Thank you for this, has made my day, I was seriously worried about my order.

RedBrick would be my fav (second to a surviving Catalyst of course). Reunite SR and ED.

I all ways like good news. But it's weird. The last FASA product I bought was the LE of Shadowrun 3rd edition.

Actually there is, typically it is used to protect share holders (and depositors at banks) from embezzlement by the corporate bigwigs. I forget what it is called, though it may only apply to banks.

After reading everything through and becoming a little frustrated and unhappy. Can anyone comment on when we can expect an OFFICIAL statement addressing the whole picture?
Don't get me wrong, I do appreciate the insight from people that know a little of whats going on inside (by actually being involved in the matter) but it would be great to have it down on a black and white.
Comments floating around might not be 100% true, especially if the person is unhappy and or have a skewed view of the whole thing.

Rumours have the tendency to go off on a tangant for the worse of everyone.

As I said, I have asked the managers to address certain issues. They are meeting tomorrow--I can't offer any promises, but I hope to hear from them soon.

Jason H.

You know, people..all we know for why Ms. Harding left is "personal ethics." It could easily be something other then embezzlement.
For all we know,(and no, I am not asking for confirmation on this), it could be them paying the people at the top before paying the
freelancers. Additionally, even if it *IS* embezzlement, we have seen another game company in recent years survive from such a
thing. I think the biggest issue is Adam Jury leaving. To my knowledge, he did most of the layout for CGL.

However, these are all just rumours right now. It could be something else entirely going on. Bad book-keeping before they hired on
Ms. Harding is always a possibility. It could also be possible that some of the rumours are coming from people who have a grudge
against Catalyst. I really think we should wait for something to be posted.

IF Loren Coleman *DID* embezzle the funds, he can easily resign, without a golden parachute, to protect the company. HOWEVER,
since we have nothing concrete yet, we really should just take a deep breath and wait.

They could find plenty of talented people to do layout. My issue is that for as long I've "known" Adam (in an internet community sense- I don't know him personally but we first chatted on the old Undernet #shadowrun mIRC channel circa '97 iirc) he has been dedicated to making SR the best game money can buy, be it in an unofficial or official capacity. I can't imagine that he would resign over anything trivial, which is why this seems to me like a really bad sign.

I know that there is Credit Default Swap,* which is a more bizarre form of insurance. So I wouldn't be surprised. But I don't know what its called either.

*As I am sure most of us Americans are aware these days. Recently heard a story on the radio about a book The Big Short about the creation of that form of insurance and the people who made big using it.

Alright, thanks for putting my mind at ease.

http://catalystgamelabs.com/2010/03/17/cat...-press-release/

Interesting, thanks for posting that.

Edit: Started out too accusatory. That official statement is worded in such a way that it could be embezzlement or an honest mistake. I'm certainly not in the know.

I put the statement in a separate thread just to increase it's visibility. Thread here.

I'd certainly be willing to give it a chance, but I'd rather see Shadowrun as a Savage Worlds setting. I gave Catalyst's version a chance, and while I don't care all that much for it, I still love Shadowrun as a gaming setting. If it can continue on without Catalyst, I won't shed a tear.

Forgive me if this has lready been covered, but it seems they have a press release up about it:
http://catalystgamelabs.com/2010/03/17/cat...elease/#respond

Does this sounds like a softer, corporate way to confirm what Frank said in the first post, or am I paranoid?

Anyway, congrats on the reactive PR. At least we know what's happening. Thanks for the (quasi)-honesty.

Well, it really could have just been bad book-keeping like they say. If the owner who got the
funds is, indeed, paying them back, then it is not as bad as embezzlement, since it was just
an actual accounting error, not embezzlement(like happened with Palladium). If the non-disclosed
owner really is Mr. Coleman, then we can expect some of the payment to be coming out of his
payment and royalty payments for Shadows of Faith when/if it ever comes out.

Mein gott people seem really really quick to hold a funeral here. I am saddened to see some of the departures but discussion of a whole new company might be premautre. CGL has produced good products and they have turned profits. If those profits did get misused that is unfortunate and might affect the companies ability to finance further print runs.....or it might not affect it at all. The simple truth is a profitable company can and often does bounce back from fraud and mismanagement my memory could be fuzzy but Paladium and SJG have both suffered from this in the past. The point i'm trying to make is despite the losses it is quite possible that the license will stay with CGL if another buyer isn't waiting quite literally in the wings. It might become a percentage license to make up for the cash shortfall and additional underwriters might be necessary until any fraudulently lost funds can be recovered, and a recovery is never total but you can get back a lot.

I guess what I'm saying is looking at X gaming company or Y company might be a touch premature, the corpse ain't cold yet, in fact it's not even a corpse.

Aff...just because they were punched in the gut does not mean they are out of the fight...
Heck, Palladium was kicked in the nuts, and it still came back to where it was *AND*
got back their Robotech RPG license at the same time.

That's the kind of white-wash PR you get from a spin doctor.

i wouldn't really describe palladium as being in particularly wonderful shape, actually. the few employees there are working extremely long hours just to keep things running, from what i understand.

No company rep is going to take a bad situation and make it worse by setting the house on fire and bringing the possibility of a lawsuit frenzy even if a fire later turns out to be warranted.

On the upside, it does make it sound like the 'current owners' are aware of the scope of the problem and cooperation may be going on with 'one of the owners' (another reason to take a softer touch), which will mean better survivability for the company.

It could well be a case of "we won't call you a crook and press charges if you pay it back" is in play.

Actually i'm given to understand employees putting in long hours for lower then wonderfull pay is what drives the hobby, or pretty much any industry. Fact is I don't know many if any full time game devs or at least people that use it as their primary or only means of support, but I do know a lot of them who do it on the side either for love or for money.

Of course not. That's why the non-denial denial exists, after all.

I get the mishandling of money thingy.

What I don't get is what happened to cause people to jump ship during a recession. Something doesn't add up.

Do you mean leaving the company? I think they're referring to freelancers who were owed money and have made it clear that even if they're paid they have no intention of returning.

Though it's also possibly referring to some people, possibly who were supposed to be keeping an eye on things, who are resigning in order to keep from being fired. Again, no company is going to say something bad about or publicly detail the situation around an employee quitting, but they'd be well advised not to put their former employer on a recommendations list when they go job hunting!

Which is why I'm almost convinced that Frank's version is the correct one, and that the post on the CGL site is a softer, "read between the lines" one. But since I have no proof, I can't know for sure and CGL gains the benefits of the doubt.

The only conflict I really see between Frank's depiction of the situation and CGL's press release is that CGL is asserting that they can survive the situation, while Frank is painting a picture with no out for CGL.

To me, the gentle wording of the CGL release implies that all parties involved are still on relatively friendly terms in working to sort this out, and that neither side has resorted to pursuing legal action yet.

Further reading between the lines and assuming that both versions are right implies that there could be a stash of money involved that is large enough to keep the company going. The wording of the press release could well be a part of the delicate negotiations that have or are currently going on between the parties involved.

Do you really think that you will read the truth about bad rumors about a company directly on their website or in other publications / press releases? I guess that only very few companies are that honest.

And even if they are - they will just reduce their chances regarding possible future negotiations regarding loans, licence agreemens and other things so I guess it's understandable that companies are not that honest regarding their press policy about bad news.

Lets just hope this all sorts out in a good way instead of burying our beloved game in advance.

...

Guys, we're turning into JackPoint. Seriously.

In fact... hm. I need to get me hands on some PDF software...

In advance? I think it's clear that from the pattern of most RPGs that SR4 is past it's prime. The big sourcebooks/rulebooks are already out, and most of the new stuff is going to be increasingly fringe. Sales of the necessary (or almost essential) core book(s) is a key, and the game could make plenty of money with a reboot, whether in the hands of Catalyst or another company. Burying SR4 now might allow a SR5 to thrive before the product glut continues.

Turning?

I'm fairly certain that Jackpoint is just DBA Dumpshock in 2010.

No, like seriously. I just made this for fun. (And yeah, I cut out the Palladium bits; it was to fit everything on one page.)
http://img191.imageshack.us/img191/9192/du...ockhysteria.png

That is awesome. Seroiusly cool. The only way it would have been cooler is if I had been in it. Ah well, c'est la vie. Still, really cool. Major kudos and a few karma to tsuyoshikentsu.

Man I am glad this is text and I don't have to try to pronounce that handle.

Hah! That's very well done. Nice job

Bull

There's an addon to OpenOffice that lets you work with PDFs, I believe. I have it installed, just haven't tested it much. Otherwise, you're probably going to need to pay monies, or grab a LaTeX compiler.

Edit: And I'm about 30 minutes too late for it to matter.

Actually I'm quite looking forward to some of the upcoming releases and plan to give them all my extra monies ..if the things get released. And I do need and use them for my gaming.

Let me put it to you this way: I don't trust either source of this information.

One of them has a history of banging his head against the establishment so hard he cracks his skull and blood pours out of his eyes. To say that there might be some slant (some would call it dancing on the ruins of the stupid stage) to his words would be an understatement.

The other is a corporation, and we all know not to trust them or their spin. So...

(Good luck Catalyst. I can't agree with a single other company mentioned here yet for SR)

Actually, the upcoming releases are looking extremely promising - and if corp info or info on the world affairs is "fringe" in your books, I don't know what isn't.

Well . . one can say about Frank Trollman and his (posting) Style what you want . . but he seems to usually know what he is talking about . . Also nice to see that he is still around and kicking it well somewhere ^^

Let me be very clear here that none of the people who resigned did so to keep from being fired. They made difficult decisions and I respect what they did. I don't want any of them to have even the slightest hint of inappropriate behavior about them, because they were hard-working, honorable employees who will be missed.

Jason H.

By the way, we really appreciate you still coming here and talking to/with us about this.

Agreed. Jason, whatever happens, I want to thank you for being as forthright as you have been. Most people wouldn't bother exposing their humiliation to their customers. But you guys, here at least, have been better than most of us probably could expect.

Thumbs up for Jason from the freelancer front here

What, praising Jason?? DIdn't I ask you all to be civil?

Quick! Lock the thread!

Heh.

Seriously, I just want to take a sec and say thanks to everyone here for keeping their cool, for the most part. I spent a good part of yesterday worrying that we were going to have an ugly, ugly flame war on our hands.

And Jason, I'll echo what everyone else is saying, thanks for stepping up to help calm everyone a bit.

Bull

Dumpshock isn't what it used to be.

Ssssh! Don't wake the trolls...

Sorry, but you must not know much about insurance. Coverage for thief by employees/partners is standard rider on most Commercial General Liability (ironic that its initials are CGL) policies. CGL policies are what funds most litigation in North America. You slip and fall in a Starbucks? Starbucks' CGL policy is what will pay for your injuries, pay the defense of Starbucks, or both. You're a barista at Starbucks, and your boss sexually harasses you? The CGL policy is what would cover the cost. I've got a copy of a CGL policy for a small church in a small po-dunk town in South Carolina sitting on my desk right now. I just checked, and they would have coverage if something similar happened to them. The premiums are usually dirt cheap (in comparison to insurance like health or auto.) I can't imagine a company like Catalyst wouldn't have some sort of CGL policy to cover themselves. The insured amount may not cover the whole loss, but it would help.

Remember when Taco Bell floated the target in the south Pacific Ocean and promised to give everyone a free taco if the Mir space station hit it? Do you remember when Dr. Pepper had to give away a free one to everyone because Guns-N-Roses finished "Chinese Democracy?" Those two promotions were actually limited CGL insurance policies paid for by both companies (Lloyds of London if I'm not mistaken.) Both Taco Bell and Dr. Pepper bought insurance to cover the cost of the promotion in case the event happened. Taco Bell's policy didn't have to pay off whereas Dr. Pepper's did. Insurance companies are willing to gamble on almost everything if you're willing to pay the premium.

Jason:

It might be too early, but is there a feel for the impact on the future release schedule? There was a lot of interesting stuff in the pipeline (the Almanac was something I've wanted for years...I think I have an old email somewhere I pushed Mike M on it back in 1998 or 1999) that needs to to see the light of day.