*hands Dr. Banner's Extra Strong RadAway*

Also, it's blood magic. Blood magic is supposed to be powerful with enough "donors" and is generally not something PCs get

So after Bloodzilla it's the Incredible Flesh Tearer?

My point is that it does not spell out that it is a bonus of 1 die per 3 damage, secondly it ties Active Skills to initiate grades. Magic is pretty bad ass as it is, do we really need to make a potentially unlimited advancement in Firearms a part of this. Of course the fact that there is nothing saying he cant boost Sorcery is also pretty major cheezzz to me. It should be limited to the normal Augmented Skill Cap or be restricted to a single follow on action.

I just can't understand how you make such a fuss over the fact that an Initiate grade 6 adept can get a non permanent firearm skill thats fopping 3 higher then gunslinger adepts skill, or maybe only 2 higher, for the low low cost of 100+ karma and having to ritually murder a pair of dudes with the firearm skill in question.
It can be an usefull metamagic, i just don't see becoming a super gunslinger as one of the good uses for it.

Why just Initiate Grade 6? Why not 10 or even higher? The more grades the worse it gets. There is no mention of a Ritual, just as it does not clealry state what the bonus is. You could simply execute a couple of people. Why not use it for Sorcery? The thing is as it is written it leaves a whole bunch of holes open for abuse. Simply it is poorly designed, and poorly written.

Because an actual adept in play is unlikely to become even a grade 6 initiate, 10 or higher isn't realistic at all.
As for the ritual part, here's a quote from the description of cannibalize, witch inculcate says it's similar to
"The sacrifice and consumption of the donor’s blood or flesh allows the adept
to temporarily enhance his own abilities"

It's still not slow, at least. But yes, the rules are somewhat strange.

BTW, can a Free Spirit learn this metamagic?

Unlikely sure, but possible. It says similar to cannibalize, it does not say use the rules for cannibalize. How is it similar? Another example of lazy mechanics. If you are going to add crunch make sure it is clear. Temporary is fine but even Cannibalize is restricted to augmented maximums. I have a real problem when the only uncapped portion of the game begins to allow other portions to be uncapped.

Really? Had a Physical Adept Grade 8 Initiate in SR3...
Have a Physical Adept Grade 5 Initiate in SR4....

Not that unlikely, actually. Though it DOES take time and Karma.

As for Inculcate. Yeah, Reads like a Ritual to me.

And after how much karma is this?
I din't say it's impossible and i think even you can agree that initiate grade 10(+) isn't really even worth mentioning.

And my point stands "i can get a temporary gun skill of 12 by spending 100+ karma" isn't really some super OP idea for a character build.

Yep, A bit...

And no arguments... it is not all that superior of an option, in my opinion...

So, I looked through this thread, and googled, and if it was out there somewhere, I missed it: Does anyone happen to know what the maximum rating of the Fingerprint Morphing cyberware is? Because it isn't listed in the OOC gear information (other than being alluded to in the whole "this cyberware is basically retinal duplication but for prints in how you use it" entry and in the Cost section).

Hello everyone

I don't really understand how to use the Face Case (page 143f).
In the fluff text it is described as a face scanner/automatic mask creator which provides more detail than the Latex Face Mask.

The Box on the right only says it adds its rating (1-3) to the disguise test.

Is it an enhancement for the latex mask (and adds its rating to the rating of the mask) or does it replace it (and produces masks with its rating)? Is it one use only or may it be reused? Does it already include the Facial recognition scanner described in the fluff text or do I have to buy this additionally?

Thanks for clarification

My personal guess is that the author was simply not aware of the fact that the Latex Face Mask in the Core Book is not a premade mask, but actually a kit which produces a mask according to specification, and hence came up with the same idea. There are quite a few items in SG which read like exact duplicates of earlier equipment, presumably due to the lacking rules familiarity of the new shake 'n bake freelancers...

So just use the existing mask, the the rules for that one are far more complete.

"Shake 'n' Bake Freelancers! It's what's for dinner!" "And I helped!"

I just had this image of Jason Hardy putting a handful of SR set pieces into a bag and shaking it, with a bunch of freelancers shuffling around his feet and exclaiming "And I helped!"

I think Spy Games looks pretty cool, but then I'm a sucker for espionage-type stuff. I blame a steady diet of James Bond as a child. Unfortunately, since CGL's distribution in Canada is way more miss than hit (can be partially read as Lion Rampant are complete drek), I haven't yet been able to find a copy of neither Spy Games nor A Fistful Of Credsticks. I know I could just buy the PDF's, but I'm quite partial to dead-tree format. I have a professionally-printed copy of each of the recent ebooks.

Guess I'm just ranting/venting a little because of all the trouble I've had to go through to acquire some of my Shadowrun collection. It's been a lot of ordering from The States, which can get really pricey very quickly.

*sigh*

I now return you to your regularly scheduled thread.

I thought it was a pdf only release?

Nope, it's out in hardcopy now. The pdf was out earlier than the paper book, yeah, but it was never a pdf only.

Oops, I've been struggling to keep up. Still, it might be Grinchy's best way to get it since he's struggling to find a dead tree version

So, this is my much-belated wrapup of the Spy Games review. I decided to reformat and in little parts edit my review, for easier reading.

Now, to the meat of the book.

The first chapter is the largest: Denver. First things first: This section is structured like the classic guides of old, with a section on getting there up front, then facts in a nutshell, then expanding more broadly into each sector. Nice. Certainly beats the disorganised mess that is War’s Bogota section. Props: Someone remembered Denver is not at sea level. There actually are people at CGL who know how geography works. And it actually thinks about ways of using technology to get around altitude problems! Too bad it doesn’t mention things fro Arsenal, like OxyRush nanites, or neo-EPO infusions, though. The olympic guide texts threwn in are definitly a nice touch.

The premise of border checkpoints on every street, and during rush-hour traffic, doing high-detail searches along the lines of the old East/West German borders is a bit ridiculous if you wish to keep a city functional, but that’s from the riginal Denver setting, I suppose, and people who actually know what such checks are like aren’t exactly common (and for the record, there was next to no borer traffic in divided Berlin. That was the point of the wall). I guess this can be handwaived, but still, how the hell does the Hub ever do business if only one person an hour can enter or leave. And speaking from personal experience, one hour for a thorough passenger-and-vehicle search (including queuing) is very optimistic.

Two blunders in the Hardegraves clinic section: SURGE, not UGE, struck when the comet passed in 2061 (UGE made Orks and Trolls and happened in 2021); and there are four known treatments for old age in Arsenal. Also, I don’t really understand why soul-eating is any less abhorrent to Nagas, Pixies, Centaurs and all the other things that are intelligent enough to sign up for a SIN, but YMMV.

And it seems Yamatetsu’s bid to enter the Olympics side by side with nations has been granted? I can’t remember reaing about that, but won’t claim it didn’t happen in some book (I’d appreaciate a header in which though).

Overall, the facts-at-your-fingertips section is nicely written, save fort he above mentioned inconsistencies. Obviously, someone took a copy of the Denver section of SoNA and the Denver book and tried to figure out a way to progress things. Much more Ghostwanking than necessary, but the Ghostwalker situation isn’t the current writers‘ fault. Still, a little less Ghostwanking ould be nice, and grounding Great Dragons in general. Maybe by killing off GW? All he does is play Godzilla and be in the way of a decent plot anyway.

Denver history seems a bit strange at first, but tries to progress what is in the above mentioned books following the post-2064 storyline. For the most part it does this well. One aside: The safest way to protect data from technos is to print it out and put it in a box. Just saying. It’s not exactly rocket science.

In Denver sectors, things start to really get weird. “With Geneva cut off and in a constant state of siege, Denver is the new center of world politics.” – because what, the World only consists of North American nations and North American megacorps? That is one hell of a stretch. Why not New York, home to the Corp Court and a port city the rest of the world – which is not American – actually knows about? Why some backwater city at the arse of North America that is run by Godzilla the Sue Dragon? Few nations except the sector nations even have embassies there (they’re listed in detail a lot later). One major player in North America – Aztlan– is entirely missing (The Tir has been mysteriously allowed entry, despite GW’s ‘kill on sight’ policy on Tir citizens, as we will learn much, muc later). No European and only few Asian countries to be found, but yes, it’s the navel of world politics now. The mind boggles and boggles.

It also contains the first self contradiction. So Denver weathered the Crash really well compared to places like Calcutta, but the entire middle class evacuated the CAS sector because of the Crash’s huge effects. Uh huh. It also hires university graduates for their service industry. McHugh’s in the CAS sector must be one intelligent place for a Soyburger shop. Or does “to that end, it actively recruits graduating university students, tourists, and even former Ute nationals to work in the service industry” imply that everyone who enters the CAS sector will be pressed to work in it’s burger shops and Wal Marts and call centers? Either way, the mind boggles. And despite being the most pro-gun country in the world according to NRA haven – pardon, Gun heaven – poor people in the bad parts of the CAS sector (which could as well be the North Korean sector by that witeup) defend themselves with pointy sticks.

Also, Chinese are now pigeonholed as hardcore metaracists? That’s pretty new, considering that the Hong Kong writeup never mentions this. Is this the trademark CGL between-the-lines racism from War rearing it’s ugly head again? China, because it scares America, now is the new evil in SR?

Also, what is it with CGL and the sap-shooting trees, really.

The Hub is less weird, but only slightly so. What, only in the Hub are embassies considered exterritorial property? Unlike what, everyplace else? Rrrrright. Also, how are night clubs to attract visitors from all sectors, if there is a curfew? Ever been to a city under a curfew? Did it have a bustling nightlife? Also, while mentioned before, not a single word on what embassies are located within the hub and given special exterritoriality embassies elsewhere do not have. That should be here and not at the other end of the Denver chapter. Or it should at least be referenced.

The PCC sector is set up as a study in contrasts – expressive, inefficient artsy Ute versus efficiency-obsessed communazi Pueblo. While I am pretty sure neither nation had those traits before, it also appears a bit strange to me how much the Pueblo efficiency (which looks a lot less like the nation I remember from NAN, and more like the spooky faux state from Brazil, the Terry Gilliams movie, in being not efficient at all) is pigeonholed into something the author probably imagine evil Germans to be like. The methods used by the Pueblo to streamline restaurants, as an aside, are not efficient at all the way they are described. However, to a degree, every sensible restaurant uses them. Another aside: if the PCC has developed that way, the LA chapter in Corp Enclaves should look drastically different. Again, Research. And after efficience nazi Pueblo and slacker, artsy Ute, we get the macho, wolf-like Sioux. How nice, every Indian tribe wears their hat. Even the tribes that aren’t the tribes at all.

UCAS sector! Full of proud, gun-toting and paranoid Bush era Americans who jump up and down shouting USA USA USA. Because they can has independence! The gallery of cheap clichés continues. They also have a cowboy attitude and like to shoot them some Injuns. Bet that makes them really popular with the wolf-like macho Sioux! Also, while they have the highest wages, they apparently don’t go shopping much, because they dress more poorly than everyone else. Because Matrix shopping seems nonexistent in Denver. Come to think of it, the omnipresent Matrix of SR4 is notoriously missing from this Denver Sectors writeup, in general. It reads more like … today’s Denver with cliché’d Injuns and Confederates and Yankees. Oh, and of course, Ghostwanking.

LOL, the Draco Fondation’s homeless shelter presses homeless for info on dragons and artifacts before letting them in. Because bums are ideal sources for true information on dragons and artifacts.

Okay, this does it: “Brown Palace Hotel. A Seattle institution, the Brown Palace Hotel boasts rooms full of distinct and unusual pieces of art.” Dear author, do you know which city you are writing about? It seems not, because you mistake Seattle for Denver, apparently. It’s marginally understandable if a writer has no idea where Bogota lies (it’s just a few clicks away on Wikipedia, of course, but things like browsers can confuse some people), but confusing two US cities? What the hell did you do in your 13 years of high school?

The Aurora Warrens has a detailedly described Ghoul Meat Market that nobody seems to bother to shut down, but not a single gang is even mentioned by name. Way to go to miss on local colour such settings need. And, in the wrapup, Ghostwanking galore. Somehow, Ghostwalker unifies people, especially those who hate him, under his banner. Somehow, this city that is the new navel of world politics because it has a few consulates is provincial to a level that makes Hicksville, Montana seem worldly and open-minded. And somehow this unifies them as the independent nation of Denver. Eh. This doesn’t come together, not written like this. Overall, Denver Sectors is by far the shabbiest part of Spy Games. Whoever wrote this at the very least be partnered with a more experienced author until they can write an actual text on their own. This chapter really would have needed some lining up with the rest of the book.

Corporate Interests is better written but also has it’s bizarre parts. So Ares’ standing with the paranormal community is bad because they tried to enslave bug spirits? What? Because there’s this huge bond of brotherhood among nonhumans for being, well, nonhuman, or what? Let’s just not consider this written, since the whole Bugs-enslaving thing supposed to be ultra secret anyway. The awakened might be wary because Ares doused Chicago with FAB III, but hell, they were realy desperate. And nuked the place before, so it’s not like they had it ut for the Awakened in particular.

Other than that, though, it’s a nice chapter, detailing what all current big 10 megas and homegrown and smaller corps are up to in Denver. It’s solidly written, if not exciting, and offers sufficient detail. It also gives nice details on local corps, such as Warpdrive and Eagle, and Mesametric which needed some fleshing out.

The Culture Politics starts again that Denver now suddenly is the focus of international politics. It doesn’t even try to explain this anymore. It just “mysteriously happened”. Even though Denver has nothing that’s of interest to non-American nations. It has Ghostwalker, boo fucking hoo. After this little gem, it presents us this bit of deep wisdom: “The Front Range Free Zone’s cultural landscape is informed by the politics as much as the politics are shaped by the culture. To understand one, you must understand the other.” No shit, Sherlock. Guess what, it’s like this everywhere. You forgot to mention the sky is blue. And please stop comparing Seattle, or Denver, to West Berlin. You apparently have absolutely no idea of what West Berlin was like. It is highly annoying to see people who know nothing about that period perpetuate bullshit like “History shows similar circumstances to be detrimental to the citizens of such cities, like the East and West Berlin of the mid-twentieth century.” East Berlin never was a fucking enclave. It was the fucking capital of East Germany. West Berlin never was divided into subsectors with any sort of controls (the Western powers effectively merged their sectors, withdrew to their bases and let the locals do their thing, only coming out in force if the Russians and East Germans were being stupid). If you really have to compare Denver to any real place, try Belfast before Good Friday, or Jerusalem and the West Bank (Seattle’s more like a very affluent and well-armed Gaza that’s the size of the West Bank).

Also, again, with a nightly curfew, how can restaurants with late hours operate? Even given some sort of special permit for the restaurant, I doubt the customers they need to operate have one? That doesn’t quite check out. If sufficient people for a nightlife of sorts had exemptions from the curfew, the curfew itself kind of stops making any sense.

And finally we learn which international eyes have been cast on Denver. It’s … the Algonquian-Manitoo Council! Yep, with such a heavyweight in the international political scene being involved, Denver truly is the navel of international politics now. Really, nothing hints at that. Yes, other North American nations will take notice. Some foreign nations apparently do – Amazonia, Japan, the Expanded Vatican, Egypt, and Austria. But other than that? Nobody cares. And why should they. Denver is a local, temporary hub in world politics, quite unlike the seat of the UN, or New York with the ZOB and the temporary UN HQ, or cities with international relevance like national capitals of important players. Denver is a backwater in the Rockies that’s relevant if you own a piece of North America because of the Contract of Denver and Ghostwalker, or if you happen to be a T-bird smuggler, but that’s all there is to it.

The AMC is in Aztlan’s pocket not because of loans, but because Aztlan monopolized their food industry through rather nasty means.

Tir Tairngire is allowed into Denver? What? Didn’t Ghostwalker issue that any Tir citizen would be killed on sight? Would this please be explained? No, it is not, or I forgot something from Dragons or SoNA.

Overall, though, a worthwhile section. As is the next piece, on lower-level power players. It’s Hardy’s random NPC dump again, but at least this time some of the NPCs might actually be useful. Criminal Elements also is pretty useful – and finally, info on gangs. I had already given up on that. The gangs are varied and okay written, though more detail on their turf/primary area, and a few more of them, would have been nice.

Next is a hotspots section, much like the one in War! which was so bad it had to be rewritten in parts for the German translation. I'm happy to say this section is a good improvement on the last Deep Shadows book.

The E.C. chapter has some bumpyness and sounds like it was written by a German (Lars, were you very tired when writing this? Usually, your English is better), though I found it makes sense for German-Dutch Ecotope in a way. It's an interesting writeup though and makes me want to know more about Brussles, E.C.

London surprised me most in that it did not make me want to type a colourful, insulting rant. It was a logical development of the SoE plot and respectful to canon for the most part. I care a great deal about London as a setting, and while I miss Lord Marchment, they backpedaled from their making this yet another Seattle clone setting apparently. That's the right choice. Maybe, just maybe, conspiracy Theories will not be an utter and total disaster.

Now, Kansei and Austin are only marginally interesting but at least add some local hat to the settings. "Berlin South" (cringe) here, with Lone Star; Ninja Samurai Corpers duking it out with Katanas there. Those settings will not win the cake but hey, they're okay. They even tell you why you might be interested in them, which is something that Bogota in War didn't manage in 50-odd pages. Improvement.

Nairobi is nice to see a mention too, since Africa usually is mentioned only in an offhand way, dismissed as the home of hellhole feral places where people eat each other habitually and love ghouls. And finally, Tel Aviv, another city I've long hoped to hear from again. and it's done reasonably well (as in, SoA quality) again.

Next stop: Thorn's Spying 101. Well, Tradecraft, but that's what it is. That and Loose Alliance level write-ups of agencies and the likes.

So. Thorn is the Brit/Tír Michael Westin of Shadowrun? He sure sounds the part in Tradecraft. Thorne's Top Tricks remind me of the voiceovers in Burn Notice - tone, topics covered, their relative randomness (but at least vague coherence with the surrounding narrative). Not that that's a bad thing for me, I like that show, I even like Westin's somewhat smug tips and tricks (actually, I compiled some 20 out of a long list I found on a web site for newbie players as a quick 101 on what I think a runner should know). Spy Games' Tradecraft could work the same way, which is, I guess, what the chapter aims at. Also, some parts remind me of Spy Games (the movie), like the almost literal part about lies (keep it simple, bla bla). Hey, at least someone did some research here.

Possible Nitpick: CIA and Langley are a CAS affair in SR, right (being in Virginia)? So why compare them to Yale (which is UCAS in SR) and speak of "this country" as though there was an actual USA in SR?

Then, agencies. Here's where we'll see whether canon is getting the War treatment or is handled as respectful as it ought to. First is the UGB. standard russian agency stuff, but reasonably well done. MI5/MI6 next. Can't really remember those form London, but IIRC they were in SoE. Argus and Aegis Cognito then (given the existence of Jellyfish Intel, I'll never say anything about theior dorky names again), Information Secretariat, the CIA and DIA and all the other UCAs and CAS agencies (well, some of them, going by the current USA and it's 25-odd agencies). Short, fast facts in Thorn's anecdotal Westin way of telling things. Reads nice enough. I'd almost say this book is not overall going to stink, but then again I said that about Attitude too. And it did in the end. So, reserving my judgement for now.

A treatise on the tech curve, Technos and the value of not relying on a Matrix that is fundamentally impossible to secure (and emotitoys; not sure if I am angry about their mention or amused at their dismissal) later, we get to the NPC section. Okay, Hardy seems madly in love with teh idea of putting NPCs into his books. The upside: clear differentiation between crunch and fluff, even if they're on the same page (whcih, mostly, they are not). It's not quite ideal but I can't think of any better way to possibly do it, hence I'll save you smugness here and just say it's probably best way to handle this. Unless you want to ban the crunch into the back of the book entirely, that is. The article ended a bit abruptly, with the page space wasted at the end of the 'hotspots's ection, surely a smug good-bye from Thorne would have been possible?

Next stop: Counterintelligence. So it's time to discuss the opposition of spies as we know them. Writing is solid and sounds different from Thorne, because it's a different voice. That's not been standard in previous books and hence, a good sign. Again, the writing's quality seems on par with Loose Alliances, which is good enough (though not great). Info on the working of agencies tries to take into account that SR is not the current real world with elves, but has mechanisms that are real gamechangers in the realm of intelligence. Well, that's also a step up from Attitude (which failed to even acknowledge the prevalence of holo-TV (TriD) and SimSense). I really like the agencies covered, too. The UCAS now has something that is the Jack Bauer CTU in all but name. On a side note, do I understand this right, the UCAS has even more semiindependent or fully independent agencies than the US? Here's something I miss: inter-agency rivalry. It made 9/11 possible, so it can have horrendous consequences. It should get more than a passing mention by Thorne.Anyway. Truth dancers: interesting. KE: well, that's one of these story updates. At least it fits in and does not stand out like a sopre thumb, like that Horizon guy in War's Bogota article who actually isn't even remotely in Bogota and probably does not exist. KE's entry sound useful too for a Seattle campaign. The SSD are a counterintelligence group masquerading as a protection detail - isn't that what the Secret Service does? Anyway, they're a scary corporate-based enemy. GRU, of course. Zone Defense Force (why isn't the ZDF in teh large Denver section though?).- And the Stasi-like Texas rangers, which again made me both laugh and want to cry. Nice writeup though. Not planning a trip to Texas with any of my campaigns anytime soon, but if I did the Rangers woulkd definitly feature. A Mix of Harry Callaghan, deep-accented Texans and grey-faced creepy Stasi who bug everything and have an incredible web of contacts. Neat. Oversight Board - does it have Aurors?

The chapter then wraps up with two counterintelligence scenarios narrated by Hard Exit. It's actuually solid writing, and I like how he describes the first, an Aztlaner doublebluffing locals in Yucatan into killing UN forces, adnd how Hard Exit stopped him (through harsh and illegal in most civilised states means). The second sums up an op in Denver, a classical investigation and a masterful (and almost legal) conviction of a double agent. The kind of stuff you see in shows like Lie To Me and The Closer. As it'S titled "the Legal Divide", I missed some explanation wrapping it up; as is, it'S more like Hard Exit Tells War Stories. Niot bad, but it could've needed an editor's touch and a new writeup, maybe a pargraph explaining the legalness in the elgal divide.

Bottom line: useful. Not stunning, or dazzlingly written, but solid and usable, tells you why you should care about it, and comes across as coherent with previous chapters, and established Shadowrun canon.

And now, since it's one of the raw spots in the book, comes another chapter that really left me wondering. It has all the makings of a chapter, but where the previous is some 20 pages long, this is a stunning *three*, including a one-page chapter intro fic. What the fuck?. Is this where the missing 36 pages were? Spy Games was originally announced as 206 pages, but clocks in only 170 in it's final form. What has been cut? Did sanity prevail over madness and potted plant plots, a continuation of the "storyline" introduced in War? do I even *want* to know?

Anyway. The one-and-a-half page text detailing "extraplanar intelligence" actually is a good summary of why and how the metaplanes and spirits affect the way intelligence works in SR. That's a good thing, but does it need it's own 1,5 page chapter? Actually, 1,25 pages, since one quarter of the second page again is empty. This format leaves me wondering, even though the writing as such is not bad or anything. Why not just attach this to the previous chapter? Is this intro fic so damn important to some obscure metaplot build-up? Not to even mention that Milan the tent city (this is Italy, not Vael Dothrak) is the first major break with SR canon in this book. A WTF is due, though less because of bad content (apart from the intro fic, which is well enough written but takes place in a world that is not Shadowrun) and more because of the bizarre formating. What the hell.

Okay, on with the book. Equipment, the last section. Overall impression: As in Attitude, with some rulesslightly more wonky. Which is not bad because equipment was the best chapter in Attitude. Lots of stuff here I'll like to use, some old things raise their heads again.

We start off with general stuff on camouflage we know (and I loved) from the SOTA books, ported into SR4. This is quite nice. The rules work a bit odd, as mentioned by others, and could have used someone familiar with the core rules books to look them over and straighten them out. But they still seem to work more or less, just using unnecessary deviant rules from similar items elsewhere. I like that sidebar with the fake SIN's contents. CCC got stats in this thread; at least that. Commlink Accessories seem a bit futile to me, but if you want to do everything with your commlink now, including decapitating people and blow hit up, you'll love it (I prefer internal links for the business work and secondary external links for private things and PAN, maintianing a business and a private PAN on my charactetrs). Commlink mods are not forme, hence, but YMMV. Some of the other stuff seems really redundant, but hey, Ican still use them for brand names of high-class image recognition software. Gadgets are fun for the most part. New Spells are interesting and, o far, I haven't found a terrifyingly broken thing like Slow. Inculate is, as mentioned before, the final piece for my Space Marine project. Other than that, some metamagics seem redndant, as others have said.

One thing I miss is the ELINT stuff from SOTA. what happened to sattelite coverage, drones, and stuff like this? Granted, Spy Games goes farmore Bond than Bauer, but it should've been accounted for. Not that the Gadgets aren't nice, which they are. Overall, this chapter leaves a positive impression, as well as the impression that it could have been a lot better if there had been tighter editing by someone who knows the rules.

Then, it continues with something completly unrelated: Conspiracy theories and bizarreness. In ... a chapter on equipment. In continuing text, with nothing at all indicating a complete change of topic. Like, what? Was there no fitting short story and art so you could make it's own chapter of these 1,5 pages? Which actually are 1,75 pages, making this longer than extraplanar intelligence. The mind boggles.

Contents are: The Palantir - Quantum Communications. Well, I guess they're useful for that extreme fringe of Deep Space Shadowrun, so you don't have 10minute delays in communication (actually, we're more talking about hours with blackouts due to albedo, but meh). Number stations are the Machine God Talking To US ...? Bizarre. But that is the intent of that section, I guess. Lonsestar can search commlinks? Boo-fucking-hoo, really. Like they couldn't get away with this before. Nerfing the Resonance Realms has long been overdue to make data runs without a technomunchkin viable again, so good stuff. And finally, Skulls&Bones, who are behind everything in the world because the world apparently starts at the Californian West Coast and ends at the Eastern Seaboard. America focus much, here? Anyhows, how does the New Revolution factor in this, then? Alamos 20K and the American agencies? Mr Knight? Daviar? McBain? Colloton? Coleman (Daniel, not Loren)? Look, if you want to build up an America-centric world conspiracy, at least tie up all the weirdness in America. There is plenty of it, after all.

The placement of "The Classified Section" is absolutly bizarre. It could just have been put together with extraplanar intelligence into a section called "The X Files", where it would have been a lot more appropriate. But what's it doing in equipment? The crunch section? It's not really badly written, though falls short of a proper conspiracy theory, but what the hell.

In general: I don't really see why none of the less unprofessional and freakish shadowtalkers get to write equipment. I really would prefer a return to Arsenal-ish formating for items, and especially, those tables. Because the way it's currently done is less than ideal. Why not have Mika and Hard Exit, two posters who really live the spy/gadgeteer lifestyle, compose this section? See "I don't like nanopaste BECAUSE IT MAKES ME LOOK FAT" for proof. And frankly, neither is Plan 9 suited to write about serious running.

This is no good use of Plan9 and /dev/, as characters, either, because it is way over both their heads. And screw in-character writing, why not just have Plan9 write the X-Files section? The current writers should really use characters who have a reason to write something for their in-book voices, not randomly selected characters or characters where they purposely have a bad voice describing very important things like equipment.

And please, tables instead of copypasting sidebars. Because that is total crap. Compose easily readable tables and put them at the end of each book. It's not rocket science, you can still use your beloved black boxes and white text, just format the stuff into an easily referable format. That's not too much to ask.

Bottom line: While there are some kinks in the book, I gotta say, this is an improvement on War and Attitude. I have a fairly positive impression of the book, though it seems a bit rough and could have used some more polishing, it is not a failed potential parade like Atitude, or ... well, let's not even mention War here. Some format decisions are completly out there though.

Overall, Spy Games lookes like a book of old, of the height of Synner's era. Some rough edges and weirdness, but nothing like the total offense War was, nor as lackluster thrown together, unguided and beyond canon as Attitude was (which was good in parts and horrifying in others). It's almost back to a Shadows of Europe level, more or less (with some serious bumps in Denver, but nothing that is an insult like stuff from the above mentioned books). Editing still could use improvement, but the margin of typos and grammar, format and other errors is back to the level of older books, which is alright I guess. Still, another glance-over would have been nice. The less errors, the better the impression.

Of note: The art in this book is top notch (one thing that has extremly improved with CGL for some time now and steadily - the only thing unaffected by the Derp that came with the Line Dev transition), and especially the shaman and the Ranger in Counterintelligence are priceless as character/NPC illustrations. Not to say the other art, with very few blunders, is not rather close behind. Keep it up.

The old Tir government stepped down in 2064, the immortal elves in charge all left (well, as far as I know, having not read Street Legends), and fair corporate-rigged elections were held, with Hestaby probably now running the show. I guess such changes can justify Ghostwalker easing sanctions. Actually, that would even be odd if he didn't (unless his relations with Hestaby really are that bad).

Possibly. Though in case of the Tirs, he extended it to all citizens of these nations, which is more severe than how he banned Aztlaners - where non-government/Aztech affiliated Aztlaners are okay with him, so it seemed like this was not about the government. And it has, to the best of my knowledge, never been mentioned (and the Princes are worming their way back into Taingire, according to Street Legends, with some allying with Daviar).

You didn't think the Princes were just going to let a the uppity Democracy-Crazed Mob take over without a fight, did you?

Very cool review, hermit - and it's right on how I feel about Spy Games. The quality is ok, even though there are some minor fuck-ups and inconstencies (mostly the curfew, Denver being an hotspot of global politics, and the overly stereotype-ish descriptions of the PCC, Ute, and UCAS inhabitants), and most of the design decisions I can live with. Artwork is fairly good, apart from the second rate full-page illustrations showing Ghostwalkers attack.

They lived for one hundred centuries to do nothing but ruling Oregon. A country with a GDP on par with Finland. And there's half a dozen of them sharing power, with a great dragon watching. If you ask me, they should be kicking themselves in the head repeatedly in shame for such a miserable waste of their immortality.

At least until someone finally starts fleshing up some plot about the reason they wanted to control Crater Lake so badly.

Just a quickie about the Russian agencies mentioned.
First, I just love how the UGB, the counter-intelligence agency, is under Intelligence, while the GRU, the military intelligence, is under Counter-Intelligence (and the SVR is nowhere to be found).
Second, the write-ups are really sub-par, not adding anything of value to what SoA already had, yet coming with ridiculous hurr-durr anti-techno agenda mentioned. Hell, the UGB's ex-chief director is the General Secretary now! Surely that must have had some impact - but nope, nothing mentioned, only the silliness that makes you wonder how the agencies throwing away effective tools are in the business still...

I'll admit that at times it was difficult to figure which side of the fence some agencies went. I ended up calling "dibs" on the UGB (which is responsible for both intelligence and counterintelligence work, both within Russia and outside of it) for my chapter largely because Thorn's section was a broad strokes look at the "big names." Because the GRU is too big to be left out of the book entirely, we wedged them into the CI chapter instead.


I'm sorry you don't like the write-ups, but I want to mention that the "ridiculous hurr-durr anti-techno agenda" is something that's affected every agency in some way, and we tried to mention it when and where we could (while trying not to belabor the point). Part of the anti-Technomancer backlash in the setting as a whole comes from the fact that some of the string-pullers in the setting are scared shitless of the fact that there's a chunk of not-quite-realspace out there where everything, ever, can be found.

Different agencies have reacted to that in different ways (some are continuing to embrace technology but their nations are actively persecuting technomancers, some are going back to "old school" methods, whatever), but it's not like we were out to solely pick on the Russians with this one. The existence of the Resonance realms was something pointed out to all of us would-be writers as Kind Of A Big Deal ™ in the very first project specs for Spy Games.


That was added as a direct continuation of the fight over the General Secretary spot, mentioned in SotA 2064 and Shadows of Asia. For about ten years now (Shadowrun time) there've been faction of the Russian government and Saeder Krupp jockeying for position and trying to take the GS's seat. Because the chapter was on Tradecraft (and not Russian politics) I couldn't delve into terrific detail, but it was my hope that folks would see the sudden change in major players as a bit of a surprise.

Where SoA mentioned Kamendin as a strong contender and Baichik as SK's choice (with Romanov stuck between loyalty to his old mentor and loyalty to SK for their continued support), I put Romanov right into the General Secretary's seat, and a former SK hitman squarely into leading the UGB itself. It was part compromise, part betrayal: Kamendin's not mentioned (so folks can choose to have him as alive or dead or vengeful or vanished as they want), Romanov got the seat instead of either of his rivals, but SK still has a man who might be theirs (Kalinsky may or may not be SK's creature, as opposed to a loyal Russian) heading up the UGB.

As far as "throwing away effective tools goes," Kamendin himself was specifically stated to have been the head of the UGB before stepping down to pursue political power (way back in 2053). Why couldn't Romanov have done the same, twenty years later?

I had things fall together like I did partially to continue the struggle started in those older books, and partly to monkeywrench them -- it has been about nine years (in-universe) since SotA 2064 and SoA came out; things progressed with their storylines and NPCs in mind, but not necessarily in the direction those old shadowtalkers thought they'd go.

*shrugs* All in all, I'm sorry you didn't enjoy that section of the book, but we were doing what we could with the word count we had. The chapters had a lot of agencies to cover (or create/introduce), and we did what we could to cover them all and hit on some of the major points, to give GMs some ideas, etc, etc. I appreciate the feedback, at any rate, and I hope you liked the rest of Spy Games better than you seemed to like these snippets.

That'd all be mighty fine if not for the fact that Sixth World Almanac states the following:


What I meant by "effective tools" are technomancers.
Let's go with a RL example: when electronic computers appeared, they rendered many of the encryption methods used before that obsolete. Yet no intelligence service had "anti-computer agenda" - on the contrary, everyone adopted the tech as soon as possible to get all the edge it could give them against the opposition. That's just the way that field of work operates - you fall behind, you lose. Why should technomancers be any different?

Because technomancers are scary and shit?

Sorry, I was busy counting my corporate scrip from turning in the last batch of Technomancers... You were saying?

A lot can change in a couple of years (which is how long it's been, in-universe, since 6WA was written). Heck, look at the time held in office by guys like Bulganin and Malenkov, IRL.

Note that in Spy Games I say Romanov is "undoubtedly going to move himself into" the seat of power. Like I said, it's a chapter on tradecraft, not Russia as a setting, so the details of the shift are (purposefully, at this point) vague: Kamendin could still be alive, the details for why or how he got ousted aren't mentioned, whether he's alive or dead, or in fact even if Romanov actually pulls it off. If folks are playing high-stakes espionage games in Russia it doesn't get much cooler than a continued tangle of power around the General Secretary, the continued inclusion of Saeder Krupp as an attempted kingmaker means more traditional corp involvement for company-oriented games...It's all mentioned there as a plot hook for those that want it, and it's just some fluff (with a wetwork pro taking over the agency, potentially) to keep the UGB lethal and dangerous for those that don't.

I'm sorry that a these lines of potential plot hook and metaplot advancement aren't to your liking, and I hope you enjoyed the rest of the chapter better, but I'm really not sure what else to tell you.


Sorry for the misunderstanding, but you changed gears pretty quickly and I just misread it.

Again, it's not like it was only Russia that's been affected by this. A good chunk of the Tradecraft chapter (not just the write-ups on agencies) discusses this anti-Technomancer mindset, but it's not like Spy Games introduced it -- and, again, I'm sorry it's not to your liking, but freelancers write what freelancers are told to write. I'm sorry that their paranoia over the Resonance realms rubbed you the wrong way, but (personally) I think it was a decent way to keep the entire book from just being "Mind Probe + Control Thoughts + Technomancer = all espionage, evar!" Having some agencies stronger or weaker on specific magical or technological fronts allows a way to provide some flavor to the various areas an espionage campaign might be set in, various enemies espionage characters might face, or various backgrounds an espionage character might have; I hope you don't feel we were picking on the Russians in particular, is all I'm saying. That wasn't our intent.

Uh, nukes aren't scary enough for them not to be used; yet technos are?


The question for those two would be - did they hold any real power? :3
And anyway, whether I like the development with Romanov or not (and frankly, it's not like I do too much, minding that the role SK played in Poland kinda limited its influence, or at least put it on par with Evo in Russia, if System Failure is to be believed), again, ex-chief of the UGB is the General Secretary, surely that must have had some impact? I don't know, like increased funding, returning political officers back to the UGB where they have always belonged from the GRU? Just a mention that it's now better supplied than before, when the Army guys were at power?

Of course, no arguing about plot hooks. It's just that after reading the description of the agency in SoA, SG doesn't add that much. Yes, I understand that the word count is to blame, and that most readers of SG aren't too likely to have read SoA to begin with. Still, as I said in my original comment, it just doesn't add valuable info to what we know already, except for the technophobia.

Okay, I agree that mind-reading and technos are a problem for the traditional-minded spies. But, you know, nukes are a problem for traditional-minded generals, yet still somehow it's not like any major world powers went without them (despite constantly seeking the ways to reliably neutralize those of the opposite side). Saying "they're not using the most effective tools available because of their bigotry" is really pretty much calling them incompetent.

And what precisely the strong points of the agency that does the following are?
And if there aren't any, why are they still in the biz?

No doubt about that.

The last event featured in Sixth World Almanac is on November 10, 2072. Spy Games Jackpoint login page reads May 19, 2073. Sunshine comment on page 25 was posted on May 17, 2073, and the new item page 105 is March 12, 2073 (the first Dr. Cross memo, page 154, reads November 27, 2073, but I think it's a typo since the two following ones are dated January 4 and 5 of 2073).

So it would be 6 months rather than 2 years. That's still enough time for an election I guess.

Oh, and before I forget, a side note with nitpicking.
Sasha is not a name, despite the claims in the book. Alexander is. Or you could as well call Nixon Dick, and the Queen Lizzy.
Also, I don't believe there's anything indicating Russia is a federation in SR anywhere in canon sources. At least SoA and 6WA call it just "Russia".

Yes, we're knee-deep in nitpicking here, for sure. *sigh* But I'll try to address it, since you're pointing it out, and since it's either this or I actually go back to work on a term paper.

While I'm aware Sasha is more commonly just a diminutive form of Alexander (or Alexandra, for that matter), it can still be an actual name. It's not nearly as commonly listed as a formal name, but it does happen from time to time (more commonly elsewhere in Eastern Europe than in Russia itself, as I understand it, but it still happens). I chose to use it here, for this guy, as a tongue-in-cheek reference to a real-life CIA/Cold War mole, but it is a real name even if it's not one you like.

Heh, i know of a German tech blogger that goes by that name.

Uh, until a I see a Russian passport with "Sasha" in the First Name field (or at least read about someone actually named as such), sorry, I find that hard to believe. I've met my share of weirdly named people (and a bunch of people named Alexander), but having a affectionate diminutive name registered as the first name officially is just something I doubt Russian bureaucracy would allow, if anything.

While I'm well aware of your geographic location (especially in regards to a conversation like this one, regarding naming conventions), your anecdotal evidence is anecdotal. It may not be a popular name, a name you like, or terribly obvious when it's an actual name instead of an diminutive, but to continue arguing that the name does not exist just seems kind of silly, perhaps even petty.

These people would all disagree with you. Yes, some of them are named Alexander, but not all of them are. The name might not be wildly popular, and you're certainly still free to dislike that I used it, but it is a name.

It'd be like debating if "Ray" is a name until you see it on a passport. It's not common, but it is out there.

Funny part is, I use my full name, every culture claims it as it's own, and asks if I'm a "Brother/Cousin" (Another member of the culture.). It comes from the Irish part of my family (Which also has a little German in it, as if we weren't angry/stubborn/aggressive/drinking enough.).

It's not like it's right there under my avatar or anything...

And the reason for that would be how often Russian affectionate diminutive names are mistaken for full names by English-speakers (see, for example, this for a glaring example).
Making such a mistake in a Shadowrun book would, of course, only perpetuate the tradition established by Rassily Romanov, Il Moliniya, Dzhermiya Ogurznev and the like.

Oh, and who of those people are both Russian in origin and not Alexander (-re, -ra) by full name, hm?

Fatum, we got it, ok?

Sasha Pivovarova is, at least as far as i can tell.

Didn't seem like it, but well, whatever. It's not like it matters after all those errors already in canon I mentioned, and it's not like this is the problem with the book, so yeah.

Nope. Answered in PM not to perpetuate the topic.

1. Personal attacks, flaming, trolling, and baiting are prohibited.

Fatum, I'm really not sure what else you want me to say. I've acknowledged in-thread that it's an uncommon name. I specifically commented in-text to show that it was an uncommon name (basically saying "Yeah, we know it's rare" right there in the sentence where he's named). I've acknowledged that it's more rare in Russia than elsewhere in Eastern Europe. I've explained exactly why I picked the name I did. I've provided a link that says it's an uncommon -- but possible -- name, and I said so right when I posted it. You don't like the name, and I get that, but your continued insistence that the name can not exist just baffles me.

I'm sorry previous writers have misnamed people with what seem to be genuine typos, but that's out of my hands; once someone is named, I've got to call 'em by the same name that's been in previous books.

And now all move to discuss maybe another part of the book, hm?

So, does Turbo Bunny finally shows if her rack is natural or not?

Mmmmmmm... Turbo Bunny.....