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Penta
Yup.

With the caveat noted. Solar powered, thus no workie when the sun goes down.smile.gif
WearzManySkins
@Penta
I think the correct term solar recharged, it has batteries, so during the day it recharges the batteries, at sunless times if runs off batteries.

The Rigger 3 to SR4 spreadsheet has the converted stats for the roto drones.

On my ship the only thing that really affected the non skid coating on the deck was a direct blast of missile exhaust, then it was only a spot, the aluminum deck underneath was intact, only the non skid coating was burned away. On carriers it is not the jet exhaust that wears down the deck, it is the take off and landings. IIRC the non skid material which was painted on, had some qualities to make it resistant to jet exhaust even after burners.

@DireRadient
I can see that readying, and launching it would be easy, same for recovery, weather conditions allowing same too.

WMS
Penta
Fair point.

Re vectored-thrust: Yeah, but that was with a milspec ship. Civilian ships? I...think not.
Tarantula
Whats our yacht made out of anyway? Wood? Metal? Fiberglass? Futuretech materials?
Penta
Most yachts are made out of aluminium or steel - fiberglass is great for smaller ships, but I've been told it has some issues with bigger ships.

It won't be a factor anyway - My head would explode if I had to go very simulationist on stuff like that. Because I would go nuts trying to find free comp sims to do a horde of things, including probably hydrodynamics.smile.gif

Let's not make my brain explode.smile.gif
D Minor
Sorry All But rl is kickin sand in my face right know and i have to back out i would have posted sooner but this has been the first chance to get online. So once again Sorry for wastin everones time. Goodluck wtih the game.
Narse
Ok, here's our situation as I understand it: we need to compile a list of the group account gear and watches/positions by Sunday. This is what I think we have so far:

MT Sea Nymph Yacht
-Rigger adapted
-Pilot, response, signal, and Firewall upgrades [Penta, whats the availability limit for this employer acquired gear? Can we get straight rating 6's across the board? I recommend we get the highest ratings we can.]
-(autosofts & programs ??) - I suggest Defense, Maneuver, Electronic Warfare for Autosofts [what are your thoughts on Targeting? I'm not sure its necessary] and Analyze, Encrypt & ECCM for programs. Autosofts all at rating 4 and programs all at the rating of Pilot or Response (whichever is lower).
-Pop-up Turrets (size? number? aramament?) - I suggest 1, loacated in the bow, mounting a MMG loaded w/ 1000 rnds. [1 cf right?] APDS.
-Medical 'Shop'
-[Naval Mechanic Shop - already purchased]
-Armory (do we need to pay for this? or just note that this is what some space is being used for?)
- ( 2x Jet Skis ?) - Would these be effective for boarding operations?
- (Craft for boarding operations ?, If not already purchased) - I suggest the Surfstar Marine Seacop (skiff). If Penta deems it fits on the Yacht.
- (Directional Jammer?) - It reduces signal in area of effect by rating of jamming, rating of jamming decreases by 1 every 20 meters from the jammer. [i.e. a target 110m from a R10 directional jammer has its signal reduced by (5 - rating of ECCM)]
Drones:
-Blimp Drone (SR4, right?)
--(upgrades?) - I don't think this is necessary
-Rotor Drone (SR4 one also, right?)
--(weaponry?) - If we choose to go this route I recommend a Sniper rifle, keeps down ammo costs among other things.
--(upgrades?) - Once agian, I don't think it is necessary.

Please post if you think there should be more on this list, or if you think some things should be removed or just to clarify your opinion on what options we should get on a specific piece of gear. Btw, I didn't list costs, thinking that it was better to first finalize what we want to get. After which it will only be a matter of looking up the correct costs


Watches & Positions:

People who have stated they can stand helm watches:
Cuda (Tarantula)
Litany (DireRadiant)
Gunner Blythe (WearzManySkins)
Johnny Rocket (Redjack)

[Its my opinion that helm watches are really going to be all that is necessary under normal circumstances. Weapons and other stations can be manned as necessary (read: in anticipation of, or during combat) ]

Other positions:
Captain - ?
Master of the Ship - ?
Engineering - Carlos Rodriguez
Medical - Franklin?
Remote Ops - ? (I'll let the riggers fight it out over this one)
Sensors - (this seems to me like a watch position we might want covered most of the time. Perhaps we could do something like with the helms watch, In which case I volunteer Carlos to take one of the watches)
Weapons - ? (Gunner?)

Really, I should state what I think about how the above positions should be used, as I have said that I don't think we're going to need them most of the time. So:
I think we should determine combat positions. In reality this is probably going to vary from instance to instance (as it should) as the situation and our plans change. However, I think that we should try to establish what each character is going to be doing if we become involved in unanticipated combat (e.g. we are attacked).
With that said, Carlos is probably going to be trying to keep us afloat.
Penta
There's not necessarily an avail limit for employer gear - but I'm going to (because there's not yet anything beyond 6) limit pilot, sig, response, and firewall for the yacht to -one- rating 6 program OR two 5s.

Jet Skis - Unless you *really* think you can do Indiana Jones-ish jumps and pull em off consistently, they're not necessarily useful for boardings. There's not really the stability.

I'm presuming the drones are the SR4 ones.

Armory - You would actually need to modify the ship for this...But I'm going to save us some heartburn and presume that your employer has someone doing it gratis. Specify: Where it should be, what kind of security it should have, and how big it should be.

There's 2 karma up for whoever wants to draw or otherwise create a map for the ship - Once you guys have figured out the dimensions and specs for the yacht, anyway.
DireRadiant
Narse, the list looks good to me.

I think we settled on a bow and stern chaser weapon mount.
In addition to the one sniper rifle, I think we need to have a MG of some kind, since these serve as anti vehicular weapons, and the ranges are better.

Depending on what's required for ship captain, Litany might be able to play the part. What is the appropriate skill, and will a fake SIN and license do?

Narse
QUOTE (Penta)
There's not necessarily an avail limit for employer gear - but I'm going to (because there's not yet anything beyond 6) limit pilot, sig, response, and firewall for the yacht to -one- rating 6 program OR two 5s.[...]

@Penta, as far as the upgrades to pilot etc. go: Firewall is normally available to anyone (availability: --) at rating 6. Response and Signal at rating 5 have an availability 12 (availability 16 for rating 6), while pilot has an availability of rating X3. This means under normal availability 12 circumstances we would be able to obtain Firewall 6, Signal 5, Response 5, and Pilot 4. Personally, I think this is a better alternative to the system you outlined as it maintains game balance (e.g. we can't get pilot 6 and then just pick up firewall 6 at the first place we stop) and involves less of a hassle. You of course are the GM, and get to define how it actually will work.

@DireRadiant:
I think (but I'm really not the authority here) that the captains position might involve either the Navigation skill or the Leadership skill (which actually doesn't apply since we're all PC's). But, of course the position could also require no game mechanic skill at all.
Hmm... I guess I might not have answered your question but now others can correct me.
Tarantula
QUOTE (Narse)
-(autosofts & programs ??) - I suggest Defense, Maneuver, Electronic Warfare for Autosofts [what are your thoughts on Targeting? I'm not sure its necessary] and Analyze, Encrypt & ECCM for programs. Autosofts all at rating 4 and programs all at the rating of Pilot or Response (whichever is lower).

Defense is practically worthless. Especially if we plan to have people manning the helm. At best it is going to be rating 4. The yachts pilot is rating 4. That means on its own, it has 1 die for defense. And going full defense 5 dice.

To take Cuda as an example. When rigging the yacht in hot VR, he has... 9 dice base for defence, and if taking evasive driving (SR4, 161, vehicular equivalent of full defense) it goes up to, 20 dice. Comparatively, we'd be better with something else like Databomb on anyone trying to access the yacht, or perhaps even electronic warfare, and let the dogbrain play jammer with incoming signals.
Penta
Narse: I am not the type to ignore good ideas. I like your idea w/ regard to upgrades. So we'll use that.

Master's license: Huh...

The USCG wants, IRL...Sea Service (we'll ignore that), a physical (same), the completion of a USCG-approved firefighting course (What skill even remotely equates?), a radar observer's license, and certifications in GMDSS (Global Maritime Distress something System) and ARPA (Automatic Radar Plotting Apparatus) usage.

Oh, and you have to complete a Celestial Navigation exam. Plus first aid/CPR courses.

Okaaaayyyy, um. I think Navigation is obvious, as is First Aid, but I can't figure out the skills to match with some of the other requirements...

Deciding just to decide:

You need Navigation, First Aid, and...Er, no idea what skill works with firefighting. Oh hell, Nautical Mechanics. Cuz, Damage Control. Yeah.
DireRadiant
Well, that set let's Litany out of a legitimate SHip Master Certification. And since I have no idea of everyone else's skills. smile.gif
Tarantula
Yep, Cuda's out too, no first aid.
Penta
Yeah, Gunner is sort of the default Master, now that I think about it.

This does not mean he need be the Captain.
Penta
Actually....Thanks to my brain, I reread the medkit description.

Scratch First Aid.smile.gif

Just to remind folks: In about 9-12 hours, I'd really like to have:

1. A final list of the gear you're "expensing" to your employer.
2. A name, flag state, and history for the ship. It -can- be a new build ship, remember, modified in the yard. (Which helpfully means you don't need a history.) I'm conflicted as to whether the Carib League should be -one- flag, or the separate countries we all know from RL. Cyberpirates is inconsistent, it seems.

FINAL versions of these should be posted to the OOC thread, which I started on Thursday or Friday.

Once you guys have that done, I'll start the ball rolling for IC posting.
WearzManySkins
Wait a minute Gunner never volunteers for anything,,,he is prior military. smile.gif

OK Weapon do we want in the forward pop up remote turret? LMG or MMG? My choice is MMG.

Do we want a aft gun mount? if so LMG or MMG? My choice is a pop up remote turret with a LMG

Port and Starboard pintle mounts LMGs?My choice is LMG

How many aerial drones will we be carrying,, both character personal or ship's?

How many small craft are we carrying? and what types?

One arms storage area ie Armory 10 CF? sound about right?

WMS

Penta
Okay. That would be space enough for the secure storage of 50,000 rounds of small arms ammo, 2500 rounds MG ammo, or 500 rounds of grenade launcher or assault cannon ammo. You can also store whatever mixture of 10 UNLOADED rifles or smaller weapons, 4 LMGs, 100 grenades, and 10 blades, you may like. (How come you don't get the full 0.2 CF*50? Because: A. I don't like the idea of a yacht being a floating arsenal like that; B. I am going to assume that some of that space is taken up by the requirements of said secure storage of ammunition and weapons.)

Mmmkay....It is 0900 EDT as I write this. I'm going to be out for a while...If when I get back, or by noon, whichever is later, it isn't already done, I'm going to sit down and write up the background of the ship myself. Which is okay, but loses you guys an opportunity to gain "Help the GM" karma.

Also: A ruling. Actually, a few.

Cuda made the choice of keeping me up til 2 AM my time last night, trying to argue me on various points related to riggerdom. He made some good points, and generally helped me come to some decisions.

1. The radar sensor from Aug was -never- designed for the clutter and environmental conditions of a maritime environment. It was designed for the urban environment. Its maximum range in the -book- is 100 meters; for the open oceans, I'm going to rule that the radar clutter provided by the waves, the fish, the seagulls, etc, etc. limits its usefulness to 30 meters on the surface. It is ineffective underwater.

2. The navies and coast guards (and freighter fleets) of the world, when rigging hit the waves, were confronted with a problem: Either they allow rigging, and for a member of the crew to be unconscious while on duty, or they deny mariners the effectiveness of a rigged ship. (Keep in mind, rigger adaptation is, by the book, merely a black box to convert the ship's data and telemetry into neural signals, nothing more.)

As is typical, they split the difference, with a nod to tradition. The "rules of the road" and safety regulations followed by all boat and ship builders restrict riggers to jacking in only from the regular helm position, or any emergency control spaces that might be built into a ship (only available on larger ships like freighters). The advent of AR, for what it's worth, has made full VR rigging much less popular for mariners - seamanship training teaches you to deal with a torrent of ship-related data in any case, and that guy in VR would be deadweight in an emergency aboard ship (say, firefighting, or controlling flooding).

Regular effects of VR remain, but it takes a -full combat turn- to jack out when rigging a ship - as a safety measure, you can't operate the manual controls when someone is jacked in to the ship, and removing the manual controls is utterly banned by regulatory authorities.

3. Keep in mind: Radars only show you that something is out there, and that it is moving, nothing else. Also, most radars have their sensitivity set to not detect birds, fish, etc, etc. This goes for similarly slow non-biological objects, too.

As such, This Is Your Only Warning. Relying on just one set of sensors, in a surface craft, is a -very- bad idea.

4. No, I do not -care-. You MAY NOT have a bed on the bridge for the rigger. That's Thorcow-worthy. (Image of a modern ship's bridge...With a big soft queen-sized bed in the middle. Uh, no.)
Redjack
Ok, time to catch up on a number of posts.

@WearzManySkins/DireRadiant
Wow. You guys have provided a LOT of great info, consolidated into a number of posts. I am trying to pull that data into a single spreadsheet for Penta.

QUOTE (Narse @ Oct 10 2007, 10:45 PM)
Ex-Ex was changed (along w/ normal ex, and flechette) in the errata. The damage mod is now +1DV/-1AP.

Good catch, I've went through my BBB and insured that all erata are noted. wink.gif
I still prefer EXEX in this case though. This drone is designed to put a lot of loud, explosive munitions downrange and draw some attention. Thanks for the suggestion though.
QUOTE (Narse @ Oct 10 2007, 10:45 PM)
install a gas vent III and a shock pad on the Alpha

The Alpha comes with 2 points of internal recoil comp from the design, which I do not think is able to be further augmented by gas vent. I also do not believe that weapon mounts are compatible with shock pads.

QUOTE (WearzManySkins @ Oct 12 2007, 10:43 PM)
Do you have access to Rigger 3 to look at the other drones that Penta has approved?

Body 3 drones take up 13.5 cf
Body 2 drones take up 9 ct
Body 1 drones take up 1.5 cf

Yes. As a note, these rates are for assembled drones and drone racks. Breaking down the roto-drones would need 1/3 rates space.

QUOTE (DireRadiant @ Oct 10 2007, 08:31 AM)
30,600 - Surfstar Marine Seacop (Skiff)

In Rigger 3, page 160 that reads out at 170,000 nuyen.gif . Is there some errata I missed?

QUOTE (DireRadiant @ Oct 10 2007, 08:31 AM)
20,000 - 2 Water Sports/Jet Skis (Can carry 2 each) ~ 10,000

How about one sea sled? 15,000 nuyen.gif Goes underwater. Can carry two on the seat + six via hand holds. Gives us the ability to have a team approach underwater? How many on the team are divers?


Tarantula
Already have a sea sled, and I can dive.
Penta
Redjack was nice enough to point me to the ship history...

Ehhhh....It's the AngstShip. Surely a ship that cursed woulda been sunk by someone - in an attempt for the bad luck to go down with it!

Dire, I love the way you write, but...you have a tendency to dial the Angst Level to 11.smile.gif This is Shadowrun, not WOD.nyahnyah.gif (I'm teasing, I'm teasing.smile.gif)

Alternatively:

M/V <Someone else pick a name!>
MT Sea Nymph
Flag: UCAS
Built: Marine Tech Construction Yards, Quincy, MA, UCAS
Year Built: 2070
New Build, released to dealer in Newport, RI 12/15/2070
Modified At: Parker & Sons Marine Sales, Newport, RI on behalf of confidential client.
NABS (North American Bureau of Surveying) classified.
Currently under OEM warranty (until 12/31/2072) and Modifications Warranty (until 1/31/2073)

Essentially, you guys are getting a brand new ship, modded for your use.
Redjack
Ok, working with Penta this morning here is what we have. I tried as best I could to pull from the 220 posts our desired gear list.
nuyen CF Description
170000 - MT Sea Nymph
- 10x stateroom: High amenities
-24 Cannibalize 2x Staterooms
-72 Cannibalize Crew Staterooms
-36 Cannibalize Owner Staterooms
- Skiff Launch Bay
4000 - Response upgrade to 5
1000 - Signal Upgrade to 5
3000 - Firewall Upgrade to 6
10000 - Pilot rating @4
2000 - Maneuver Autosoft R4
2000 - Targeting (Hvy Weapons) Autosoft R4
2000 - Clearsight Autosoft R4
400 - Encryption R4
400 - Analyze R4
300 10x Mapsofts R6
1000 0 2x Satellite Links
2500 0 Rigger Adaptation
0 - Passive Sonar System
50000 4 Bog-Standard Active Sonar System
2000 10x Cameras: Visible & infrared light
3000 - Directional Jammer R6
7500 4 Small Pop Up Turret Forward
4500 - Stoner M202 MMG
400 200r REG Ammo
7500 4 Small Pop Up Turret Rear
2000 - White Knight LMG
400 200r REG Ammo
2500 0 Port Pintle Mount
2000 - White Knight LMG
400 200r REG Ammo
2500 0 Aft Pintle Mount
2000 - White Knight LMG
400 200r REG Ammo
10 Armory
4.5 Closet for roto-drone
2700 13.5 Drone Storage for Roto-drone
2760 13.5 Drone Storage for Stormcloud
10000 35 5,000kg Crane
52 Medical Shop
105.5 Cargo Bay
4000 6 Launch Rack for Sea Sled
--------------
12500 SC Otter based skiff [Response: 3]
2500 Rigger Adaptation
1000 Upgrade to Signal R5
3000 Pilot R3
3000 Firewall R6
600 Targeting (heavy weapons) Autosoft R3
600 Maneuver Autosoft R3
2500 Weapon Mount
2000 White Knight
2000 Integrated Smartgun
400 200r REG Ammo
------------------
15000 Mitsuhama Anago – Security Model
2500 Rigger Adaptation
0 External Hardpoint
2000 White Knight LMG
400 200r REG Ammo
------------------
2600 Renraku Stormcloud (Blimp)[R:3; Pilot:3; Sig: 3; FW:3]
0 Clear sight R3
3000 Firewall upgrade to 6
1000 Upgrade to Signal R5
100 Vision Magnification
400 Vision Enhancement R3
100 Low-light
---------------------
2000 MCT-Nissan Roto-Drone: Rotary Air Support
100 Vision Magnification
100 Thermographics
2500 Weapon Mount
500 Airburst link
1700 Ares Alpha [SG, 2pt Recoil, gl]
10 2x clips
840 84 rounds EX-EX Ammo
420 12 Frag Grenades
600 Targeting-heavy weapons R3
600 Targeting-automatics R3
600 Defense R3
--------------------------
5000 1 Month Food for crew (midlife food as per Penta post Oct 10 2007, 11:14 AM)
1 Month Fuel for Ship
4320 6x Breathing Regulator
2850 6x Buoyancy Compensator and Weight Belt
720 6x Face Mask and Snorkel
540 6x Fins
36000 12x Scuba Tank (75 minutes each)
2030 7x Wet Suit
12250 7x Diving Armor (B4 I2 armor)
1200 6x Dual Tank Manifold System (hold 2 tanks)
2520 7x Full Face Mask

Armory
10000 5,000r REG ammo for White Knight LMG
1000 500r REG ammo Sonter MMG
350 10x Fragmentation Grenades
450 10x HE Grenades
300 10x Flash Bang Grenades
300 10x Smoke Grenades
350 10x Thermal Smoke Grenades
450 10x HE Grenades for Ares Alpha
2400 3x Spearguns
150 15x Spears
2000 2xColt M24A3 Water Carbine [30 clip]
30 6x clips
1000 500r REG Ammo
3000 5xFN-AAL Gyro Jet Pistol [10 clip]
50 10 clips
400 200r REG Ammo
Penta
That listing looks right.

Now...I did a history for the ship. Someone ELSE pick a name.

Next post will be to the IC thread to set the scene.
DireRadiant
QUOTE (Penta)
Redjack was nice enough to point me to the ship history...

Ehhhh....It's the AngstShip. Surely a ship that cursed woulda been sunk by someone - in an attempt for the bad luck to go down with it!

Dire, I love the way you write, but...you have a tendency to dial the Angst Level to 11.smile.gif This is Shadowrun, not WOD.nyahnyah.gif (I'm teasing, I'm teasing.smile.gif)

We've got to start somewhere. If I didn't toss something out there, then who knows when we would have gotten something done. Think of it as a kind of ice breaker. Got to get the party started somehow.
Narse
List modifications:
Add:
2000-Electronic Warfare Autosoft R4 : necessary for dog-brain to be able to jam signals and encrypt traffic on its own

Actually thats about it. I was surprised to see the SC Otter on there, but this late in the game, lets just go with it.

Oh, and Penta I liked the AngstShip. And my WoD group wasn't TOO full of angst...

Here's a name off the top of my head: The Storm's Wake use it if you like.

Penta
Something that rolls off the tongue better: Thundercloud
Redjack
Did everyone see the IC Thread and the OOC Thread?

Didn't know for sure if everyone was aware they were active. wink.gif
DireRadiant
Will the team even leave dock.... tune in!
BishopMcQ
I'm there.
Penta
QUOTE (DireRadiant)
Will the team even leave dock.... tune in!

Sure you will...IF EVERYBODY POSTS! nyahnyah.gif
Tarantula
Quick question, can we assume we've waterproofed our commlinks?
WearzManySkins
It will not matter comlinks do not work underwater,,,no radio device do. Why do you think submarines have to come near the surface and raise a radio antenna.

Well ok ELF does work,,,but at a cpm of about 10

WMS
Redjack
What about the control of underwater drones?
Tarantula
Because then we don't have to worry about buying a new one anytime someone ends up overboard unexpectedly.
WearzManySkins
In Rigger 3 it was via a wire line trailed behind the device.

In 2070 it could be fiber optic line, mos RL torpedoes,,use an incredibly thin tough wire for a signals/guidance.

Look at RL remote drones for bottom exploration,,they use sets of cables to control the unmanned vehicle.

WMS
DireRadiant
QUOTE (Tarantula)
Because then we don't have to worry about buying a new one anytime someone ends up overboard unexpectedly.

plastic bags....
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