Sandoval Smith
Apr 5 2005, 03:08 PM
Definetly go for contacts. They're always good to have in a game like this. Some extra safehouses would probably be a good idea too (I know that poor Survivor has none of either...)
Mugzy
Apr 5 2005, 02:13 PM
Yeah Im definately going in that direction.
I really like the street racing circuit idea, and Im going to work that angle a bit more.
Plus, like you said, it never hurts to have a second flophouse.
WinterRat1
Apr 5 2005, 04:14 PM
Um, Hobbe, I haven't heard anything back from you yet…does this mean I'm out now for some reason?
HobbeGoblin
Apr 5 2005, 03:33 PM
You are still in..sorry i didnt reply, you can take mty silence for concent
HobbeGoblin
Apr 5 2005, 03:45 PM
It seems Sandoval is our first poster on the IC thread.The very first of my posts it helps to think about the music from ice cube's...today was a good day
Slipshade
Apr 5 2005, 05:20 PM
Got a late approval for my character, so Ithought a would give everyone a brief background and description for him as we would all likely know each other.
Johnny the Bull
Johnny was born in Cascade Ork territory. He was the only member of his family to not buy into the whole back to nature live in harmony crap put forth by the tribal elders. It didn’t take long for his attitude to get the better of him and his family sent him to live with his Grandmother in Puyallup. The only member of his family that he really keeps in touch with is his cousin Manny Two-Feather. Johnny started running with gangs early, though mostly they were just neighborhood kids trying to protect there territory, it wasn’t until his hit his maturity at 14 that he got really serious. Johnny and Manny started running a small smuggling operation into and out of Cascade territory, which got him noticed by Kaze. Kaze recognized talent when he saw it and instead of stringing him up, he recruited him to the Route 7 Serpents. Johnny worked himself up through the ranks quickly, he worked a number of smuggling runs and operations for the gang and his skill on a bike was undeniable. Johnny has gone under the knife a few times to augment himself and increase his value to the gang.
Appearance: Johnny got the moniker of The Bull because of his wide frame and bullish strength. It is a name he wares proudly. At 6’ 1” and 220 pounds of chiseled orc, Johnny is quite the specimen. He wares his straight brown hair long and keeps his tusks sharp. A fresh tattoo of a clock face with old English script numerals 1-13 radiates around his left eye. His typical mode of dress is bike leathers and his armored duster, which bares an airbrushed Bull’s Skull with a 7 carved into its forehead on the back. Three Diamondback rattlesnakes are intertwined with the skull. He keeps a long knife strapped to each leg that he uses with in rumbles with other gangs. From the looks of the skeleton tattoos on his right hand he is very good at using them. You know the drek is going to hit the fan when the Mirrored, Red cyber eye protectors slide down into place.
fuhok
Apr 5 2005, 08:16 PM
Thought i should tell ya'll about Dane
Going through the trash for food was an every day thing in young Dane's life. The streets near route 7 were the only thing that kept him alive. His father was gone like must were, his mother was an addict. The closest thing he and hia brother had to a parent was an old biker that gave them food and tought them engines and souch, mainly bikes of course.When he wasn't in the shop he was either running scams, drugs or stealing something(mainly cars to stripdown.) He loves to steal, infact he craves it. The slight of hand, sneeking the loot, the chase if you almost get cought. At the age of twenty he started working at differnt security companies so he could learn how to bypass there systems. His plan did eventually backfire when he was cought and sentenced to 3 years for B&E. One night just after he was released he and his brother did a run to make some quick loot. On the way home they were accidentally split up and his brother was robbed and killed by 2 of the members of the lucky7's. "I guess it's karma for all the times we did it." So, he went to there rivals the 7serpents. "They aught to help me hell I fix most of there bikes" he thought to himself. After a long negotiation, his commitment to the gang, and a promise to tune-up everyone's bike for free the gang found who was responsible. They brought Dane to a store room at one of there hide-outs. The 2 were bound and gaged and strapped to chairs. Dane emediatly started beating them with an old blackjack that he found in one of the old mans vest pockets. The first one's head split open in just a couple of whacks the second took nearly 15 minutes of a severe beating to finally die. After that some of the gang gave him the name Blacky.
It wasn't long after that when the induction ceremonies began.
[ Spoiler ]
Dane Underbridge human
body 4
quick 6
Int 4
Wis 3
Car 5
Reac 5
Ess 4.35
skills active
bike 3
clubs 2(4) blackjack
pistols 3(5) ares pred 3
unarmed combat 2(4) brawling
athletics 4
stealth 5(7) theft
Ettiquiette 1(3) street
intimidation 3
negoyiation 4
bike (b/r) 6
electronics 1
Electronics (b/r) 4
car (b/r) 2
shotguns 1
Know skills
btl dealers 2
gang identification 1
scrounging 2
gambling 1
small street scams 3
drug trafficing 3
security design 2
security companies 2
high performance parts 3
airbrush techniques 1
edges
apptitude (B/r) bikes
connected (vehicle parts)
flaws
criminal record
allergy (animal dander)
phobia (snakes)
Cyber
aluminum bone lacing
smartlink
life style
shop:low comfort,squater furnishings, middle security, middle space;crashpad.
clothing
biker style boots
armored vest
old jean biker jacket w/7serpent logo embriodered on back.
HobbeGoblin
Apr 6 2005, 01:10 AM
Anyone heard from Mugzy?
Mugzy
Apr 6 2005, 01:13 AM
Alright, I have my things streightened out and my money spent.
So Heres the finalized one with my contacts on it
[ Spoiler ]
Point System - 125 Points
30 Attributes ( 60 pts )
90,000 ( 10 pts)
55 Skills ( 55 Points)
Martin 'Marty' Freeman
AKA: Crash
Human Male
24 Years old
5'11" 168 Lbs.
Brown, Medium Length hair
Green Eyes
Easter Dragon Tattoos on forearms. Skin graft job on left side of body up to shoulder.
Combat Pool: 8d6
Reaction: 6
Initiative: 6 +1d6* (Adrenaline Surge Edge)
Body: 5
Quickness: 6
Strength: 4
Charisma: 4
Intelligence: 6
Willpower: 5
Essence 6.00
Magic: Nil
Skills:
Active Skills
Bike / Aurora Racing Bike: 5/7
Bike B/R: 3
Car: 3
Unarmed Combat: 5
Clubs: 5
Submachine Guns 5
Pistols: 4
Athletics: 6
Stealth: 2
Ettiquette / Street: 3/5
Gunnery: 3
Biotech: 3
Electronics: 3
Knowledge Skills:
Area Knowledge (Puyallup): 5
Area Knowledge (Tacoma): 4
Area Knowledge (Ft. Lewis): 4
Gang Identification: 5
Gang Turf: 5
Fences: 3
Lone Star Tactics: 4
English / CitySpeak: 5/7
- R/W: 3
Spanish: 3
- R/W: 1
Cyberware:
None
Lifestyle: 4 Months Low Lifestyle - 2 Room Flat in Silver Spring Neighborhood, Shared with his mother, sister and another family.
1 Month Squatter - A coffin at the Route 7 Roadside Motel
Gear
Beretta 101T
- 3 Clips Regular Ammunition
Browning Ultra Power
- 3 Clips Regular Ammunition
H&K MP5 TX SMG
- 3 Clips Regular Ammunition
Ordinary Clothing x 2
Armor Jacket w/ Fire Resistance 5 (5/3)
Handset Cell Phone
Medikit Rating 5
Electronics Tool Kit
Vehicle Tool Kit
3 Stimulant Patch Rating: 5
3 Tranq Patch Rating: 5
20 x Doses of Zen
Shock Glove
DocWagon Gold Contract
Suzuki Aurora Racing Bike
Handling: 2/4
Speed: 210 ( Base) / 330 (With Mods)
Acceleration: 11( Base) / 15 ( With Mods)
Body: 2
Armor: 0
Sig: 2 (Base) / -2 (With Mods)
Auto Pilot: 1
Cargo: 1
Load: 40
Mods:
4 Levels of Turbocharging ( +60 speed, +4 Accel, -4 Sig) 7240
2 Levels of Engine Customization For Speed ( + 60 Speed) 1810
Pintle Mount for SMG Forward 50
Edges / Flaws
Aptitude: Bike
Home Ground : (Route 7, North of Loveland?)
Vehicle Empathy
Adrenaline Surge
Impulsive
Braggart
Dependant (1 Point): Sister and Mother. Mostly can take care of themselves but may need protection
Sensitive Neural Structure, Level 2
Astral Impressions
Contacts:
Bennie Swint: Local fence and drug dealer. African Male Human. Gets around in several social circles, and tends to spend his time as a club or bar denizen.
Ron Carlson: Route 7 Roadside Motel Manager / Owner. Caucasian Dwarf Male. Likes to read tabloids, and has a thing for old Kojak reruns and lollipops. Doesn't get out a whole hell of a lot. Lives at the Motel with his wife and 3 kids in the manager's quarters
Spokker McMannus (Level 2): Street Race Promoter / Bookie. Caucasian Human, skinny, bald, and never without his shades and smokes. Takes bets on races on the highways and down the strips. Gets around quite a bit. Marty paid him to let him ride in an illegal race at Spanaway, and pulled through despite the odds. McMannus made a lot of money off the kid that day and saw him as a possible gold mine.
Takashi Hito ( Level 2): Liquor Store owner. Japanese Male Human. Takashi and Marty grew up not too far from one another. Marty knows Takashi is probably bought, but doesn't care to speculate how he has to run his business. He's just happy to have a friend who owns a liquor store! Takashi was never much into bikes, but always was one of the first people Marty showed off his stolen merchandise to.
Erica Jennings: Prostitute. Caucasian Female Human. A friend of Marty's sister from her childhood, Erica has since gone down her own path. She used to be a source for Marty's drugs, but he has since only contacted her for information and the whereabouts of his sister. If theres something illicit going on near his house, shes likely to know about it.
That about wraps her all up
Mugzy
Apr 6 2005, 01:16 AM
Right on top of things Hobbe...
Looks like Im a whole 3 minutes later than you are on this!
Talk about timing.....
HobbeGoblin
Apr 6 2005, 01:28 AM
yeah i see that...you know just becuase i'm paranoid doesnt mean they are out to get me.
HobbeGoblin
Apr 6 2005, 01:34 AM
Ok in game who is a user? ( we all know what i'm asking) and what are you using? Mugzy has in BG a source for drugs so, i know he is but what is he using? And any of you others.Also to what frequency...occassional,recreational, as soon as yen is in hand....
WinterRat1
Apr 6 2005, 01:50 AM
Lee has absolutely zero substance use in his life. No smoking, drinking, drugs, chips, nothing (did I leave anything out?). In fact, in that respect, he's pretty boring at a party.
HobbeGoblin
Apr 6 2005, 01:52 AM
I figured he was the one purist in the group...the others hang with the rasta so...i know part of what they're doing
WinterRat1
Apr 6 2005, 02:06 AM
Just a note, Lee responds to either Lee or Penumbra. He originally introduced himself as Lee, and never stated whether or not it was his real name or an alias. Obviously he withheld his last name. After he completed his ascent to being a Hardcore member, the others told him he needed a cooler street name than Lee, so he began calling himself Penumbra. Although he will still respond to Lee, he prefers for people to call him Penumbra now.
HobbeGoblin
Apr 6 2005, 02:15 AM
anyone heard from flipshow?
HobbeGoblin
Apr 6 2005, 01:09 AM
i'll wait until tomorrow to post and begin the campaign
WinterRat1
Apr 6 2005, 01:44 AM
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! My long hours of work were spent eagerly awaiting the revelation of what would unfold at the meeting!!! AAAAAAAAGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
(Note: Ridiculous melodrama indicitive of enthusiasm and excitement for campaign)
Sandoval Smith
Apr 6 2005, 03:24 AM
Survivor isn't really in to anything. A lot of the drugs out there don't quite interact properly with his system, and 'troding with BTLs just isn't the same thing. As well, the thought of purposefully incapacitating yourself in one way or another really runs against some of his deeper instincts, so although he enjoys alcohol, and other minor depressants, he has to conciously force himself to over imbibe.
FlipShow
Apr 6 2005, 02:19 AM
Tatsu is no addict, but tends hit the bottle pretty hard. He gets spliffed if he is feeling like 'expanding his mind' or whatnot. He did have a bout of speed usage years ago which weakened his teeth to the point that they were completely knocked out during a boxing match at a youth club in Japan.
Since he has been in the Serpents, he had a a pretty wicked 7 day long runner using injected meth... he led a serious hit against a triad warehouse on the docks, they had been infringing on the Serpents turf with chopshop activity and had sent some pretty violent warnings back to our gang. Tatsu was strung out and bloodthirsty. After this murderous rampage the problem was solved, and Tatsu has not touched speed since.
Outside of that, he's not big on BTLs or anything. Thanks for listening.
Cydlexia
Apr 6 2005, 03:48 AM
Well The rasta will fess up to his gonga habit's... but they are more of a Geas.. Either way he use's and he use's alot.. He is kindy dirty as well, and find's no problem sleeping with Prostitutes even the ones who have been with trolls...
(as long as their not trolls themselves... No offence Mitch not a race thing... but Rasta's only 120lbs wet and a 250lbs troll bouncing around on him will most likely throw out his back.)
I quess that could turn into an addiction, we will see. Not dangerous really since all STD's where purged and cures found for them. But it can be just as expensive.
Oh' and I will say this is the first time I have ever played here and I like the story telling freeedom... Real fun...
Mugzy
Apr 6 2005, 06:24 AM
Crash will take jusat about anything should someone give it to him, but his substance of choice is Zen. It slows him down a bit ( he doesnt care) and it makes the light from the city blend together. He uses it recreationally, and also has a think for the kinds of speed out there as well, using it when he has to be 'at top of his game"
Slipshade
Apr 6 2005, 02:48 PM
Alcohol and the occational blunt here. Tried Cram a few times, but didn't care for it much.
HobbeGoblin
Apr 6 2005, 05:40 PM
Ok I have sent out PM's to a couple players that their answers determine how i write this next segment. From a true roleplaying stand point it is important that i get their answers and incorporate them into the story/post.That is the hold up and I apologize but, i believe you all will enjoy, and the wait will be worth it in terms of the story.
on a side note...please answer quickly
Cydlexia
Apr 6 2005, 06:56 PM
FlipshowNow if the ocean is pulling you this way and that, landing you on a destined beach, what can you do to change it, for the better? Become a surfer? Paddle out and choose the next spot you land? There's some control. Or what if you steal a boat and travel further? The next beach you choose could be further away, present you with more choices. He looked around and thought that there was no need for any that, he knew these others and he knew this beach. This is the place where he should make a difference. It all made a sort of sense. Sort of. Lol ... perfect... I dug the answer. That is on the same lines in my head why I posted the question.. OOC: this rasta believes the same thing... Notice how he hints at Sortilege and whether or not all truths are real... it is a struggle I am trying to make in character (noticed) that even though sometime he see the future. could it not be changed, or is what he see's the way things are or does the knowledge of knowing the future, allow him and others to change it. An if he knows the future and it is true should he tell others the truth of what it holds. And would they change it, and would that totaly just F%$k up that balance and the whole cycle of
reality... ( kinda deep, did alot of substances when I was a kid I guess... don't be point'in any fingers either there fuhok/beav)
that is OOC: to why he see's things that are to come... but leaves it cryptic, so if you change it it's not because he told you too... He just doesn't want to have his name on in it when the whole Sh** house come's falling down ( if that is what happens
)
FlipShow
Apr 6 2005, 08:18 PM
That is a hard spot, foreseeing disaster for someone but not being sure if you or they can act to change it. That would definitely twist your sense of reality around.
I like the foreboding words constantly spewing forth from Henni.
Yeah, Tatsu is one of those who refuses too leave his life to fate. He's more proactive.
Oh here comes some GM action!
HobbeGoblin
Apr 6 2005, 07:16 PM
Okay i posted.Once everyone has posted, i will continue on with the story. I hope we are enjoying the story.
Mugzy
Apr 6 2005, 09:48 PM
Hobbe- quick question - 4 stroke - Is he unconscious at this point or still awake and wimpering?
Slipshade
Apr 6 2005, 10:11 PM
QUOTE |
.....plus he rides a Rapier. What a douchebag. |
LOL!
FlipShow
Apr 6 2005, 09:29 PM
Yeah that was good stuff. Cracked me up too.
HobbeGoblin
Apr 6 2005, 10:22 PM
Alive, wimpering, begging,crying,praying.Its a hard life and a hard discision chummer
HobbeGoblin
Apr 6 2005, 10:23 PM
glad to see you roleplaying this big decision.
HobbeGoblin
Apr 7 2005, 02:06 AM
There is more to come so, dont leave the rooftop and, i apologize to Kiedo for just grabbing up his character....it was for plot driving, and to speed things along.
Cydlexia
Apr 7 2005, 02:00 AM
yeah... all that foreboding will get old quick, but thats even better. All foretune tellers have their annoying ways of seeing doom under every cloud or the you're going to die if you... stuff. I never really play Diviner's this is acually my first. SR give's you some pretty cool spells and powers to play one. So we will see.
Even if it does get bad, in his defense like most magic users they fill that 1% tile catagory. Plus when your on a run it's always nice to know what's around that corner before you take it. An I like the post's the story is weaving nicely. Beav you are one sick puppy I might add but thats what I would have expected.
Cydlexia
Apr 7 2005, 02:02 AM
At least you didn't run up and start poking the body with a stick... lol
Slipshade
Apr 7 2005, 03:21 PM
Heh
HobbeGoblin
Apr 7 2005, 03:29 PM
I have GM'ed for alot of years (not on this medium) and i have to say i am impressed with the roleplaying here. Contrary to belief i am not easily impressed so, great job everyone.
HobbeGoblin
Apr 7 2005, 05:40 PM
Hey, I'm new to this way of playing so....If in game you are meeting with another pc you can post in spoilers or pm(i'd like a copy of the pm's though) i'm not sure what is the best way, but i will leave that up to the veteran players here to show us the best way.
Slipshade
Apr 7 2005, 04:41 PM
I tend to PM if I really want to keep a conversation a secret or spoiler it if I don't care if others read it, but the information therein doesn't really pertain to them.
Slipshade
Apr 7 2005, 11:08 PM
Anyone else having problems with PMs?
Turns out the PMs may be getting through even though it doesn't look like they are, so my appologize Hobbe if you have like 10 PMs from me.
FlipShow
Apr 8 2005, 01:04 AM
Yeah, I was having some problems firing off a PM too.
Sorry if you received 16 messages, Hobbegoblin.
HobbeGoblin
Apr 8 2005, 01:20 AM
i only got 20 total
FlipShow
Apr 8 2005, 01:51 AM
Damn, Legion's got voices in his head. Was half of that conversation out loud?
Good stuff.
WinterRat1
Apr 8 2005, 02:29 AM
A couple of points or questions.
1. Hobbe, is it possible to get that spoiler with the compiled information about the gang up in the near future?
2. Can you let me know what's on the P-sec? Any and all relevant data, including numbers would be necessary.
3. A few suggestions for smoothness:
A) Is there any objection to making it offical policy to use the common convention BOLD for proper names and/or places, and [I]ITALICS[B] for inner monologue/thoughts? I notice some of us are and some of us are not, and some are using one convention but not the other, I think by now most of us are, but I thought it might help to have all that agreed on up front.
B) Would anyone object to using the time/data stamps as standard practice? I've found it helps in situations like the one we just went through, where we obviously can't all post as the action flows. This way, when someone goes back and posts what happened say during the shooting (using the recent example) and then skips forward or catches up to where the overall story currently is at, it helps keep things straight. Additionally, when trying to sort out the order of who said what when, I have found it helps make it easier to sort things out so the conversation can be clearly followed. It hasn't happened yet, but I can almost guarantee that given enough time, due to posting lag and what not, we'll have to clarify who said or did what to who at what time, and that is a lot easier to sort out if we can see everyone's intented actions/words at the intended time due to the stamps.
C) For private or personal conversations, I suggest that unless it is for an OOC correspondence or absolutely necessary, we simply post everything normally. My reasons are several:
1. It appears that our focus of this game is not a short lived adventure in which success or failure will be clearly defined, but rather the development of a story throughout an ongoing campaign. As such, it greatly adds to the enjoyment of all players when we are all aware of and can read and follow each other's stories.
2. The only reason not to post publicly is fear of metagaming. However, it appears that at least several people know each other and have played together before, so it seems Hobbe has a handle on at least some of us already? Also, given the respect to each other we're all mature role-players, hopefully we can trust each other not to diminsh the overall enjoyment of the game for a temporary advantage in a particular situation?
3. If a situation comes up where metagaming may or may not have happened, can we all agree to trust Hobbe to resolve it appropriately?
For example, I deliberately posted my last post the way I did to illustrate a possible example of metagaming. Lee is reacting to something he sees in Legion; the question is, did Lee the character see this or did WinterRat1 the player know this from reading Kiedo's post and then responding as I did? I chose this because I figured that no harm would result either way, and thus it would be a safe example.
There are generally two main possibilities when the question of metagaming arises:
1. There is a legitimate chance that the character could have this knowledge.
2. There is no legitimate chance that the character could have this knowledge.
It is perfectly plausible that Lee simply noticed this. If no one (particularly Kiedo or Hobbe) has a problem with what happened, then we can simply let it lie and assume that I acted within the boundaries of my discretion as a player. However, if either Kiedo or Hobbe feels I may have acted inappropriately, there are several possibilities:
A) If they (particularly Hobbe, making a GM call) feel Lee might have made the observation/have the knowledge he acted upon, I may be asked to roll a perception test to see if Lee actually did notice this, with failure meaning I would edit my post accordingly.
B) If they (again, particularly Hobbe making a GM call) feel there is no legitimate chance that Lee could have this knowledge, it could be opened for discussion and explanation on both sides.
C) Hobbe could rule there's no way at all Lee could have this knowledge, and ask me to edit my post accordingly to reflect that.
In any interaction in this medium, there is always the chance for misinterpretation and wrong actions; in my experience, the key to handling it is to provide the most enjoyment possible through the development of the story for the players, and police the (hopefully few) missteps (usually inadvertant) that may occur as they arise. I believe it would enhance all of our enjoyment of the game if we got to see the characters in their entirety, and respected and trusted one another enough not to endanger that enjoyment by reacting inappropriately (metagaming) for the sake of a temporary 'edge'. Thoughts and feedback please?
HobbeGoblin
Apr 8 2005, 02:53 AM
Ok, my answers:
1. Yes i'll post that info in a spoiler, my bad i should have done it earlier.
2. I'll pm you on the contents of the p-sec.
3. All good suggestions, this is my first time in this medium so any help is greatly appreciated.
And as far as your observations( winter) from your pc'
s discription/background, and the way you have played him thus far; i have decided you watch everything so, noticing a troll concentrating instead of drooling and looking vacant is well within...your capabilities.
Cydlexia
Apr 8 2005, 03:40 AM
I will say from my spell casting aspect.. I might have let players into alot, of the behind the minds eye stuff with the Rasta... but I will always do that... just next time I think it will be in Spoilers... like THE SIXTH WORLD... so if you wish to see what my take on magic that is working in a metaphysical state you can. But if you really don't care thats ok to.. the Spoiler's will condence it and make things seem like they went on as usual... I edited' my post (during the Story driving post) to the way it should have run, if you want an example...
And yea I have no Prob with the Proper name in bold.. and thought in italics that can oraganize things easly enough...
HobbeGoblin
Apr 8 2005, 04:44 PM
Since we are playing an amoral campaign do we want to use the rules for an amoral campaign..ie. cash for kharma?
I am perfectly happy awarding kharma ( and i will for..participation,good role playing etc.)
This is up for a vote. I WILL BE AWARDING KHARMA ALSO.
Slipshade
Apr 8 2005, 04:45 PM
That's fine by me.
Slip
Mugzy
Apr 8 2005, 04:57 PM
Well, besides Karma for Cash, what other rules are there for the amoral campaign that we'd be utilizing?
Personally, I don't think we are completly an amoral campaign. We have our spots, as do all Shadowrun games I suppose, though. (Dane's glee at the brain splatter comes to mind)
Everyone's been doing a great job with their character development though, and I think our RP should be our primary source for Karma. Besides, the amount of cash needed for the Karma for Cash system may be too much for our street level game.
But I'm open to all options, really. Consider me a neutral vote.
Cydlexia
Apr 8 2005, 05:32 PM
I stopped by Hobbe's and talked with him about that yesterday... So I guess that's why he brough the Amoral ( cash for karma ) up... Yet talking with him and seeing Mugz's post I am in agreence with Crash)) I mean if we are getting loot, then having to bump up over half to the "Higher Powers" ( that is unless ya' to skim abit for yourself, but if you get caught end up like pore ole' 4-stoke ) then having the rest go to poral ( for those who are clipped like me self ) what little bit of money I got left, I would hate to think I have to spend on Karma...
So i am voting (NO)... I would like to get Karma like Exp:
and keep my cash.....
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