I'm discussing the rules with a few friends and while we've determined that hacking an individual PAN is not going to be a common practice used against the 'runners (it's difficult, and, it's not that useful compared to other things a security guy could do), the problem that comes up is this:
Even though the risk is minimal, if you're Joe Samurai or any non-rigger/hacker character, why on Earth would you take the risk *at all* of linking your devices (and especially your cyberware) up to a commlink and thus rendering it hackable?
Setting aside for the nonce the social reasons (everybody's doing it), to some, there would appear to be precious little reason to link *ANY* devices to a PAN, even if they had max firewall and IC and such out the wazoo. Smartlinks can be done with contact lenses and a skinlink, most other devices can be done with a skinlink, your cyberware all appears to work just fine without a commlink and with regards to each other, etcetera.
Off the top of my head there are only a VERY few situations you'd absolutely need something wireless despite the risks involved (and I am researching this but soliciting help here):
* You could possibly have set up with your commlink, if you wanted, to trigger stuff via an agent/frame to operate your 'ware/devices on autopilot if you went unconscious. (but you could just load the frame into the device itself), like a medkit in a cyberleg that automatically tried to first aid you if you went down.
* You need a wireless link if you have an Ocular Drone.
* The AR rules on page 208 say that the GM might grant a bonus of +1 to +3 (or penalty of -1 to -3) for actions where AR was appropriate and one presumes you had the correct tool. This might apply to certain pieces of cyberware.
However, none of this stuff seems to be all that big of a deal compared to the risks. There seems to be no /drawback/ to not being wireless, only some slight benefits, and lots of risks. So: Why?
Full Version: Why Go Wireless?
Well first off. All devices for the most part are wireless by default to begin with. Don't want to route your gun into your PAN? Thats fine, unless you turn off that wonderful wireless chip in there, which you could do, it can be hacked regardless of wether or not you link it to your PAN, its just easier to do it if its not linked there.
The skin link i'm not sure how i'd have that work so lets put that aside.
Advantages of wireless stuff.
AR for one. Arrows are extreamly usefull.
Say your team is split up for whatever reason, or you want to give your rigger a idea of whats happening, ie guncam from the smartlink. Well if you're not wireless can't be done. Can't show him or the rest of your team what you're seeing when you put the barrel of your gun around the corner.
As for say your cyberarm? All depends on whats in it and what you're doing with it.
Whats the advantage of not being wireless.
You can't be hacked.
And thats about the only one I can think of.
Theres a wide variety of things where the wireless matrix and wireless links can give you a advantage. You just have to think about them and what you might be able to do.
The skin link i'm not sure how i'd have that work so lets put that aside.
Advantages of wireless stuff.
AR for one. Arrows are extreamly usefull.
Say your team is split up for whatever reason, or you want to give your rigger a idea of whats happening, ie guncam from the smartlink. Well if you're not wireless can't be done. Can't show him or the rest of your team what you're seeing when you put the barrel of your gun around the corner.
As for say your cyberarm? All depends on whats in it and what you're doing with it.
Whats the advantage of not being wireless.
You can't be hacked.
And thats about the only one I can think of.
Theres a wide variety of things where the wireless matrix and wireless links can give you a advantage. You just have to think about them and what you might be able to do.
I think he means wireless PAN, which I agree isn't worth the risk for the reward when there are other means to go about keeping all your little toys connected to your commlink, which itself can be wireless and overseen by your decker.
This is correct: why is samurai guy gonna link anything to his commlink, like his wired reflexes or his cyber-whatever? That's the question. It implies that this is a good thing to do ("You can always temporarily or permanently disable wireless features, but it may mean a substantial loss of functionality putting you at a disadvantage.", sidebar, page 224) but it never once so far as I can tell enumerates any sort of loss of functionality whatsoever that can't be easily made up for with skinlinks, goggles, glasses, et. al.
So, help.
So, help.
The answer is easy: the professional who has to assume that he will be attacked in different ways will try to minimize his weak spots. Lot of Runners, Bodyguards etcs will not use wireless PANs, but wired ar skinlinked PANs. That´s ok, there is enough other wireless PAN and other communication available to hack. In some ways, wireless is like reallife radio communication. Often it is ok to speak, but in some situations you need to maintain radio silence.
Btw: you do not need to be online if you want to have AR. You need to be online if you want an AR and a possibility to interact with the area around you (or your team, for example with interactive maps of a building). You do not need to be online if you are repairing a vehicle and use AR to overlay the construction blueprints over the vehicle and create a 3D-model of the car.
And yes, most cyberware will not be online. If is for Joe 2070 just so ... easy to download all these updates and patches ... think M$-Windows XP Auto-Update.
Btw: you do not need to be online if you want to have AR. You need to be online if you want an AR and a possibility to interact with the area around you (or your team, for example with interactive maps of a building). You do not need to be online if you are repairing a vehicle and use AR to overlay the construction blueprints over the vehicle and create a 3D-model of the car.
And yes, most cyberware will not be online. If is for Joe 2070 just so ... easy to download all these updates and patches ... think M$-Windows XP Auto-Update.
| QUOTE ("SR4 304") |
TURNING IT OFF While wireless functionality is convenient, it is also a security risk. The drawback to being able to save files on your favorite rifle or cyberarm is that it might get hacked. Wireless devices also tend to leave a datatrail as they interact with other networks around you (one good reason to operate in hidden mode and keep everything in your PAN slaved to your commlink). Being careless with that can lead to someone tracking you down or pinpointing you at the scene of a crime. One way to prevent this is to load your devices up with IC and encryption—courtesy of your team’s hacker—but another might be to simply turn it off. Any device’s wireless capability can be turned off with a simple command. Of course, that means it needs to be turned back on manually, unless you set it to reactivate at a specified time. |
SYL
See, Apple, your statements are the ones I'm hearing as to why to get things that aren't wireless.
However, the *game itself* implies that not having wireless stuff is seen as retro and stupid, essentially--cyberware included. Yes it says you should turn off some things, but it also says that you'll lose functionality if you do, and it vaguely implies that you might get bonuses if you keep things hooked up.
I don't need anyone to tell me why NOT to go wireless. I need people to tell me why folks WOULD!
However, the *game itself* implies that not having wireless stuff is seen as retro and stupid, essentially--cyberware included. Yes it says you should turn off some things, but it also says that you'll lose functionality if you do, and it vaguely implies that you might get bonuses if you keep things hooked up.
I don't need anyone to tell me why NOT to go wireless. I need people to tell me why folks WOULD!
| QUOTE (Shayd) |
| I don't need anyone to tell me why NOT to go wireless. I need people to tell me why folks WOULD! |
Maybe because, in the game world, not everyone is aware of the super-elite Hacker ability to screw with them. Most people would never run into any of these problems in their lives.
Even (non-Hacker) runners should not necessarily be privy to the possible pitfalls unless they have some kind of first-hand knowledge on the subject, or their Hacker friend tells them (and whom they may or may not believe).
Think of how many people today sit in coffee houses, wireless connecting to the broadband gateway, unaware of the security risks it presents to their data. Or people who go to links that data-mine from their computer for advertising. People do it for convenience, and most folks aren't worried about their electronics being used against them. Every time you send your personal information online, every time you connect wirelessly to a public broadband gateway, etc.
| QUOTE (Shayd) |
| I don't need anyone to tell me why NOT to go wireless. I need people to tell me why folks WOULD! |
Or, simply, the costs of going wired would outweigh the benefits, which for many runners would be limited. For most of a runner's typical gear, the signal range is <3m. For a hacker to attempt to isolate and brute-force into a sammie's wires she'd have to get very close. Typically when trying to hack a PAN a hacker would go through the commlink, the PAN's hub. Once the commlink is compromised it wouldn't matter how the other devices are connected, so skinlinks are mostly pointless at that point.
Then just what are Skinlinks good for?
this i think was coverd in a diffrent thread some time ago i think and the best explanation i have seen is ease of use.
just look at people today setting up wifi equipment and talking in bluetooth headsets (and now that they can allso be used as usable stereo headsets for your portable music player as well as a handsfree its even more interesting).
ie, joe wageslave will know jack about the security risks, just like your RL joe finding out about the ability to surf the net from anywhere inside his house or appartment by the help of one little box.
so most likely you will not see pros going wireless. but that punk that thinks he is hot from getting some contacts, the right programs and a gun will.
i may come up with a better set of reason ones i have had a look at the full set of equipment and how many of them that can be used while having clean skin contact. for those that cant there are two options, wireless or wired. and the former is more practical if your unaware or dont care about the security issue.
so most likely a runner will not allow his guns and other important gear to be used in wireless mode but some of the more throw away stuff may well be accessed thru wireless.
just look at people today setting up wifi equipment and talking in bluetooth headsets (and now that they can allso be used as usable stereo headsets for your portable music player as well as a handsfree its even more interesting).
ie, joe wageslave will know jack about the security risks, just like your RL joe finding out about the ability to surf the net from anywhere inside his house or appartment by the help of one little box.
so most likely you will not see pros going wireless. but that punk that thinks he is hot from getting some contacts, the right programs and a gun will.
i may come up with a better set of reason ones i have had a look at the full set of equipment and how many of them that can be used while having clean skin contact. for those that cant there are two options, wireless or wired. and the former is more practical if your unaware or dont care about the security issue.
so most likely a runner will not allow his guns and other important gear to be used in wireless mode but some of the more throw away stuff may well be accessed thru wireless.
You cannot jam a skin link.
Jamming aside (which is a very valid concern), most of these reasons are a bit overhyped.
It helps if you think of the commlink as a sort of DMZ for the PAN. The PAN is an enclosed network, with the comm as it's hub. PAN devices communicate only with the commlink, and receive information only from the commlink. The commlink in turn relays info to other PAN devices and to the network at large (WAN). To compromise a user's PAN involves first compromising the commlink. This is why good Firewall and Stealth programs are good not just for the team Hacker but for everyone with a commlink. These sorts of attacks on the user's commlink require the user to be connected to the WAN, but otherwise don't care how a user connects the devices to the commlink to form the PAN.
The other method hackers can use compromises not the entire PAN, but a single device on it. To do this the hacker muast be able to sniff out the device's connection to the commlink and exploit or spoof their way into the device. This requires that the hacker be within signal range of the device in question. Almost all of these devices have extremely short ranges, usually <3 meters.
Therefore, in order for the hacker to get access to your gun, she would have to either:
A. gain admin-level access to your commlink (at which point it doesn't matter how you connect devices to it) which requires that your commlink be visible to the WAN and able to accept requests or
B. get within signal range of your gun, sniff out it's communication and hack into admin-level access on the fly, all while within arms reach of you.
It helps if you think of the commlink as a sort of DMZ for the PAN. The PAN is an enclosed network, with the comm as it's hub. PAN devices communicate only with the commlink, and receive information only from the commlink. The commlink in turn relays info to other PAN devices and to the network at large (WAN). To compromise a user's PAN involves first compromising the commlink. This is why good Firewall and Stealth programs are good not just for the team Hacker but for everyone with a commlink. These sorts of attacks on the user's commlink require the user to be connected to the WAN, but otherwise don't care how a user connects the devices to the commlink to form the PAN.
The other method hackers can use compromises not the entire PAN, but a single device on it. To do this the hacker muast be able to sniff out the device's connection to the commlink and exploit or spoof their way into the device. This requires that the hacker be within signal range of the device in question. Almost all of these devices have extremely short ranges, usually <3 meters.
Therefore, in order for the hacker to get access to your gun, she would have to either:
A. gain admin-level access to your commlink (at which point it doesn't matter how you connect devices to it) which requires that your commlink be visible to the WAN and able to accept requests or
B. get within signal range of your gun, sniff out it's communication and hack into admin-level access on the fly, all while within arms reach of you.
Ok ...
Say I have a gun bunny with an implanted Smartlink, an ordinary (non-maxed-out) Commlink, and an Ares Predator IV. What exactly does he have to install the Skinlink mod on in order to protect himself from Hackers? Just the gun? The gun and the Commlink? Or the gun, the Commlink, and the implanted Smartlink?
If the last, how do you work modding the implant, being as there is no implanted Skinlink listing (that I can find)?
Say I have a gun bunny with an implanted Smartlink, an ordinary (non-maxed-out) Commlink, and an Ares Predator IV. What exactly does he have to install the Skinlink mod on in order to protect himself from Hackers? Just the gun? The gun and the Commlink? Or the gun, the Commlink, and the implanted Smartlink?
If the last, how do you work modding the implant, being as there is no implanted Skinlink listing (that I can find)?
You can't skinlink implants, as they aren't in contact with the surface of the skin, they're implanted. To connect an implanted device to the PAN you'd have to wire it to the commlink. In your example the gun bunny would be better off buying some smartgoggles and saving the essence, or implanting a datajack and having an old-fashioned optical cable jacked to the commlink.
Of course, all of this wiring may protect against hacking attempts against individual PAN devices made by hackers in arms reach, but it won't do anything to cover the much bigger security hole that is the bunny's commlink. It will help immensely with jamming problems, though, as there aren't any intra-PAN wireless signals to jam.
Of course, all of this wiring may protect against hacking attempts against individual PAN devices made by hackers in arms reach, but it won't do anything to cover the much bigger security hole that is the bunny's commlink. It will help immensely with jamming problems, though, as there aren't any intra-PAN wireless signals to jam.
So there really is absolutely no equivalent to the totally implanted Smartlink/Induction Pad combo. That doesn't seem right to me.
Or, untils Arsenal is available, simply assume that cyber implants are automatically skinlink enabled.
They can intercommunicate without wireless, too.
The main advantage of skinlink for runner types is, that it doesn't offset those broadcast scanners, while, as modulation of the field of the human body, still can extend enough to wear things on top of clothes.
They can intercommunicate without wireless, too.
The main advantage of skinlink for runner types is, that it doesn't offset those broadcast scanners, while, as modulation of the field of the human body, still can extend enough to wear things on top of clothes.
Wont a Skin linked gun and a implanted smart gun system function as before without the need for a comlink. Or would you need an internal comlink to act as an old style router ?
adept, smart shades, wired to gun down the sleeve, no commlink....have micro-transciever for communications, and telecom at home for matrix surfing
Well lets look at the pro's and con's of wireless vs not wireless. Oh on another note I'm assuming you're still running a commlink in atleast hidden mode for this. Not running a commlink majorly increases the cons of being not wireless.
Not Wireless
Pro's
Your stuff can't be hacked into.
Con's
Can't share info
Wireless
Pro's
easy access to a wide variety of arrows.
Ability to deceminate this information to your team, such as tactical data
Con's
If a hacker manages to find your commlink he has the chance to hack into your network. And assuming you have no hacker/technomancer backup, he can do some minor screwing around. And actualy the most dangerouse thing he could realy do to you, besides stealing all your personal data is screwing with your smartlink. And even thats going to be easily noticable and quickly fixed by unsubscribing then resubscribing your smartlink.
In all honesty, what are you doing without hacker backup? Secondly you -need- a commlink to get by in 2070. Especialy if you ever plan in being anywhere decent. Granted if you want to hang out in the barrens 24/7 you might not need one. But there is very very little advantage not to have one. Afterall, as shown and noted several times in the book you can pull up maps of a facility and have the hacker higlight you guys and note the enemies. But without a commlink, you won't have access to that. Or the text messages from your team when they can't talk for fear of being found, you'll miss those too.
You're already going to have to be wireless essentialy. And your personal info's gonna be there. Whats the real advantage of being non wireless? And you can allways not have things be wireless, you don't have to have a wireless cyberarm if you don't want to.
Not Wireless
Pro's
Your stuff can't be hacked into.
Con's
Can't share info
Wireless
Pro's
easy access to a wide variety of arrows.
Ability to deceminate this information to your team, such as tactical data
Con's
If a hacker manages to find your commlink he has the chance to hack into your network. And assuming you have no hacker/technomancer backup, he can do some minor screwing around. And actualy the most dangerouse thing he could realy do to you, besides stealing all your personal data is screwing with your smartlink. And even thats going to be easily noticable and quickly fixed by unsubscribing then resubscribing your smartlink.
In all honesty, what are you doing without hacker backup? Secondly you -need- a commlink to get by in 2070. Especialy if you ever plan in being anywhere decent. Granted if you want to hang out in the barrens 24/7 you might not need one. But there is very very little advantage not to have one. Afterall, as shown and noted several times in the book you can pull up maps of a facility and have the hacker higlight you guys and note the enemies. But without a commlink, you won't have access to that. Or the text messages from your team when they can't talk for fear of being found, you'll miss those too.
You're already going to have to be wireless essentialy. And your personal info's gonna be there. Whats the real advantage of being non wireless? And you can allways not have things be wireless, you don't have to have a wireless cyberarm if you don't want to.
| QUOTE (Shayd @ Sep 14 2005, 12:37 PM) |
| I don't need anyone to tell me why NOT to go wireless. I need people to tell me why folks WOULD! |
You would go wireless so that, corps can detect your wireless signals and track you going through their facility easier.
You would go wireless so that Joe Asshat can jam your signal and cause your hardware to fail.
You would go wireless so that all your gear requires batteries and could run out of power in a run and add that extra level of prep.
You would go wireless so that drones can find a signal to lock in on a lower their target numbers.
You would go wireless so that you can see your commrades ammo count instead of yours.
| QUOTE |
| Maybe because, in the game world, not everyone is aware of the super-elite Hacker ability to screw with them. Most people would never run into any of these problems in their lives. Even (non-Hacker) runners should not necessarily be privy to the possible pitfalls unless they have some kind of first-hand knowledge on the subject, or their Hacker friend tells them (and whom they may or may not believe). |
This is a step on the right track. I honestly believe that all of this extra radio pollution will start to show side effects in the future. Our airwaves are already flooded with signals, and it will only get much worse. Signals will have to get stronger just to overcome the background noise.
People are starting to slowly become aware of how vulnerable the are. Anyone else do wardriving? I do everytime I visit another city, when I need internet access. Those 40 million internet zombies out there would balloon to billions if everyone was wireless. Sandboxed or not.... hackers will find a way.
[SARC]So in short WIRELESS is brilliant and everything from your stick of gum to your toilet paper will be wireless.[SARC/]
Frankly I find the whole 'everything is wireless' to be illogical.
My final decision won't happen until I get my 4th edition book, but at the moment I'm leaning towards dropping SR 4th and staying in the 1st-3rd edition era for my campaigns. The new world isn't making sense to me.
My final decision won't happen until I get my 4th edition book, but at the moment I'm leaning towards dropping SR 4th and staying in the 1st-3rd edition era for my campaigns. The new world isn't making sense to me.
| QUOTE |
| In all honesty, what are you doing without hacker backup? Secondly you -need- a commlink to get by in 2070. Especialy if you ever plan in being anywhere decent. Granted if you want to hang out in the barrens 24/7 you might not need one. But there is very very little advantage not to have one. Afterall, as shown and noted several times in the book you can pull up maps of a facility and have the hacker higlight you guys and note the enemies. But without a commlink, you won't have access to that. Or the text messages from your team when they can't talk for fear of being found, you'll miss those too. |
That is like saying that you cannot survive today without a cellphone. I used to have one when I went to college way back in 93. I was the only student in my department with one. I didn't know how people could live without them. Now I cannot stand the site of them. People driving and not paying attention to the road, to ignorant people at the checkout that make people wait for them to pay because they are too involved in a conversation.
Granted there are certain technologies I would never imagine being without, like internet and telephone. I think that basic communication technology is essential, but I think that wireless is not one of them. I can see RFID being used in shipping crates... but when I walk out of that store ... I want that RFID disabled.
I've added routers and router ports back into cyberware, and those are the alternative for runners to get their stuff set up to run "not wireless".
I've also given them a relatively high cost and availability, simply due to the scarcity of doctors who are willing to work with wired stuff, and the low supply of these options. I follow the SR3 rules about what needs router ports in order to operate -- wired reflexes, for example, will not need a router.
In this way, it makes a runner have to sacrifice more money and essence to go wired. It is a benefit, but people will not do it unless they have a good reason to.
I've also given them a relatively high cost and availability, simply due to the scarcity of doctors who are willing to work with wired stuff, and the low supply of these options. I follow the SR3 rules about what needs router ports in order to operate -- wired reflexes, for example, will not need a router.
In this way, it makes a runner have to sacrifice more money and essence to go wired. It is a benefit, but people will not do it unless they have a good reason to.
| QUOTE (Nyxll) | ||
You would go wireless so that, corps can detect your wireless signals and track you going through their facility easier. You would go wireless so that Joe Asshat can jam your signal and cause your hardware to fail. You would go wireless so that all your gear requires batteries and could run out of power in a run and add that extra level of prep. You would go wireless so that drones can find a signal to lock in on a lower their target numbers. You would go wireless so that you can see your commrades ammo count instead of yours. |
Oh horray for sarcasm.
Thats what hidden mode is for to begin with. Theres also a section of what every runner should know, in which it fully states that you should know how to get rid of your datatrail, or you should have a hacker in your party.
Yes because we all know the person jamming you is going to get close enough to do that. And if he's able to jam that powerfully your entire communications net is down with your team and well you have to resort to shouting. Weather you were wireless or not, at that point you're still prety fragged.
Yes because all gm's worry that much about details. I mean gm's made you recharge your microtransiever all the time, oops you didn't declare you were recharging it after last time and its run out in the middle of the run, I'm sorry.
Again hidden mode, secondly if you have a hacker you could hack into the drone and it wouldn't be a issue. But hey it also says nothing about your comlink provides a way to lock into you, as well you're not a vehicle with a signature rating. I mean since you're metahuman size its a -3 dicepool to the drone. So lets ignore the rules here like everyone else because we wanna be cool and trash the rules too.
You'd only see their ammo count if you wanted to. Hidden mode. And only if he was broadcasting it to you. Unless for some odd reason you're right up in his grill and decided it'd be a good idea to subscribe his smartlink too.
Your other part is prety moot too even considering modern day wireless technology. You still need a 'accessID' or in todays terms a key to access a wireless networks. While you're wardriving you're either looking to pick up a unsecured network that broadcasts that key and doesn't have MAC filtering enabled, or you're looking for one you can easily guess or spoof the key. This is all really combined with the fact that wireless is just taking off here. And slowly its becoming more and more secure, or as secure as it can be. In shadowrun wireless networking had been in the works for years and was addopted 6 years ago in 2064 after the second crash. i think in 6 years or even in 5 years they'd know how to secure networks with IC and such.
| QUOTE (Coasini) |
| I've added routers and router ports back into cyberware, and those are the alternative for runners to get their stuff set up to run "not wireless". I've also given them a relatively high cost and availability, simply due to the scarcity of doctors who are willing to work with wired stuff, and the low supply of these options. I follow the SR3 rules about what needs router ports in order to operate -- wired reflexes, for example, will not need a router. |
How nice of you... internal routing is free again in SR4 by canon.
| QUOTE (Nyxll) | ||
That is like saying that you cannot survive today without a cellphone. I used to have one when I went to college way back in 93. I was the only student in my department with one. I didn't know how people could live without them. Now I cannot stand the site of them. People driving and not paying attention to the road, to ignorant people at the checkout that make people wait for them to pay because they are too involved in a conversation. Granted there are certain technologies I would never imagine being without, like internet and telephone. I think that basic communication technology is essential, but I think that wireless is not one of them. I can see RFID being used in shipping crates... but when I walk out of that store ... I want that RFID disabled. |
Well considering cash is not really a option. Considering you can't go into prety much A AA or AAA sec zones without broadcasting your sin and such. Yeah I'd prety much say its damn near imposible to get along without them. As for the RFID tags I wasn't really talking about them. For purposes of my game i'm not overly keeping track of them and i'm assuming that my runners have been smart and removed the tags from atleast their running clothing. And i'm not going to make them declare that they remove the tag everytime they go out for another set of underware or socks.
Rotbart: What page is that?
At any rate, the reason I did that was because I agree with the original poster; that there is really no advantage to running your 'ware wireless otherwise.
At any rate, the reason I did that was because I agree with the original poster; that there is really no advantage to running your 'ware wireless otherwise.
| QUOTE (SR4 p. 330 Cyberware) |
| In addition to wireless functionality, most cyberware devices are equipped with a direct neural interface (DNI) that allows the user to mentally activate and control their functions. They can also be linked to other cyberware implants. |
Thanks.
| QUOTE (Fortune) |
| Say I have a gun bunny with an implanted Smartlink, an ordinary (non-maxed-out) Commlink, and an Ares Predator IV. What exactly does he have to install the Skinlink mod on in order to protect himself from Hackers? |
Every external device will need a 50Y skinlink adaptation.
Cyber should already take advantage of skinlink. If you can thread 20m+ of nano-circuity through the nervous system, you should be able to add a couple of 2" sections to establish redundant links between any given piece of ware to the skin. That's assuming you can't use an induction effect to send signals to the skin.
With a Comm, Predator, cybereyes/goggles and 100-150Y of skinlink (100 for eyes, 150 for goggles) you have all the performance of the classic induction pads.
Going back to Joe User, why would he pay for that? A 'runner is going to have end up with a couple hundred nuyen tied up in skinlink between various firearms, audio/video display devices, and tools. That's more in skinlink that he paid for his Comm.
Only when Joe has something to lose will he bother with the extra security. Instead he'll rely on the fact that he's merely one of the teeming millions. The odds of anyone hacking him are low as long as he remains one of those teeming millions and doesn't develop any individuality.
I must confess to being confused a little about the wireless stuff.
I just cannot perceive of a single character going around with anything wireless.
But it would help me if someone could answer some questions for me.
When turning all wireless devices off - and going into wired or skinlinked mode.. are you still able to perceive AR through glasses?
I am assuming that the glasses do not see AR - that the commlink does, and translates them to the glasses.. and with the commlink wireless off, AR scenery vanishes. Is this the case?
Is it possible to have a commlink in receive mode only? So that you can perceive AR objects, but without sending anything back to them? Surely that would prevent a hacker/technomancer hacking into them, as it would not allow 2-way communication. A hacker could possibly 'send' commands to the device, but never know the result of them, which should surely make it next to impossible to hack unless you know the exact make and specifics about firewall/os/system etc. Even then, the worst they could do would be to crash it (we're assuming that turning on 2-way communication can't be done just by sending in a signal).
I just cannot perceive of a single character going around with anything wireless.
But it would help me if someone could answer some questions for me.
When turning all wireless devices off - and going into wired or skinlinked mode.. are you still able to perceive AR through glasses?
I am assuming that the glasses do not see AR - that the commlink does, and translates them to the glasses.. and with the commlink wireless off, AR scenery vanishes. Is this the case?
Is it possible to have a commlink in receive mode only? So that you can perceive AR objects, but without sending anything back to them? Surely that would prevent a hacker/technomancer hacking into them, as it would not allow 2-way communication. A hacker could possibly 'send' commands to the device, but never know the result of them, which should surely make it next to impossible to hack unless you know the exact make and specifics about firewall/os/system etc. Even then, the worst they could do would be to crash it (we're assuming that turning on 2-way communication can't be done just by sending in a signal).
| QUOTE (kigmatzomat) |
| Cyber should already take advantage of skinlink. If you can thread 20m+ of nano-circuity through the nervous system, you should be able to add a couple of 2" sections to establish redundant links between any given piece of ware to the skin. That's assuming you can't use an induction effect to send signals to the skin. With a Comm, Predator, cybereyes/goggles and 100-150Y of skinlink (100 for eyes, 150 for goggles) you have all the performance of the classic induction pads. |
While I agree with that, is it canon?
Also ... if you put the Skinlink mod on a Commlink, can it still be used in the normal wireless manner in regards to any non-Skinlinked accessories, or do all of your other gadgets have to be Skinlinked?
As long as you don't disable it wireless features, it can.
A nice advantage of a PAN is that gear doesn't have to be in direct contact to be accessed... allowing a greater freedom in shuffling load.
A nice advantage of a PAN is that gear doesn't have to be in direct contact to be accessed... allowing a greater freedom in shuffling load.
| QUOTE (azraeluk) |
| I must confess to being confused a little about the wireless stuff. I just cannot perceive of a single character going around with anything wireless. But it would help me if someone could answer some questions for me. When turning all wireless devices off - and going into wired or skinlinked mode.. are you still able to perceive AR through glasses? I am assuming that the glasses do not see AR - that the commlink does, and translates them to the glasses.. and with the commlink wireless off, AR scenery vanishes. Is this the case? Is it possible to have a commlink in receive mode only? So that you can perceive AR objects, but without sending anything back to them? Surely that would prevent a hacker/technomancer hacking into them, as it would not allow 2-way communication. A hacker could possibly 'send' commands to the device, but never know the result of them, which should surely make it next to impossible to hack unless you know the exact make and specifics about firewall/os/system etc. Even then, the worst they could do would be to crash it (we're assuming that turning on 2-way communication can't be done just by sending in a signal). |
If you are not online, no you can not see AR.
And the recieve mode is essentialy hidden mode.
But realy why would people be wirelessly active.
Communication with the team. With the wireless mesh network you can set up a comm network with your team allowing them to send voice, text, and picture messages and such back and forth with just thoughts. Want to know what your teamate is seeing as he's peeking around the corner? That wireless mesh network can do it for you. Guard too close for you to even risk subvocalizing, or you don't have a mic? Mental text message.
Mapping. Hacker could pull up a map of the facility and even mark where the guards are on it and where you are. Theres one example of this using the employee's RFID tags in the book, and one of Using the security camera's to do this in the book.
These are the two main things wireless PAN's will be used for by runners. And for those two reasons alone I have no idea why you'd want to be completely free of wireless. The sheer usefullness of those two things to runners is astounding. This also means you should know how to hide your data trail (not that hard of a task) or have a hacker do it for you. Either way if you've covered your tracks it isn't likely you'll be hacked on a run.
| QUOTE (Shadow_Prophet) |
| If you are not online, no you can not see AR. |
Of course you can.
You just don't get any updates, and in order to actual overlay reality you need a Camera or such.
The very idea that Corps wouldn't detect (let alone hack automatically by use of Agents or whatever replaces agents in 4th) unauthorized wireless links on their grounds and immediately act (by tracking and sending security if nothing else) is... a major probem with my personal suspension of disbelief.
I'm growing doubtful of 4th edition. Still getting the book and will make the final decision then, but getting doubtful.
Actually, as it was stated multiple times before, in areas without public traffic, sometimes scanners are being used as security measure.
As a PAN extends about 3m and therefore is detectable, it is even explicitly recommended to turn it of when infiltrating...
As a PAN extends about 3m and therefore is detectable, it is even explicitly recommended to turn it of when infiltrating...
| QUOTE (Rotbart van Dainig) |
| Actually, as it was stated multiple times before, in areas without public traffic, sometimes scanners are being used as security measure. As a PAN extends about 3m and therefore is detectable, it is even explicitly recommended to turn it of when infiltrating... |
And yet we have people here stating they are not going to turn them off when infiltrating.
Now mind, I don't have the book yet. But reading this thread and seeing people advance the advantages of being up and running while infiltrating, I think the explicit recommandation didn't take so well.
However even assuming this is true, we run into problems. However I think I'll bow out as I don't really know what I'm talking about yet and won't until I get the book.
All I can said now for certain is that I'm growing concerned from the rumors I'm hearing.
Nyxll wrote:
| QUOTE |
| Granted there are certain technologies I would never imagine being without, like internet and telephone. I think that basic communication technology is essential, but I think that wireless is not one of them. I can see RFID being used in shipping crates... but when I walk out of that store ... I want that RFID disabled. |
Looks like several people have responded.. I will just add this:
Everyday in 2005 people are giving away their privacy. We sign up for meaninless offers, give out Social Security Numbers to companies that don't have the authority to use them, sign up for 14 different "free" credit reports, that send out their histories to countless companies...
Its all a struggle between privacy and convenience.
RFID tags are just a natually progression of this tactic. Sure when a runner goes down to a StufferShack and buys a gallon of Soy Milk it has an RFID tag in it. If the runner purchases that with a credit account and sends his SIN then in theory someone could track that sale and that RFID tag on the Soy Milk.
The problem with destroying the RFID tag would be that companies would not want that to happen. They want their merchandise to be tracked and tagged.. So all these different technologies could work together and provide information and details to other devices and appliances.
That container of Soy Milk that you buy and go home and put in your refridgerator. The refridgerator takes note of that RFID tag and the information from it (spoil date, purchase date, etc.) and so.. in 5 days when the runner goes back to his fridge, the screen on the fridge says "The Soy Milk is half full, you have 5 more days of freshness." a few days later the fridge is saying "Shall I order more milk from TurboDrone Grocer? They have a special on SoyMilk today!"
Other product that do not "expire" would use the RFID tag for warrenty information, product recalls, manuals, etc. RFID tags would allow the device to have an easier time connecting to a home's computer node with the correct settings, etc.
Destroying RFID tags would enhance your privacy, but also reduce your daily convenience by the same amount.
Actually, the RFID could even be outfitted with a Sensor to notice if the milk goes sour. 
On the other hand, you could fry with a tag eraser (which is Forbidden) normal and 'stealth' RFIDs (which are cheap), just not the hardened security tags (which are not).
On the other hand, you could fry with a tag eraser (which is Forbidden) normal and 'stealth' RFIDs (which are cheap), just not the hardened security tags (which are not).
| QUOTE (Rotbart van Dainig) |
| Actually, as it was stated multiple times before, in areas without public traffic, sometimes scanners are being used as security measure. As a PAN extends about 3m and therefore is detectable, it is even explicitly recommended to turn it of when infiltrating... |
You were right before. I did misspeak slightly. Assuming the shades you're refering to are wired to you, through your datajack, or prehapse skinlink, they could display augmented reality things such as the number of bullets in your gun, or files. But thats about the extent of it if you're completely offline.
And you are actualy wrong in one respect. PAN's are NOT recomended to be turned OFF. It says don't have your PAN in active mode while on a run. IE don't hold up a big neon sign saying 'Hey I'm a Shadowrunner in your facility and I need to be ventilated!' or walking through the front door up to the security desk and saying 'Hi we're shadowrunners and we're going to be doing a little run 3 floors up just incase you know you want to send security to stop us.'.
HIDDEN mode is there for a reason.
| QUOTE |
| Hidden: In this mode, your PAN is invisible to other nodes unless you access or authorize them. PAN users in hidden mode are said to be “ghosting,” since there is no way for other users to see them. |
If you're hidden, unless you specificaly access their wireless network, you're OK. I didn't realize that was so hard to comprehend. When you pull up that map, you're not hidden, this is when you spoof your datatrail. But that mesh network between you and your friends isn't going to be picked up if you stay in hidden mode.
| QUOTE |
Oh horray for sarcasm. Thats what hidden mode is for to begin with. Theres also a section of what every runner should know, in which it fully states that you should know how to get rid of your datatrail, or you should have a hacker in your party. |
First of all you are not looking to crack the signal, just detect that it is there. It is very simple to have sensors that just listen for signals... when it is triggered a
security challenge request would be broadcasted.... if there is not answer, then an alarm is triggered.
| QUOTE |
Yes because we all know the person jamming you is going to get close enough to do that. And if he's able to jam that powerfully your entire communications net is down with your team and well you have to resort to shouting. Weather you were wireless or not, at that point you're still prety fragged. |
That is just silly. I cannot believe that you think you have to be within a few meters to do a full spectrum jam. All you need is a stronger signal. (wow, revolutionary huh?)
| QUOTE |
Yes because all gm's worry that much about details. I mean gm's made you recharge your microtransiever all the time, oops you didn't declare you were recharging it after last time and its run out in the middle of the run, I'm sorry. ohplease.gif |
Actually as a player I worry about the details. The reason why this would not exist is because of little details like these.
| QUOTE |
Again hidden mode, secondly if you have a hacker you could hack into the drone and it wouldn't be a issue. But hey it also says nothing about your comlink provides a way to lock into you, as well you're not a vehicle with a signature rating. I mean since you're metahuman size its a -3 dicepool to the drone. So lets ignore the rules here like everyone else because we wanna be cool and trash the rules too.ohplease.gif |
Again Hidden mode, doesn't stop broadcasting, it no longer broadcasts the ID.... you do not need the id to lock in on a signal... just ask jet planes.
Ever use wardriving software? it will tell you there is a network there, and the ID
is hidden.
| QUOTE |
You'd only see their ammo count if you wanted to. Hidden mode. And only if he was broadcasting it to you. Unless for some odd reason you're right up in his grill and decided it'd be a good idea to subscribe his smartlink too. |
What you do not seem to understand is that data is travelling through the air and has the potential to collide. You can pick up stray packets.
| QUOTE |
Your other part is prety moot too even considering modern day wireless technology. You still need a 'accessID' or in todays terms a key to access a wireless networks. While you're wardriving you're either looking to pick up a unsecured network that broadcasts that key and doesn't have MAC filtering enabled, or you're looking for one you can easily guess or spoof the key. This is all really combined with the fact that wireless is just taking off here. And slowly its becoming more and more secure, or as secure as it can be. In shadowrun wireless networking had been in the works for years and was addopted 6 years ago in 2064 after the second crash. i think in 6 years or even in 5 years they'd know how to secure networks with IC and such. |
You only need the ACCESSID if you want to gain access or to decyber the data. with devices the potential for cross talk is lowered with the ACCESSID, but it still doesn't mask the fact that there is a signal there, and no amount of technology will erase that. THAT is why wireless is shortcoming.
| QUOTE (Shadow_Prophet) |
| If you are not online, no you can not see AR. And the recieve mode is essentialy hidden mode. But realy why would people be wirelessly active. Communication with the team. With the wireless mesh network you can set up a comm network with your team allowing them to send voice, text, and picture messages and such back and forth with just thoughts. Want to know what your teamate is seeing as he's peeking around the corner? That wireless mesh network can do it for you. Guard too close for you to even risk subvocalizing, or you don't have a mic? Mental text message. Mapping. Hacker could pull up a map of the facility and even mark where the guards are on it and where you are. Theres one example of this using the employee's RFID tags in the book, and one of Using the security camera's to do this in the book. These are the two main things wireless PAN's will be used for by runners. And for those two reasons alone I have no idea why you'd want to be completely free of wireless. The sheer usefullness of those two things to runners is astounding. This also means you should know how to hide your data trail (not that hard of a task) or have a hacker do it for you. Either way if you've covered your tracks it isn't likely you'll be hacked on a run. |
This is totally wrong. You need to pick the data and assemble it in the proper order.
A facility could potentially keep broadcasting all their data in a UDP fashion, but that would just make things too noisy. It is not like you are picking up on a sound feed, that is linear. The information you see in AR is based on where you are, and other feedback. You could potentially snoop someone else's signal... but you will see their AR ... not yours.
People that subscribe to a complete wireless future are the same suckers that would have bought into the DOT.com boom. I have some really awesome startup stocks for you wireless believers.
The benefits of wireless are not that earth shattering. Sure there are times when it is needed and an advantage, as is the same with a cellphone and radios. Over utilizing it is just silly, and shows a lack a common sense.
| QUOTE (Nyxll) |
| The benefits of wireless are not that earth shattering. Sure there are times when it is needed and an advantage, as is the same with a cellphone and radios. Over utilizing it is just silly, and shows a lack a common sense. |
For what it's worth, I tend to agree with you and Nyxll on this. I'm just not buying this future that 4th edition seems to be selling.
Of course I never bought into the future of previous editions either. But they were fun. I'm not really sure this version will be, but that likely because I never minded the solo decker runs.
Here's a few reasons I can think of why Joe Sammy might want to make his stuff PAN/wireless enabled (without going into disadvantages, just a pure list of good things)
1) Smartlink: teammates can see what you are shooting at, your ammo/weapon status, etc.
2) Biomonitor: friends can see your condition
3) Internal air tank: as soon as one team mates detects gas, he turns on the air tanks of all team mates
4) Wired reflexes: in a surprise situation, a friendly that rolls good on his test and is thus not surprised turns on the wired reflexes of his friends
5) Cybereyes: kinda same as smartlink, you see what he sees
6) Olfactory/taste booster (and other data gathering cyber, in fact): one guy collects data, everyone pools knowledge on what is being sensed ( a group test for every substance identification test)
That's all of the top of my head... basically, data gathering cyber, such as cybereyes, ears, etc, provide clear advantages to beign shared.
Offensive cyber (cyberguns, wired reflexes, cyberlimbs) can be made wireless so that team mates can "help" you use it, but I can't see how the reward would outweigh the risk in such a case.
1) Smartlink: teammates can see what you are shooting at, your ammo/weapon status, etc.
2) Biomonitor: friends can see your condition
3) Internal air tank: as soon as one team mates detects gas, he turns on the air tanks of all team mates
4) Wired reflexes: in a surprise situation, a friendly that rolls good on his test and is thus not surprised turns on the wired reflexes of his friends
5) Cybereyes: kinda same as smartlink, you see what he sees
6) Olfactory/taste booster (and other data gathering cyber, in fact): one guy collects data, everyone pools knowledge on what is being sensed ( a group test for every substance identification test)
That's all of the top of my head... basically, data gathering cyber, such as cybereyes, ears, etc, provide clear advantages to beign shared.
Offensive cyber (cyberguns, wired reflexes, cyberlimbs) can be made wireless so that team mates can "help" you use it, but I can't see how the reward would outweigh the risk in such a case.
Wireless data service is good, wireless devices are good. Not that everyone needs them.
But look at it from Joe Normal's point of view. He has his Comm. It's a phone, iPod, PDA, gameboy, credit card, and ID all by itself, no extras required. Wires are a hassle so he probably has wireless headphones/mic for his telephony/mp3/gaming needs. The dinky screen is a drag so for 50-75Y he can pick up a set of glasses or contacts that give him a virtual megascreen. He decides he doesn't like juggling the comm while playing games so for Xmas he splurges and gets AR gloves for 250Y.
If he had wires this would be a mess as they run from his glasses, his ears, and his hands down to a PDA device. Ack! Short-range wireless means he puts on his gloves and they work. Sure, he could go with a skinlink setup, adding 200Y to the cost of the package but....why? There's no interference between devices so his gear only shuts down if it were jammed and he's a law-abiding drone so that's no risk. His gear could be hacked but again, he's one schmoe out of a couple million.
Wires are used by the poor, the out of date, and the paranoid. Skinlink is used by the rich paranoid.
Even if you had skinlink, you might want to enable wireless from time to time. Want your buddy to hear the game? Sorry, you've got to keep touching the headset. How about passing over the AR shades so they can see the last vacation you took? Ooops, still gotta keep a hand on their head.
Wireless without risk of interference and where hacking requires more than enabling diagnostic mode has lots of advantages. Just....not as many to criminals who want to remain out of sight and undetectable.
But look at it from Joe Normal's point of view. He has his Comm. It's a phone, iPod, PDA, gameboy, credit card, and ID all by itself, no extras required. Wires are a hassle so he probably has wireless headphones/mic for his telephony/mp3/gaming needs. The dinky screen is a drag so for 50-75Y he can pick up a set of glasses or contacts that give him a virtual megascreen. He decides he doesn't like juggling the comm while playing games so for Xmas he splurges and gets AR gloves for 250Y.
If he had wires this would be a mess as they run from his glasses, his ears, and his hands down to a PDA device. Ack! Short-range wireless means he puts on his gloves and they work. Sure, he could go with a skinlink setup, adding 200Y to the cost of the package but....why? There's no interference between devices so his gear only shuts down if it were jammed and he's a law-abiding drone so that's no risk. His gear could be hacked but again, he's one schmoe out of a couple million.
Wires are used by the poor, the out of date, and the paranoid. Skinlink is used by the rich paranoid.
Even if you had skinlink, you might want to enable wireless from time to time. Want your buddy to hear the game? Sorry, you've got to keep touching the headset. How about passing over the AR shades so they can see the last vacation you took? Ooops, still gotta keep a hand on their head.
Wireless without risk of interference and where hacking requires more than enabling diagnostic mode has lots of advantages. Just....not as many to criminals who want to remain out of sight and undetectable.
| QUOTE (kigmatzomat @ Sep 14 2005, 01:06 PM) |
| Wireless data service is good, wireless devices are good. Not that everyone needs them. But look at it from Joe Normal's point of view. He has his Comm. It's a phone, iPod, PDA, gameboy, credit card, and ID all by itself, no extras required. Wires are a hassle so he probably has wireless headphones/mic for his telephony/mp3/gaming needs. The dinky screen is a drag so for 50-75Y he can pick up a set of glasses or contacts that give him a virtual megascreen. He decides he doesn't like juggling the comm while playing games so for Xmas he splurges and gets AR gloves for 250Y. If he had wires this would be a mess as they run from his glasses, his ears, and his hands down to a PDA device. Ack! Short-range wireless means he puts on his gloves and they work. Sure, he could go with a skinlink setup, adding 200Y to the cost of the package but....why? There's no interference between devices so his gear only shuts down if it were jammed and he's a law-abiding drone so that's no risk. His gear could be hacked but again, he's one schmoe out of a couple million. Wires are used by the poor, the out of date, and the paranoid. Skinlink is used by the rich paranoid. Even if you had skinlink, you might want to enable wireless from time to time. Want your buddy to hear the game? Sorry, you've got to keep touching the headset. How about passing over the AR shades so they can see the last vacation you took? Ooops, still gotta keep a hand on their head. Wireless without risk of interference and where hacking requires more than enabling diagnostic mode has lots of advantages. Just....not as many to criminals who want to remain out of sight and undetectable. |
Joe shmoe never goes on a shadowrun. Ok for your house wireless is a major convenience... A friend of mine has a blue tooth ear piece for his phone. That is fine for driving in the car or walking down the street. On a run, you want to keep vulnerabilities to a minimum as well as keep a low signature. Why do black ops teams keep radio silence? Because they do not want anyone to over hear them, or to detect them.
Any data worth keeping will be isolated either by private wireless or a wired lan. If you went through all the trouble to penetrate a facility why give yourself away?
Each of those devices has a signature, there is a chance that another device would pick it up. Granted that not every facility will have listening devices everywhere, but in sensitive areas it is just as easy to put in a listener as it is to put in ultrasound. They odds are the two would be integrated into the same security zone.
For joe laman security, and detection will not matter ... for the professional ... it will. Joe laman is not going to have a smartlink or expensive devices.
This would also make it so could disable a strike team with a jammer. Since they could not use their gear.
If you had read all my replies you would have seen where I corrected myself Nyxll.
I don't need 'wardriving' software to tell me if there is a wireless network in the area and if its ID is hidden or not. I already have standard everyday software that comes equiped with my wireless card that does that for me.
You're attention to details is admirable, but in general come on. I don't know of a GM out there that will bug you about batteries for your comlink unless you're out for a extended period of time without access to power. Heck they took worrying about MP and such out because it was too much of micromanaging.
I don't need 'wardriving' software to tell me if there is a wireless network in the area and if its ID is hidden or not. I already have standard everyday software that comes equiped with my wireless card that does that for me.
You're attention to details is admirable, but in general come on. I don't know of a GM out there that will bug you about batteries for your comlink unless you're out for a extended period of time without access to power. Heck they took worrying about MP and such out because it was too much of micromanaging.
| QUOTE |
| People that subscribe to a complete wireless future are the same suckers that would have bought into the DOT.com boom. I have some really awesome startup stocks for you wireless believers. |
Well lucky us we don't have to decide weather or not wireless will take over in reality or not. I for one believe it will in time. In shadowrun if you take a look at the time line it took 5-6 years for it to make it where it is in 2070 and a major infrasturcture crash. Take a look at NO currently. Telephone lines are down for the most part. Power is only available in select portions of the CBD. But verizon and i believe cingular have both been working to restore cell service, so cell service is king there at the moment, as are sat phones. Now look at the crash of '64. Wired matrix's prety much died. A new technology that had been developed and was out there was ready to take the place of the wired matrix's and it did. Imagine that.
As for jamming, sure you could do that. A more powerful signal would probably stop most if not all of the shadowrunner's network. So as I said, even if you didn't have to get close to do it, you're still prety much fragged as there went communications (and yes that probably means your little transciever is done too). So the only real advantage there that you got from not being wireless is you have the skinlink for your smartlink. Damn you got me. I guess theres no reason to go wireless at all.
| QUOTE |
| Any data worth keeping will be isolated either by private wireless or a wired lan. If you went through all the trouble to penetrate a facility why give yourself away? |
Thats actualy shown in one of the chapter openings, part of the building being sealed off from outside signals with signal dampners in the walls, changing to a completely different grid.
| QUOTE |
| Frogger followed the others into the room, closing the door behind him, and frowning as several of his visuals pixelated. As the team spread out into guarded positions, several warning icons grabbed his attention—he had just lost several connections and was picking up a new local network. Fuck! He transmitted. This wing must have wireless-inhibiting materials in the wall—just lost my outside links, and there’s anew security network here. Give me a sec to hack it! Spotting a surveillance camera in the corner, Frogger knew he had to act fast. Quickly sitting againsta wall, he switched into full virtual reality mode. The room and his body evaporated, replaced by his familiarradioactive toad icon and his commlink’s marsh “reality.” He immediately shot down the wireless link and launched an array of automated routines against the network’s fi rewall, probing for any number of known exploitable flaws with the speed and hyper-intensity that only hot sim could provide. Within seconds, hewas in—but the system security wasn’t slouching, and his unauthorized presence had been identifi ed. He scrambled to access the vidcams, editing their feed so onsite security couldn’t spot them too easily. Looking bad, kids. Red lights, klaxons, all that—we need to move! Though they could see no signof it, the team immediately exploded into action, planting the “evidence” they had been hired to drop while watching for approaching security. Frogger continued to race through the system’s carefully-sculpted “megacity” virtual landscape, whena menacing diesel machine icon suddenly raced towards him—which he immediately recognized as an intrusion countermeasures program. Frogger smiled to himself, and readied his attack software. Now it’s time to have some fun. |
Seems to me the security system didn't pick up their mesh network, it picked up him when he hacked in. He was the unauthorized user of the network. But hey, you don't have to run wireless if you don't want to, you're still subject to jamming, ie your radio and such, so not being wireless doesnt' give you any more of a edge over non-detection. Infact, it limits your ability to respond to it in certain instances.
I think I am just repeating what some people have said, basically that having a wirless system and an interlinked network of all your runners just makes things easier. In the same way that battle tec in SR3 just made things easier and better. its just now that the world as a whole is using the stuff not just military groups.
As for picking up different signals and alerting gaurds. I can`t find anything in the PDF about these devices or how they work so I can`t really comment. Of course I could just be missing them.
I can see where needing to see and access all the aros would help on a run. Of course some hacking would need to be done to allow you to appear as a recognized user. Like having doors with no handles or visable locks, just aros of a keypad that wage slaves would see and have to enter a code on. People without a comlink wont even know how the door opened. It doesnt even have to be a keypad, it could just be a button, one easy way to limit access to an area.
I think alot depends on the game you play. In the world I run my players have all used comunication devices of one kind or another on a run and I have never used that to alert security. I would imagine that my players will take alot of care what data is available on there coms and what modes they are in when, but I think at least a few of them will live a wireless existence.
As for picking up different signals and alerting gaurds. I can`t find anything in the PDF about these devices or how they work so I can`t really comment. Of course I could just be missing them.
I can see where needing to see and access all the aros would help on a run. Of course some hacking would need to be done to allow you to appear as a recognized user. Like having doors with no handles or visable locks, just aros of a keypad that wage slaves would see and have to enter a code on. People without a comlink wont even know how the door opened. It doesnt even have to be a keypad, it could just be a button, one easy way to limit access to an area.
I think alot depends on the game you play. In the world I run my players have all used comunication devices of one kind or another on a run and I have never used that to alert security. I would imagine that my players will take alot of care what data is available on there coms and what modes they are in when, but I think at least a few of them will live a wireless existence.
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