanRay
Oh, I swear by Datajacks. And my group has encountered numerous problems from lacking Datajacks. nyahnyah.gif

'Course, the one guy that has one, the Gnome Hacker, goes into VR, they just dropped him in a dumpster and were surprised when he suddenly suffered Dumpshock when a bum started taking everything he could off the "sleeping" body.
jago668
Your gnome hacker needs a troll with one of those camping frame backpacks. Just tie the gnome to the pack, and tie the pack onto the troll.
Jackstand
Or just get him a papoose!
CanRay
That would be nice.
HeavyMetalYeti
Or one of those bundles used to hold babies while they breast feed. That would be something to see. grinbig.gif
It trolls!
I equip the datajacks my characters use with a skinlink too. Now that's connectivity! biggrin.gif
Rotbart van Dainig
You can equip every implant with Skinlink per Augmentation and main book.

Still, given the rule from Unwired, a Datajack is just a liability now.
NightmareX
Yeah, that's a rule that needs some axing

*goes to hunt down fire axe*
Dumori
What rule from Unwired? I have the book I just dont remember any rules about datajack though i havn't read cover to cover.
GreyBrother
Every Datajack allows access to all your cyberware implants. So a hacker, who gets access to your datajack gets a chance to access every one of your cybernetic implants. (Yes, over DNI, so you get to hack the Diagnostic RFIDs AND control the Cyberarm)
FlashbackJon
But with your datajack broadcasting over skinlink only, you'd be safe, right?
Rotbart van Dainig
No, it just takes the intruder 'longer' to reach the datajack.
FlashbackJon
...why?
GreyBrother
Question: Does a datajack per default need to broadcast wirelessly? If not, it simply doesn't and you only get a problem when you connect to it. Sure, it serves as an entry point for would-be attackers, but no wi-fi, no cable, no skinlink, no vulnerable point.
Heck, it creeps me out that people take "everything is wireless" to much to the point instead of acknowledging that the GM is the final arbiter to say what i wireless and what is not.
Skip
Yeah, that strikes me as odd too. Ask anyone looking to secure a system and the first thing they'll tell you is to cut all the modes of access to the device you can. I would think the whole point of having a jack is to cut all the wireless access to your ware. Now because it is not the thing to do, I would guess that most normal people and the run-of-the-mill security would be running with thier wireless intact; but I would expect serious runners and the corporate teams sent to combat them to have alot of that shut down. That doesn't mean you can't find a back door in - say through their wireless underwear. Just that in a gun fight you're unlikely to be able to shut the other side down, before the gunplay is finished.

Honestly, if they wanted to make hackers/deckers more viable on a run they should have just made wired reflexes do the same thing in the matrix that it does outside it. Then they'd all have wired 2 or 3 and it'd make more sence to have them around.
Rotbart van Dainig
Uhm, Wired Reflexes do help AR hacking.
Tarantula
Point is, once they compromise your datajack, they have control over all your cyber.

Whereas if you didn't have a datajack, and they hacked your cyberarm, thats all they would have access over.
KCKitsune
You can always just have the wireless functionality removed from any piece of cyber. That's in the BBB.

Now the wireless function of a datajack removed and no manual switch for it to activate, you can just turn off the power to the damn thing with a mental impulse. Turn it on when you need to and keep it off when you don't.
GreyBrother
What would be the use? Like... when somebody gets a hold of you and wants to stick his cable into your jack and then says "Haw! Haw! Haw! Now i can make your cyberarm go strangle yourself!"?
Ravor
I haven't read Unwired throughly, but I've always used a beta-grade+ datajack as a Glacier Chokepoint of death to provide the only wireless entrypoint for my cyberware, set to automatically disconnect if an intruder is detected, so unless I've misunderstood the discussion it sounds like a decent SOP to me, one Node to defend as opposed to trying to defend wireless access to every single implant.
Rotbart van Dainig
The thing is, any other Implant is better, as you can decide wich implants (clusters) it leads to... and which it doesn't.
Ravor
Oi...

Although not a problem in my cyberware choices, I can see why that would be a a point against 'jacks.
Cain
I don't have Unwired, but from what I've seen, trode nets do everything a datajack does without an essence cost.

And an implanted commlink is equivalent in essence cost, and also does more than a simple datajack, without the risks.
jago668
QUOTE (KCKitsune @ Aug 27 2008, 11:34 AM) *
You can always just have the wireless functionality removed from any piece of cyber. That's in the BBB.

Now the wireless function of a datajack removed and no manual switch for it to activate, you can just turn off the power to the damn thing with a mental impulse. Turn it on when you need to and keep it off when you don't.


This, because if someone has you incapacitated enough to insert a cable into your datajack. You probably were boned in the first place. Though you might have to fear the datajack cable wielding phys ad hacker. With improved ability (exotic weapon datajack cable), making called shots to access your datajack.
CanRay
Datajacks are more for the "Old Skool" runners who had their head drilled back in the day.

With Trode Technology and NanoPaste Trodes being the new Club Thing (Thus easy to blend in), there you go! AND you can streak in on in various colours and have War Paint like you did back in the '50s! biggrin.gif
Ravor
Well, tis my understanding that trodes can't run 'softs, which in addition to the hassle of actually having to wear them is a point in favor of 'jacks.

Of course, whether it is enough to tip the scales is up to how evil your DM is about equipment.
PlatonicPimp
The way the rule in unwired is Supposed to work, IMHO, is that without the datajack, your cyberware is open to being hacked directly, but with the datajack, all access has to go through the datajack. Which forms a chokepoint.
Tarantula
QUOTE (Ravor @ Aug 29 2008, 12:40 PM) *
Well, tis my understanding that trodes can't run 'softs, which in addition to the hassle of actually having to wear them is a point in favor of 'jacks.

Of course, whether it is enough to tip the scales is up to how evil your DM is about equipment.


SR4 itself explicitly states knowsofts and linguasofts need either datajack or sim module. (And sim modules need trodes to access them).

Thusly, you can use them with trodes, provided you also have a sim module.
Cain
QUOTE (Ravor @ Aug 29 2008, 10:40 AM) *
Well, tis my understanding that trodes can't run 'softs, which in addition to the hassle of actually having to wear them is a point in favor of 'jacks.


You don't run softs on datajacks, though. You run activesofts on skillwires, which can have the program transferred to them via any interface.

QUOTE (PlatonicPimp @ Aug 29 2008, 11:05 AM) *
The way the rule in unwired is Supposed to work, IMHO, is that without the datajack, your cyberware is open to being hacked directly, but with the datajack, all access has to go through the datajack. Which forms a chokepoint.

If you're leaving the wireless open on your cyber, you can use anything as a chokepoint, not just a datajack. In fact, an implanted commlink can do the same job just as easily.

I still don't see the use of datajacks. Everything they can do can be duplicated either by trodes and a commlink, or just an implanted commlink.
CanRay
QUOTE (Cain @ Aug 29 2008, 02:24 PM) *
You don't run softs on datajacks, though. You run activesofts on skillwires, which can have the program transferred to them via any interface.

Linguisofts?

Knowsofts?

Don't need Skillwires for those. nyahnyah.gif
Cain
QUOTE (CanRay @ Aug 29 2008, 12:07 PM) *
Linguisofts?

Knowsofts?

Don't need Skillwires for those. nyahnyah.gif

You also don't need a datajack. You just need a sim module, IIRC.
jago668
QUOTE (Cain @ Aug 29 2008, 02:24 PM) *
You don't run softs on datajacks, though. You run activesofts on skillwires, which can have the program transferred to them via any interface.


If you're leaving the wireless open on your cyber, you can use anything as a chokepoint, not just a datajack. In fact, an implanted commlink can do the same job just as easily.

I still don't see the use of datajacks. Everything they can do can be duplicated either by trodes and a commlink, or just an implanted commlink.


Actually you do run softs on datajacks. BBB pg 331 under "Datajack" Specifically Know/Linguasofts, BBB pg 320 and 321 under "Knowsoft" and "Linguasoft"

As to the trodes & commlink or implanted commlink replicating.

Using an implanted commlink adds 2k to the cost which is 1500 more than a datajack, and doesn't come with a sim module. Which means you have to buy an external sim module for 100. So your cost is 1600 more than a datajack at a higher essence cost. This doesn't include the fact that unless you start with a maxed out commlink (hardware ratings anyways) in your head you will have to go under the knife to upgrade it later. Now I am personally a fan of internal commlinks (when combined with cyber eyes and ears). However unless your GM allows you to start with one that has maxed signal and response then is an extra cost to upgrade later. So I usually wait until in game sometime to get one. As a side note, using an implanted sim module with your implanted commlink is 4 times the essence and 3500 more nuyen.

The trodes and commlink however are a cheaper option, both in cost and essence. No essence cost, and cost 350 less than a datajack. While providing the same benefit for softs, and only costs 50 more than a datajack to skinlink. The only drawback as it is from a datajack is the inability to directly wire between yourself and something. However that probably isn't worth 0.1 essence and 350 to most people.

Now me personally, I like a datajack. Set everyting to wireless off, skinlink only. That means someone would have to touch you to hack you. At that point you were in trouble anyways. Gives me dni to everything, and I can run a cable to something if I need to. Just one of those things. Like how I refuse to own a vehicle with automatic daytime running lights (if I want them on I can turn on the normal ones thank you very much). Or how so many computer programs now try to "help" you by doing things automatically (I'm looking at you microsoft).
Tarantula
You could set a trode net to skinlink only, and I'm sure the actual nets have jackpoints on them to hardline into stuff. So, what do you not get for no essence vs a datajack?
jago668
QUOTE (Tarantula @ Aug 29 2008, 03:44 PM) *
You could set a trode net to skinlink only, and I'm sure the actual nets have jackpoints on them to hardline into stuff. So, what do you not get for no essence vs a datajack?


Style?
Tarantula
You're right. Trodes are way more stylish!
jago668
LIES! Now that I can have my datajack engraved, it is only a matter of time before I can get a goldfish bowl datajack. So I can match my goldfish bowl cyberarm.
Cain
QUOTE (jago668 @ Aug 29 2008, 12:24 PM) *
Actually you do run softs on datajacks. BBB pg 331 under "Datajack" Specifically Know/Linguasofts, BBB pg 320 and 321 under "Knowsoft" and "Linguasoft"

As to the trodes & commlink or implanted commlink replicating.

Using an implanted commlink adds 2k to the cost which is 1500 more than a datajack, and doesn't come with a sim module. Which means you have to buy an external sim module for 100. So your cost is 1600 more than a datajack at a higher essence cost. This doesn't include the fact that unless you start with a maxed out commlink (hardware ratings anyways) in your head you will have to go under the knife to upgrade it later. Now I am personally a fan of internal commlinks (when combined with cyber eyes and ears). However unless your GM allows you to start with one that has maxed signal and response then is an extra cost to upgrade later. So I usually wait until in game sometime to get one. As a side note, using an implanted sim module with your implanted commlink is 4 times the essence and 3500 more nuyen.

The trodes and commlink however are a cheaper option, both in cost and essence. No essence cost, and cost 350 less than a datajack. While providing the same benefit for softs, and only costs 50 more than a datajack to skinlink. The only drawback as it is from a datajack is the inability to directly wire between yourself and something. However that probably isn't worth 0.1 essence and 350 to most people.

Now me personally, I like a datajack. Set everyting to wireless off, skinlink only. That means someone would have to touch you to hack you. At that point you were in trouble anyways. Gives me dni to everything, and I can run a cable to something if I need to. Just one of those things. Like how I refuse to own a vehicle with automatic daytime running lights (if I want them on I can turn on the normal ones thank you very much). Or how so many computer programs now try to "help" you by doing things automatically (I'm looking at you microsoft).

OK, as far as softs go, they require either a sim module or a datajack. So, you don't need a datajack to run softs, you can just use a sim module instead, for no Essence cost.

As for implanted commlinks vs. a datajack, the difference is 0.1 Essence and 1600 nuyen. That's about a third of a build point. Not a very huge difference, considering all the extra benefits you get. As for the commlink itself, it's easy, inexpensive, and completely legal to start with a commlink with 5's across the board. By the time you've got the hardware for a 6/6, you've probably earned more than enough to pay for the surgery to put in a new one. And that assumes your GM even requires a surgery; I've met a number who don't, allowing the commlink to be switched out more readily.

So, the trodes are probably a better bet for non-deckers; and the implanted commlink is a better deal for deckers. Datajacks don't seem to fit in anywhere.
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.
Dumpshock Forums © 2001-2012