Question underwater Kaer? Atlantis?

I thought the Legends of Atlantis were stories about one of the Elven Cities (Thera? Theran?) that relied too heavily on magic and when the mana left, the city sunk/collapsed. Some one back me?

@ Cheshire: the thrashed floating city, is that IYG or a sourcebook? Either way I'd like to hear more about.

Atlantis is most likely Thera, the ancient ED empire. They surrounded their island (in the modern Mediterranean Sea) with true air and true fire to last out the Scourge. Afterwards they tried to return the Theran Empire in it's pre-Scourge glory. The former province of Barsaive (in the modern Caucus Mountains) didn't like the idea and fought back.

So in short, Thera=Altantis and Thera=a kaer (citadel really), but not an underwater one.

Also, it was not an elven only nation. See The Ancient Files for more info.

Thanks, Velocity. I thought it was something like that.

BTW, I was half joking about the Damage Shift. I don't have a IE mage, nor any plans for one, but I do believe that its possible to learn something like the Shift. I can't imagin the TN or time involved but as with most things in SR, if you throw enough karma at a problem it'll get solved.

There is a version of Damage Shift that magicians can learn: blood magic.

Well, that would be the short cut (pun intended). I was hoping for a more "hero-friendly" version.

does Leoniztion (the thing where they put you in the tank and make you young, named after Pounce D'Leone--the fountain of youth guy). yeah, that stuff. does it muck w/ your magic??

I don't know enough about genetics but couldn't you create a spell that heals the damage caused by cellular breakdown and either make it sustainable or get treatments of ot regularly?

Or did I just dumb it down and restate your idea?

Leonization creates a BioIndex, so yes, it does muck with your magic.

Kinda figured but never had a char w/ the pay-ola to get it. Or the life span, for that matter...

Right. back to magic. I tried to plow throught the magic threads but only got to page three and now I have to go. There was some support (depending on who you listen to) about magic being able to affect gravity and thus time and space. Lottsa physics stuff. Nothing tus far on repairing damage at the cellular level. Sounds like its time for a new thread...

on a side note ... I know Nothing about the Horrors ... what can I read to learn more? (I imagine they mightbe mentioned in MitS, but I'm not sure... haven't cracked it open in months )

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Update: I just did a google search for "earthdawn shadowrun" and found a GREAT page explaining the connections. Nevermind, guys. ;D This has been a really interesting thread.

For my two cents, I think that if Dunkie thought that we could fight the horrors, or at least have a good chance of survival, then he was probably right. Now maybe to go see if I can find this earthdawn book on the Horrors at my local game shop... (as if I have the to do so... )
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Haven't got much to add to the discussion anymore. Darn. Now I simply agree with most of you.

It was pretty much what I expected. Lots of atmosphere and battle scenes and monsters and stuff. None of the principle characters ever got a pimple, and their beards were always nicely trimmed. There was lots and lots and lots of CGI. Legolas was, again, The Ultimate Cool Untouchable SuperNinja. And by cool I mean totally sweet.

It was a pretty entertaining way to spend 4 hours. Just remember to piss first.

Yeah, leonization isn't the ideal way to go for an Awakened but it's also not the end of the world. I can't find which book it's in (I checked Man & Machine), but I don't think the hit to one's Bio Index is that bad; might be worth it for a mage to use it once or twice, just to buy some time for further research...

I'm reading the Talisman. Its full of short stories about the Scourge and a particular amulet.

Thera sold or used indentured servants as payment for their wards and protection.

Have any of these kaers been found? What about pieces of these wards?

I mean that's some major juju.

And another thing. Wraiths...minor horrors? I recall a mention of wraiths in the novel too.

Wraiths are minor Horrors. Harley confirms this in Paranormal Animals of (Europe?) with a shadowtalk comment along the lines of "Destroy these horrors whenever they are found. They are evil, if anything is."

That, and I seem to recall they have this cool Karma Tap ability goin' on.

I think the wraiths were one of the first to appear along with bloat form horrors.

there is this one short story where a horror has marked a person in the kaer who can break the seal of protection.

One of the main characters makes the realization that the entire kaer is dead. no hope. period.

Talk about bleak

Whoops. Somebody beat me to my point. Damn you, Fortune!

Oh, sweet--thanks for the info Fortune!

(and thanks for the thought, Kurukami )

Nuke France - I mean, It's copped so much from all the other Euro-wars that a couple of nukes won't make that much more of a difference.

BTW- _Most_ French wines (Old-world tech) are inferior to Oz ones (New-world tech), except for the high-range boutique species, you know, $100 a bottle and up?

(And the Riveria is probabily an overgrown toxic pesthole in 2060, I don't have Shadows of Europe so I can't say for sure... )

If I can wander down to the local bottle shop and pick up a vintage for $15 that is sold in Paris for $150, I know I'm on to a good thing.

(Yes, I've been around the wine industry in the development and manufacturing sides. Yes, I'm a wine snob. No, I don't particularly like it... )


L-

Flamewar, ON!

They did nuke France. The SOX, fool!

Getting rid of the horrors will be easy:

Since they will (as intelligent and advanced monsters) try to first destroy the pillar of culture and civilization, the bright center of the world, they fill flock to the UCAS. And once they are all there, we old europeans finally have a reason (we always need one) to nuke the place for good. And then we hold a big celebration party for the world is saved from all dangers.

We might even shed a tear or two - no second class nation left to laugh about!


Michael

man this thread went way off topic but since i just registered, i had to bring something up that a lot of people are missing. some don't know others merely overlooked.

first off the approach seems to be split between fight or hide. i believe it should be both. in the 4th world, heroes fought long enough to finish the defenses then hid. i feel we should be fighting as long as we can to buy ourselves time to build shelters.

secondly everyone is harping about having 3000 years, but does a great dragon really sacrifice himself and forsake all his guidance to forestall an event 3000 years in the waiting? dunk is pushing tech because he sees that the scourge is coming much sooner than we ever expected. he stalls by suicide and emphasizes tech cause it is the only thing that can scale quick enough to keep us at a standstill until shelters are finished. don't believe me? check the discussion that harlequin has with vestrial. (and how many of us know the significance of that???)

third, the scourge is so freaking long that we could fight with nukes and such, but can we produce enough? not for the entire duration, no. even orks can't breed fast enough to replace those mages and fighters who would fall. horrors would undoubtedly win the war of attrition as there are waves of them for thousands of years. hundreds of years of you are only counting significantly powerful ones. point being we'll never herd them all cause we'd have to do it thousands of times over. also a minor point is that if we covered the earth and made ourselves a corner, there is no way to ensure that the powerful horrors wouldn't just chose to show up already in our little corner bypassing everything we did.

simply stated can we fight them? not and win

but must we fight them? yes and lose, but live to hide.

I vote for, "Dust off and nuke 'em from orbit... it's the only way to be sure."

Maybe there are a few things that the Mundanes are thinking incorrectly right now. If I know my Earthdawn/SR info, we're pretty young in the magic returning cycle. we've advanced leaps and bounds beyond the advancements the Original Earthdawn Warriors had, even before the Scourge. Our Tech is Way advanced, and when you combine that with the fact that by the time the Scourge arrives, Magic will be back in Full sway, you should probably see the characters in the 6th world having about as much power as Earthdawn when it comes to Magic, Pretty much everyone in Earthdawn PC's were magical in nature, capable of burning their Karma for wicked awesome skillz. Image your 3000 years in the future Horror Destruction force, with combined units of Pure Magic and Tech, all zeroed in on the Horrors. I say these give us at the very least a much better fighting chance, if not a victory,

but then again, that's just my 2

Or we could always do MAD. If they don't leave, get up in space and nuke earth apart. No manasphere to survive = no Horrors.

Humans 1, Horrors 0

More like Humans .000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001, Horrors 0.

~J

Well, it is still infinitely better than 1:1. Actually 0.1/0 is the same as 1/0, mathmatically I think.

Well, they both equal the null set, so yes...

~J

In any respectable game, nuking someone from the orbit is worth at least 1 point. Losing earth is worth maybe...umm...0.75 points.
1:0.75
Yay! We win!

If you had any idea how large the metaplanes are, you wouldn't consider the pittance that you could kill with total terrestrial nukage to be worth counting.

Though if they got certain specific ones it'd be noteworthy.

~J

/reads through books...

Yes, there are a few noteworthy that would die if they were physically manifested when the total nukage hits. Some of them can't even step into the astral, so those would be nearly certain.

But the metaplanes are intrinsically tied to Earth's manasphere. No manasphere = no metaplanes. Total and utter destruction of the manaplanes would mean no Horrors.

Metahumans have the ability to threaten the very existance of any Horror by destroying their metaplane.