Yes, being all lawful good and stuff. Especially since they have no internal hierarchy to prevent doublecrossing by individuals ... which means all horizon employees are LG, too.


Picador is a primarily LA based NPC? Since when?


Six years worth of ruthless clawing to the coporate top and no doublecrossing or anything. RIGHT.


Undeserved but total success and undeserved but total admiration. How is that not a Mary Sue character.

But you are forgetting that Horizon does have that revolutionary technology that propels them to the top much like Google had. They've got an advanced network of meme and trend/fashion detection systems in place that put them well ahead of the curve for any emerging or advancing cultural trends. That was played up quite a bit in the first few chapters of Emergence, especially since with their detection systems they should have been reporting on Technomancer and AI developments. In the shadowtalk the runners new that and it worried them that they hadn't heard anything from Horizon. I'd say anything along those lines would pretty much mean they've to some kind of tech to sit their "built overnight" empire on top of.

Like?


Emergence happened a good deal of time AFTER their rise to AAA, however.

Also, this again is a very Mary Sue thing to claim. The technology is never mentioned or described, and Horizon surely never ever seemed to be technologically ahead anywhere but in meme detection, which for some reason had become lostech to the other corps, probably because it used to be known as "ear on the street" and "open to new ideas". After being renamed according to retro 90s PR monkey slang, it suddenly became Horizon's sole property.

Retconning the setting to make Mary Sue, inc. look good. Is no new technology though.

I wouldn't be too quick to say that Horizon doesn't have internal mechanisms for enforcing their corporate policies. They don't have a standard internal structure, but I'm pretty sure they have something (i.e., the Consensus). I'm also guessing from how Horizon does business that if there were double-crossing by individuals that wasn't sanctioned by the corporation, they'd be pretty quick to disavow the action as a corporation and issue a full-scale media response to the appropriate channels (the shadow community in this case).

Horizon also isn't stupid. If there's one thing they know, it's their audiences. Jackpoint is a small audience with quite a bit of reach. They are influence peddlers and trendsetters for the shadow community. Keep them happy and it exponentially benefits Horizon more than the cost. Now if some low-on-the-totem-pole shadowrunner gets set up and offed...who is going to hear about that when the Jackpoint personalities are kept happy? It's interesting, because in a way, Jackpoint benefits a corporation like Horizon by being less egalitarian and more exclusive.



If that is it, I'd like to hear it mentioned more. Because honestly, I wasn't sure that was what their success was based on.

You're missing the point. If runners knew about these kind of systems existing during Emergence, then they've been around and in use in the past. Now that everything is wirelessly meshed, this system is more keen than the old and archaic system of "keeping an ear to the street." That's a pretty good reason why all of the other corps have fallen behind in trend setting and Horizon shot to the top.

I mean come on, it's not like the writers said that Horizon dethroned Saeder Krupp or anything. For all intents and purposes, I'd say that Horizon is at the bottom of the big ten ladder. You're reacting like they stepped up and absorbed the corporate court and took control of everything. For them to control a city based on media glitz and partner up with a falling country that was as equally concerned with appearances isn't far fetched at all. You're blowing this completely out of proportion.

And, trusting as it is, the shadow community buys it. RIGHT.


As in "love your new optional PC, because the devs will it so"? Yes. That's what I mean by showing things down players throats.


So the entirety of SR fiction, which all players build on, is Horizon-owned? Eh. Too bad we never are told that the rest of the world views Horizon differently. From a writer's perspective, if that was true, it would be a very shitty way to describe a setting.

The game does present its in-character material through the lens of Jackpoint. That's definitely the case, like it or not. Whether or not Horizon has influenced that shadow media outlet, I don't know. It's an interesting concept.

Again, not unique, though. The early perspective of the Universal Brotherhood in SR fiction was overwhelmingly positive, it was in later products that the shadow community began to chip away at that until the truth came out.

Fucking over the reader like that is interesting from a writer's perspective, maybe, but it is not from a reader's. Pushing your writer's pet like that is bad style in sourcebooks designed to present a somewhat trustworthy point of view to the players and gamemasters using them. At the very least, Game Info should be more neutral than this, but it is not.


Sorry, but please read up on that. London book, Seattle Sourcebook and the Into The Shadows short stories anthology are what you want to look for. It was NOT presented like Horizon was. Not at all.

@TDKNinjaInBlack: And what do you mean to tell us by those assorted quotes saying nothing that hasn't already been mentioned? So Horizon, though being an authors' pet, has gained a stranglehold on global media, even those they do not own. How is that something new?

If you actually read the posts, you'll remember that Demonseed asked for more mention of proof of Horizon's trend catching survey systems. It wasn't even directed at you. But this next comment is.

If you are going to bitch and moan about how the authors portray certain corporations and their influence, why do you even bother reading the source material? I believe it's expressly stated in the core book that the purpose of the game is to have fun, so if you aren't having fun using the writer's canon information, then make up your own schlock and deviate. I am sure you think you could do better.

Yes, except there is none in there but that Horizon uses commonly avaliable technology in vast numbers, presumably (for whatever reason) moreso than other corps and intelligence services. This isn't detailing technology, this is more hinting, hinting of which demonseed already was aware, and said so (and if you actually read the posts, you would be aware of, too). So it is without any value to the discussion.

Which begs the question why you put it there. Also, it generally is helpful to adress people and not just dump something somewhere, assuming the adressee reads it by accident. It isn't that hard, really.


Sure, but that requires group consent, doesn't it? If there is none, there is no homemade fluff.

Also, I read the books for the remainder, wich still is fairly good. But if you cannot take me criticising the authors, why do you keep reading this thread?

So, if I can ask, what is the root of your position? That Horizon is a Mary-Sue concept?

For the nerd-anger. We feast upon it like suckling piglets.


Minus DMZ, I own every SR module produced and I've read them all. First edition was awesome in its freshness but there's no way that would have continued ad infinitum. Findley's early SR books were Blade Runner with orks substituting for replicants. Until second edition rolled around with the Aztlan sourcebook, the insect spirit plot escalation, the not-so-quiet Earthdawn tie-ins and what not, the majority of the setting and rules books were Gibson and Sterling with the serial numbers filed off. And their fiction was 1989 with better computers and worse fashion sense.

After twenty years and sourcebooks for every single corner of the globe, there's nothing left to do with the setting but approach it from a new angle or fill in the gaps. Neither is a "right" or "wrong" way. Good writing stands up on its own no matter how "original" it is.

EDIT

Few concepts inherently have to be Sues. Horizon was written to be one, though. The initial idea - a media/matrix-centered corp - wasn't a bad one. The implementation was horrible. Like much about System Failure and Emergence, the core of SR's Dork Age, if you ask me. Thngs have gotten better with most other stuff, but Horizon continues to be an annoyance.

I have written that about 50 posts up already, btw.


Seems so, yes.

All right, well, I wouldn't totally disagree that Horizon is a Mary-Sue concept. And sometimes that happens, especially when the developers have a certain thing they want added to the game and they leave it up to the writers to decide how it's worked into the writing. It's not always a writer-driven thing, where they want their pet project worked in (though that happens too). But that's developer fiat.

But that doesn't make a lot of the exaggerated comments you made to support that argument accurate.

I'm basing those on what we know of Horizon from canonic and available material. If the dev forum, or writers conferences, or individual writers have different goals and ideas about horizon to be presented in future projects, good for you to know them, but you can hardly expect me to, or to make judgement on them, or what I would *like* Horizon to be.

That the comments in CE are only meant for the LA area and shadow scene, or that Jackpoint secretly is run by Horizon, isn't written there, and thus, I will not consider true in terms of canon until some book says so.


Uhm no. More like Neuromancer. Neuromancer even had the Euro Wars.


Yes. Though it took on a life of it's own with the mystical, ED tie in and the ressurrection stuff and whatnot. That was Sargent, mainly, and it ended with his demise, as the neo-80s Noir ended with Findley's.


Yes. However, not everything new is good writing, such as the mentioned way Horizon was forced onto the setting, or how Technos and AI were implemented, or the 6 year gap.

Basing and then wildly extrapolating. A couple of comments between a handful of runners about Horizon's generally good reputation among runners isn't the same as "All runners trust Horizon."



Well, first, you shouldn't consider the latter to be canon, because it's not. It's an idea I tossed out here as interesting. The former though...it's in-character fiction in the Los Angeles section of Corporate Enclaves. It may not be exclusive to Los Angeles, but it's certainly written through that perspective. Did you take every comment in the Los Angeles section of CE to apply everywhere?

Considering someone from the other corner of the Americas agrees, it seemed to me that it was meant to imply this is not only true for LA. If it had been intended to show this is a local, LA, perspective, either Picador should not have been used, or the comment hve been something like "Speak for yourselves, Angelinos."


Again, there were 19 lines to offer a different perspective. It wasn't done, but used for even more Horizon praise. I usually think such things are done with a reason.

I'd love to see an example of how this is even true because nothing you've stated here proves this.

Do you not understand that there are no "objectively" written Shadowrun materials (other than the game rules)? Every single sourcebook from day one has been from NPC perspectives. That's the way setting books have always worked and I don't imagine that will ever change. Yeah, the runners in Corporate Enclaves think Horizon is the bees knees. So what? It doesn't mean they're right. And who cares where Picador is based out of? Her experiences were positive. That doesn't mean that Horizon is inherently a "good" place, just like any runner is a "good" person. Peter Taylor may have said there's no big, spooky secret for Horizon in the near future but that doesn't mean there isn't one sometime down the road. Or that there won't be a collection of small, shifty deeds revealed over time.

Your claimed insights into the mind of the devs is a little disturbing to me. You repeatedly state that Horizon is Mary-Sue/Marty-Stu but there have been plenty of examples presented as to how Horizon clearly is not the squeaky clean, "lawful good" organization that you think it is (Shangri-La company men sent after runners in On the Run, the kidnapping of technomancers in Emergence by Horizon teams, etc. etc.). Do you think these plot points would have come to light if Horizon was made of angel tears and unicorn giggles? When Corporate Guidebook is released and the Game Information section states, "Under no circumstances may gamemasters portray Horizon as shady because Horizon is everything that is beautiful and wonderful in life codified into a group of gentle and gentile metahumans. They make every organized religion on the earth look like a bunch of wankers" then I'll accept the M-S argument. But until that happens...

It's okay to have a negative argument about a point like "I think Horizon gets too much spotlight time" (and with this I will partly agree with you) but that doesn't qualify Horizon as writer wish-fulfillment being "crammed down your throat". You can ignore the parts of the fiction that you want or just use them as background and it won't destroy continuity or canon in your game. As someone who sees readers/players gripe when anything is changed in a fictional setting (be it TV, comics, or games), all I see is here is anti-SR4 sentiments and sour grapes dressed up as a failed attempt at literary criticism.

Euro Wars were Tom Dowd, Paul Hume, and Bob Charrette. Not Findley. Dirk Montgomery = Rick Deckard.



Had to get the wireless Matrix in there somehow.

While we're on the subject of Horizon, and how runners seem to think they're awesome, I'd like to remind everyone who's annoyed at them for being too shiny & happy about a megacorp called Shiawase.

Shiawase's been around since First Edition, and Shiawase has never had a big, bad secret. Shiawase has never had any shadowtalk say anything negative about them at all. In fact, Shiawase rarely has anyone talk about them in any way. Granted, unlike Horizon, they've never had anyone overtly say they're awesome, but the fact is that for twenty years of in-game time they've avoided shadowrunner notice in the sourcebooks. Does this mean they're irrelevant? Hell no, they're a AAA corporation that's been around for almost a century. Does this mean they don't engage in horrible shit? No, it just means that the in-book time is rarely, if ever, devoted to the horrible shit they do. Comparing the time dedicated to Horizon's illegal activities in Emergence & Corporate Enclaves to the subject of Shiawase's less savory behaviors in Corporate Download and the various cybertech books, Horizon actually has MORE text dedicated to their unsavories than Shiawase.

Am I saying your complaints are bullshit? No.
Am I saying I want more time dedicated to how Shiawase or Horizon are bastards? No.

I'm saying this: Don't mistake your own assumptions about what's going on for the objective 'truth', and don't mistake shadowtalk for gospel. The lack of evidence for wrongdoing and bastardry is not evidence of a lack of bastardry. Writers choose to focus on different aspects of the corporations than you'd like sometimes, but that doesn't mean that what they focus on is ALL that's there. That's all.

Wasn't Findley/Deckard on the initial design team? Thought he was.


Ah, and a massive economical crisis is a better way than implementing new technology like IRL, which took about 6 years too. I fail to see thhe point. Also, double post = bad.


Emergence, chapter on the new status quo. Horizon mediablitz, here, there and there, and whamm-o, nobody remembers that just weeks ago, an AI tried to wipe out humanity for the third time in ten years.


Are you incapable of understanding how the previous books worked? In the past, different NPC perspectives and/or Shadowtalk were used to balance out bias in the individual sources. This was not done with Horizon, anywhere.


The latter is mentioned the first time here, the former is standard business practice in SR and on top of that was a rogue action by an individual Horizon itself wasn't involved in.


It's not only spotlight time, it's also that they always succeed at whatever they do and are always portrayed in a ridiculously positive light.


Yeah, because your bias are good bias.

They ran concentration camps, deal in nuclear weapons, and are neck-deep in experimentnation on humans for thier biotech branch. They're not clean, albeit less snarly, evil Japanazis than MCT or Renraku are usually portrayed as.

But yes, they rarely have been touched and apart from BitBR and the corp books, they haven't received much coverage, and lots of potential for development. They were prominently features in later SR novels, but what was shown there was fairly weird, for all I remember.


Not quite, but it has always been rather low profile. Some interesting stuff on them's in SoE and Cyberpiraes (Phillipines chapter), though.


Which unsavouries?


Problem with Horizon is there isn't anything but how it's made of pure awesome and everyone loves them, they're a household brand like NERPS, and stuff like this. There was bad stuff on Shiawase scattered throughout the books, albeit thinly. There is ZERO on Horizon.

I'm at work, but when I'm at home, I'll dig through my books again and try and point out some of the bastardries I was talking about. While yes, there's SOME stuff on Shiawase, they've also had 15 more years of real-time game continuity than Horizon, so there's just been plain old more time to devote anything to them.

In terms of the Horizon household branding, I really wish that had been played up with Aztechnology, actually. The books only focused on the blood magic and oppression angle, but based on a lot of the Corporate Download & Corporate Shadowfiles info, they should be the Disney of 2070. Warm fuzzy PR, cute anthropomorphic Aztech cartoon gods, and toys, you know? I'm glad somebody's getting that kind of exposure on some level.

Hasn't all of the shadowtalk about corporations in the Location guidebooks been more or less centered on the corp in that city? Why would you take shadowtalk about Horizon's activities in their own home town and apply that to a world-wide universal idea?



What he said.

Why sould someone from half across the globe referring to Horizon in such a general matter really mean only the local branches and operations?


I fully agree Shiawase could need some love. As could ZIC, Transys, Regulus, Meridional, Monobe, and Seretech (whatever happened to them, anyway?). And a bunch of other corps. But yes, a mega should be written much more about. The only mega who gets less mention is Cross. And Cross was a rather short term Mega.


YES. It sucks they invented a new guy for that though, instead of finally portraying Aztech as everyone in the world sees it. Well, to be fair, at least amoing the consumer brands in SR4A, there'Re three Aztech brands. IT's a start. Of course, there's also three Horizon brands.

Because these are world-class traveling professional shadowrunners who don't make their careers living out of one city and they've run in the town being analyzed. Because this is a location guide and those who are contributing are contributing because it is relevant to the location material.

1) mercenary, leading a combined arms, motorized, brigade-size unit.
2) rather not someone who works in LA, see 1
3) because it is a location guide anything written there, even from non-locals who probably have not the best grasp on the location at hand, is meant locally only? Then, that is very badly written.

That was Northrup. Lockheed did buy what remained of Northrup after MCT took the valuable assets. CFS said Lockheed owned "a fair chunk of Los Angeles" (East LA more precisely).


Except that Horizon did not just become one of the biggest and most important brands in the world. Horizon became one of the megacorporations to be represented in the authority that pretty much governs world business, and a shareholder of the world bank.

Should Google lose its edge on web search, it won't be shit about 2 years later. Google is highly dependent on barely a handful of markets. That's why they're spreading in so many directions right now. Market value has it in the world top 40, but every other significant numbers put it middle to bottom of the pack. Its size is about half or a third of Microsoft's. Politics and media listen to them just because Internet is still that brand new hot thing. Nobody gives a shit about Page and Brin to deal with the financial crisis, russian gas exports or the Chinese yuan rate. To put it simply, IMO, Google is too thin as a world power to make a decent AAA prime megacorporation. I'm not sure I would give them AA extraterritorial status. I mean, a few years down the line, giving Yahoo! or AOL the opportunity to issue their own passports and money, run their own legal and prison system or maintain nuclear weapons, wouldn't look like a good idea. SR megacorporations are much bigger than anything we have around now.

And isn't there a need for mercenary supplements along the PCC border with Atzlan? I read the book over a year ago, but I am pretty sure I remember there being a hot "cold war" along the border complete with arms escalation and minor skirmishes. Sounds like any good enough reason for a merc unit to be in LA.

Plus, If we were writing a location guide to San Antonio, I'd probably feel the need to pop up and say something about it. I've only been there 5 days in my entire life, but I can share my experiences if it's relevant. Same format that the other books have been using since 4th ed.

which is why we take things that happen at a level described with google and branding and amplify it in SR terms to the mega corporate. You refute your own example in your conclusion.

Indeed. I don't know for what reason I'm loving the nerd anger right now, but I am really into following this thread. Bashing the writers of the game we play in is a bit too much of biting the hand that feeds and a personal pet peeve of mine. I always feel the need to step up and defend them and their fictional realm. It's their world, we just play in it. Bitching and moaning about what we don't agree with doesn't change a thing, it just makes those doing it look like a tool.

Okay, I stand corrected.


For scale: Ares, a medium-sized Mega, is GE + GM + Honeywell + DARPA + Mars + NASA + Blackwater and it's ilk + a whole host of second-tier defense, weapons and utilities companies. Oh, and plus CBC and HBO, CostCo, 7-Eleven and an assorted Hollywood studio. That's well over a million employees, a wide range of solid, producing industry markets, and incestuous relations with the US government. Also, a standing force of around 10.000 men.

This makes Google look like a garage company.


Yes, but another book putting that same unit and character into long term deployment in africa kind of juxtaposes this. Of course, could also be the authors messing up timelines, which just happens.


Cry me a river. I noticed, but I don't think they need some lap dog to snarl and yap at people who criticise them. They can handle that. Probably better than you.


And what does your behavior make you look like?

Also, you can edit posts, and you can put more than one quote into one post. Post count means nothing, so pimping it like you do is childish.

While I understand the thrust of your point, this is - quite frankly - bullshit.

I've been playing shadowrun as long as Peter and Adam have, because I started with 1st Edition in 1989. It's not 'their' world, it's 'our' world. While they might write it, and shape the direction it takes, they - like me, like us - are involved with the game because they are first and foremost fans of it. It's a shared world with a shared history. They don't somehow mystically 'own' my experiences with the world, and I am not beholden to agree with their decisions all the time.

You're forgetting that one doesn't need to be in a location currently to have been to a location and said something about it. Picador could have been in LA during any bit of the troop escalation (which started well before CE is chronicled in the beginning of 2071 if I remember correctly) and still made it back to Africa later in the year. It could have been years ago that Picador was in LA dealing with Horizon. It doesn't matter. The point of the shadowtalk is just to share info on past experiences when it is relevant, not to be confirmed canon.



I know I am rocking the nerd anger right now, and I am looking like a pissy fanboy, but at least I'm not insulting the writers because I'm claiming they wrote a piece of fiction that I can't use because I don't agree with it. The writers don't always write what I have in mind or take things down the path I want, as stated by my initial posts that I wish to have an evil Horizon lead an AI faction in a machine vs meat war, but I won't sit here and complain about it for 5+ pages. You know what I do? I decide to use another bit of their fiction and leave what I don't like. It's that simple.




<sarcasm>No... Really? I didn't know that. </sarcasm>
I resorted to answering one point per post because someone in this thread couldn't determine who I was addressing earlier on.



And I wholly agree with you. It is the fan's world as much as it is the writers. Entire sections of the last 20 years of SR's history have been shaped by play groups and fiction from fans and players. But, all of that fan material that's become canon has never replaced anything that they've created, only expanded on it. So, by sitting here and complaining about something we don't like, we are limiting our own ability to find the material we do like, expand on it, share it, and possibly have it included in the canon for all to use and share. If someone doesn't like Horizon and wants to make them boogeymen, then do it. If the developers and writers like what they hear, they just might include it in the future. Crying over spilt milk is ridiculous though...

I'll make what I had in mind somewhat clearer : "SR megacorporations are much bigger than anything we have around and you can't reach such size in six years." Besides, Horizon ain't some two-students' start-up. CE says a dozen of "high-profile" companies merged in 2063. Google's corporate culture matches Horizon's. But Google's business plan for the last six years doesn't.

Actually, I'm okay with the idea that a number of smaller corporations with different business interests band together to reach a AA or AAA size and stability. That's already what happened with Yamatesu. This is IMO completely consistent with SR background (while you ain't going to see such things happening IRL anytime soon). A list of these companies, especially if they appeared in previous sourcebooks, would have tied up Horizon with the rest of SR universe better than regular rant about how good at marketing they are. Restricting Horizon basis to Los Angeles, while excluding Amalgamated Studios, Lockheed and every corporations appearing in California Free State, did not help.

Every corp in Calfree??? Horizon is the second coming of the mouse. Fear them. Fear them I tell you!!!

Reminds me of how Saeder-Krupp was retconned to be one among many German corps in Germany SB. It IS German industry. Except for seven other AA and a wholee host of A companies. YARGH, but that book was utter crap for the most part, anyway.


Sure, and writing @ [person] is way too much effort and doesn't raise your post count.


So? I paid them money for it. I dislike paying money for products I cannot use. If they had offered it for free, yes, I could understand you. However, sicne I paid €30 for the book, I think I have a right to compla9in when a major secion is so broken I cannot use it.


Sure, but to have intimate knowledge of the place you need to have been there for a prolonged time. Also, San Diego is as much LA as San Francisco is.


I am merely replying to pissy fanboys who cannot take me criticising the saintly writers' work ( ). I have said my piece 100 posts up already, but it seems you guys just can't accept that. Well, so long as it's fun I will keep up replying to your nerd rage posts.

EDIT to not confuse poor Kanada Ten

Sure of this ? As far as I remember, the only sourcebook featuring Saeder-Krupp prior to Deutschland in der Schatten in 1992 was the Neo-Anarchist Guide to North America. And that one only list the name as a shareholder of Manhattan, Inc. (it does not even say it's a German corp, the Krupp reference simply suggests it). Tir Tairngire and Corporate Shadowfiles were released only in 1993, and I can say for sure the later say no such thing.

LOL. And who resorted to name calling? Tsk.

Why do you feel this addresses you?


The corp featured prominently in the Secrets of Power novels, which were so tied into the metaplot they might well be regarded as sourcebooks, too. SoP even had a long sequence in Germany in book three. Harlequin too, by the way. Saeder-Krupp was mentioned in both, if I am not mistaken, and both were released in 90 to 91.

LOL. Does something have to be addressed at me in order for me to find it ironic? Or just to post my opinion?

For the record, it was a somewhat snarky response to TKDNinjaInBlack's referring to thimself as a 'pissy fanboy'. I forgot the winkie, though.

And no, it obviously doesn't.

This whole conversation has gotten pretty ridiculous.

I never referred to myself as a pissy fanboy, only that I was acting like one. As I've explained, I don't hold the writer's every word as sanctified holy gospel as there are things that I would like to be different. That pretty much removes me from fanboy status. The only difference between me and you is that I won't waste time bitching on a forum about how I feel wronged.

Not far removed from that though, I'll spend time bitching about other people bitching. Maybe it's irony that entertains me...

Now, back to the actual topic at hand, I think that the link between Horizon and the Tir is a great and easy jump. I've got a player who's running a character that's from the nobility class in the old Tir and having the option to use Horizon and the LA campaign setting to reintroduce his past acquaintances makes an easier time for me.

Oh, then there really is no Star Wars fandom.


What happened to "it's their game, we grunts should be praising them they share it with us"?


Yeah, why use a setting where things have consequences when you can use a setting that's so ridiculous you can get away with anything there.

That's so weird, I was just thinking about that. Shiawase needs more spotlight time and I actually included them as the foil in a recent Shadowrun Missions proposal.


Most def. I was rather enjoying this thread but I'm going into lurk mode on the Tir/Horizon issue until the childishness drops and reasonable discussion and logical thought decides to rear its head again.

Way back when during System Failure and SR4 development, when re-invention of various corporations was being discussed (such as Yamatetsu to Evo), I had a suggestion for a re-branded Shiawase inspired by Japanese Edo-era ukiyo-e art. It didn't get entirely picked up, but bits and pieces have found their way into the 2070s Shiawase.

Ukiyo-e branding is an awesome idea. All of the SR megacorp logos have struck me as being very 1990s corpo-generic. I know it would be budget prohibitive but hiring outside RL marketing companies to design these things would be sweet.

Yes, indeed. They sure could do with a corporate design makeover.


SR has an art director now, doesn't it? He could work them over a bit. Or, try and find people on DeviantArt.