Honestly I think most character types, if not all, could benefit from this because of the cost effectiveness in a combat situation. Phys-Ad working init and gun-fu would be frightening. Magician can still see and cast while having a nice armored shell. Hacker could kick some serious ass and when he's got to jack in a folds himself into a ball with his walking smart armor and gets to work. The problem just seems finding the right campaign. Like cleaning the Barrens.

And for some reason I thought of the Robot Chicken sketch involving Iron Man (quotes might not be exact).

Guard 1: "What's that noise?"
Guard 2: "Sounds like Iron Man. Must be about 2 miles out."
Guard 1: "Ah. Taking out the carpeting certainly was a good idea."
Guard 2: "Oh no, now he's in the ventilation!"

I guess the problem is that it's called a drone while it's not, since a drone is a pilotless vehicle and this exoskeleton needs a pilot.

Just for my curiosity, hermit, did you start this thread with the intent of showing that that piece of equipment (or more exactly its rules) is bad/wrong/broken?

I didn't intend to (and that'd be a lot of work if I'd start a single thread for everything that's wrong about Attitude).

I did this to get opinions on how rules legal the (attempted) exploit to use this as an armour to grant a superior opponent I plan to throw at my group 5 IP in the meat. It's kinda wonky and the text is far from clear. I do agree, though, that it's better to not open that can of woms and just consider this an armour accessory and not a drone.

it's probably better to think of the Iron Will as a predecessor to modern drones, a 'proto-drone' if you will. It simply does not have the complexity and capabilities that most drones do, though it can be modded. An easy justification for preventing a player from saying they'll mod it to be a worn drone would be to indicate that, even with higher tech to take care of the strength enhancement, you're still lacking the space for actual drone-systems so that you have space for a pilot to wear it.

I like to think of it more as Starship Trooper armor.

It's not, though. Alas.

They could add that to the game (dunno if, y'know, it *should* be added!), but we'd want to do it with really clear rules about mods, armor, how it all interacts, etc. The powersuits from Eclipse Phase kinda suffer the same problem (except *worse*, because they really are independent drones that happen to also be armor suits…). Anyway, it'd need Incredible-Hulk jumping ability to be Starship Troopers. … And nuke rockets, of course.

Let me put it like this: A modern passenger plane is absolutely capable of flying an immelmann turn, or doing a nose dive and pulling up again at peak forces >+5 g, without going out of control or incurring stress damage on the airframe. However, since 5-point harnesses and pressure suits are not standard in civil aviation, the crew and passengers might not be so lucky...

Sure you can strap yourself to something moving at 5 IPs. The rapid movement might just have some unfortunate side effects on your bones, tendons, joints...

Exactly. Just throw on a seriously upgraded helmet and you are half way there. Then need a talking bomb.

There's actually a pdf file out that covers predecessors to SR's drones. And they do not look very similar to the Iron Will.

Also, what I would be aiming for would be like Space Marine armour - powered armour that is connected and controlled by DNI, and worn, has hardcore stats, but cannot walk on it's own, hence Pilot should remain 0.

Not to mention WAR! But IIRC didn't they say that the reason power armor doesn't exist yet is that it is either too slow or results in the wearer hurting themselves. THis was in one of the combat drone descriptions.

Yeah, it's the Mitsuhama Chinpira that talks about power armor being "a dead-end research project" and all that.

With the Iron Will looking like it's a step or two away from being power armor, it also looks like it's one of those examples of powerful yet too slow (STR 8 and -1 AGI).

Actually, that it has been ne to two steps away from powered armour for 40 years.

It just screams min/max. Focus on AGI and don't spend a thing on STR. End up being like the guy(s) from Dark Angel. Granted that was just power legs.

Its not really about the STR, because it's not good for much of anything. I'm more concerned about armoring, targeting quirks, that kind of thing.

AFB at the moment, but I remember something in Spy Games about the option to make gear smaller. Could that, conceivably, be applied to vehicle mods? Letting them take up half the amount of slots or so? Also the part about being able to break it down so it can be "transportable", instead of having something like this from having to lay around in the bed of a truck at all times. Heaven forbid having to transport it for missions away from home base.

Another odd idea, assuming it works like most exo-suits, where is it feels movement and corrisponds to it, could your jack that suit up, throw a Man Servant into it, and rig the drone that is wearing the suit? Then you mod both. I call it the double-decker.

Boo, Hiss, makes it stop, nasty little bagginses...

Huh, that's a nice idea.

Of course, you up the acceleration on the Manservant to effectively negate the -1 AGI. Then, add the "speed" vehicle upgrade to the suit for additional STR. Have it controlled by an AI character, or a technomancer compiled... It's a Machine Sprite in a Machine, in a Machine (or a Ghost in the Shell, in the Shell). Program it for Melee combat and have it swing two battle axes, or give it a big bow... Although, if you rig it, you get those nifty extra init passes...

Do need to up the Manservant as the fluff says a cripple can outrun in, in more PC terms. But I do like the idea of that being an AI's home... The only thing is your post sounds like it was typed by Xzibit. "Yo dawg, I heard you like tech. So we some put tech in some tech for your tech to live in."

Okay, how about an AI with it's home node in a Bust-a-move, tucked inside a Man Servant, in an Iron Will, in troll-sized military power armor, in a Gundam, in Unicron? It's reaching TurBaconEpic levels of ridiculous

Well, by now the Iron Will is the only augmenting exo-skeleton so far. The rest would just be adding additional layers of armor (has been done before, with crazy results )
Also, ahem:

Just what I said
Furthermore, with the GM's permission, you may upgrade mechanical arms on a drone with cyberlimb enhancements. This thing will be more obvious than a troll, though. You could just skip that and reconfigure a motorcycle into a small mech anyway.

Sorry for missing your post. So now it is your job to start a new thread to build the AI in the Manservant in the exosuit.

No, but it is probably the cheapest and most easily available humanoid drone available on the market. You could also use a Mitsuhama drone, or if you can find one an older version of the Manservant (since it's the version 3 model that can be easily outrun by anyone with two quasi-functional legs).

I'm not sure the Manservant can use standard metahuman gear anyway, like the Akiyama/etc. can.

Frag it. It has a body of three, it can have a weapon attachment. Make that mofo look like a poor man's War Machine.

Putting a machine sprite into the suit goes a long way for the Space Marine feel. Heh.

Figure out how to make it last a lot longer (like... forever) and you'll actually have your "Spirit Of The Machine".

Didn't technomunchkins also have an extended service option? But since everything in 40K has machine spirits and techpriests talk to and apease them, it fits the flavor well enough.

So, I've become obsessed with this idea. Need to do some customization to the posture and shape of the Manservant (all cosmetic) and then wrap it up in what I assume they use on cyberlimbs to attempt to keep them from being obvious, if going the route of an AI character in the drone who can step in and out of his party suit. Well, not need, but want. The downside being AI's can't use the set of rules I enjoy must, Advanced Lifestyles. Side thought; drone needs some type of speakers built in, if doesn't have one already, to easily communicate. And the Iron Will needs MASSIVE SPEAKERS FOR ANNOYING DEATH METAL FIGHTING MUSIC BECAUSE WHAT IS SUBTLETY?!

Otherwise do a custom job to keep the man servant permanently in the Iron Will and then asking if the mods stack, like the nano repair. Then how do we push it further? Get an agent and some F-O-F tags for when you need that out of body experience to hack during a fire fight. What weapons we going to throw on this beast? I've always been partial to Freeze Foam grenades. And with it a pure steel rock 'em sock 'em robot we can get nasty with the bio-chem. Just make sure to keep the wireless of the Manservent off until needed, if ever. Could just hardwire a commlink onto it. And while at it, get rid of those kill switches.

Too bad that character is not going to be doing Dawn of the Artifacts anytime soon. Damn you, international customs and weight restrictions.

Make it a drone controlled by a brain in a jar. And call it "venerable dreadnaught"

If you think of this Iron Will as the loader from Aliens, I reckon you could jump in rig it. Ordinarily it is directed by human motion, just like a car. It does have it's own power and force, it's strength 8 after all? The rigger adaption allows it to be directed by your thoughts instead of tactile movement, again like a car. "It has no autonomy, nor was it built for remote piloting". Couldn't that just mean it has no pilot (add one), and has no rigger adaption ... again, add it? Course as already mentioned allowing folks to wear vehicles is bound to be bad for game balance... Almost as bad as allowing possession spirits to wear runners...

sorry double post

strength does not equal ability to move, its more like the lifting thing the japanese were working on for helping small nurses lift patients. The rules for the item are pretty clear its not riggable and cant move on its own.

Indeed...

Well put.

Also, as a vehicle, this beast gets 12 on it's sensor capacity. HEEE-LOOOOOOO stupidty.

Yeah, well...

While one could easily rule that it has a smaller sensor pack, I can think of bigger problems than 'PC is using too many sensors'.

I would give it the Sensor pack of a Medium or Large Drone, personally, but your point is well taken.

Hmm, STR 8 magicians who can use a rating 4 TacNet...

Kind of a Scary thought, no?

what would a mage do with a tacnet?

Tacnet applies to Ranged Combat... Elemental Spells are Ranged Combat...
Possibly others as well, but Elemental Spells are indeed Applicable...

No they are not.

You cannot target through anything but your own eyes. TacNet would never help you target anything, not even indirect AE spells.

You have to have a clear unobstructed LOS to the target. If you're doing AOE you have to have a clear LOS to the center of the area.

TacNet would not help you at all for indirect spells. They still follow a metaphysical link.

Drek, mix those with those magic targeting gloves (which I still don't understand) and then things get pretty messed up.

a) there are mage builds that use firearms as their main damage dealing tool (Increase AGI, Hawkeye etc.) another +x would benefit them.
b) while you can only target something with your eyes the TacNet could provide you with additional information, where to put your fireball/stunball. In either case I would give the bonus. Unseen targets are still unaffected by direct combat spells though.

Targeting Gloves?

A glove in War gives a smartlink like bonus to indirect elemental spells.

That glove is stupid, and if you read the description of Indirect spells, IT SHOULDN'T WORK.

Indirect Combat spells generate a spell construct at the point of origin (the caster) which travels down the mystic link to the chosen target (see Choose a Target, p. 183), whereupon it discharges and the effect defined in the spell description manifests. The spell traverses the distance between the caster and the target near instantly, but travels over the physical or astral plane to do so only to take effect when it “hits”. Hence, Indirect Spells are handled as ranged attacks and require a physically solid target or astrally active target to hit.

How is a smart link going to help with that.

Close Combat, Dodge, Firearms, Infiltration, Maneuvering, Perception, Shadowing, and Surprise Tests.



The Dodge bonus alone is worth it. More dice to not die? Sign me up!




-k