Agreed, that would probably be more useful than another half dozen gangs, especially as I'm really not that fond of Shadowrun's typical "theme gang" approach. My attempt at putting non-theme gangs in Target: Matrix failed, though.

[The Urban Renewal book idea you mentioned earlier is certainly very intriguing in concept, at least.]

Before I start on Synner's question I would like to say a few things. I'm not too keen on adventures generally (although I like Blood in the Boardroom and Survival of the Fittest), so I don't want too many adventures. Please, please, no more guns..... and not too much more cyberware.

Looking at the books in the pipeline, as Mr. JLBB has quick and dirty decking rules in it, you've already made a sale. I've been hoping for something like this for quite a while. Running Wild, from what little I've heard looks to be well worth getting. SOTA64 again looks like a winner and is also on my 'must buy' list.
So is the book by Ancient History.

Now the big question, what would I like in new Shadowrun books?

I like the format of the Shadows of X and Target X books. Target: Magic is one I would really like to see. As many other people have said, give us more information on the metaplanes, spirits etc. Leave new spells to SOTA books. Do other religions have orders of spellusers like the Catholic order of St. Sylvester? What are the stands on magic and the sixth world of other religions? What is the relationships between religions?

A book on Freeports. I suggest Hong Kong, Algiers and Marseille. Perhaps Buenos Aires. (In my campaign I had three people claiming to be Evita, two of them must be wrong )

More stuff....equipment and gear, not guns. Cyber and bioware that ordinary people might have. Pictures too please. It's very helpful to be able to visualise things. For example, the concealment rules are (have to be) generalised. A picture of something helps me as GM to decide if something can be hidden where a player suggests. Tech scavenging sounds good. More stuff about everyday life, SSG is very good on this, but I would like more. More bioware and genetech.

Target Water/Underwater. Proteus and S-K are into underwater rescources. Shipping must still be important in the Sixth World as it is IRL the cheapest way to transport goods long distances. Add piracy into this and there would be many avenues for adventures.

I would like to see some more space related information, building on T:W. Having better access to Low Earth Orbit would be nice, maybe the moon but no further I think.

My son suggests small volumes on each Megacorp going into more detail than CD.

I don't know if anyone else has the same problem but my players insist on talking to the random person I put in the scene for local colour. My wife took pity on me and wrote me a book detailing half a dozen or so people each from 50 walks of life. This is just to give me a bit of an insight into their personalities and motivations. Often these come attached with adventure threads. Do other people think something like this would be useful for FanPro to publish?

Just before I stop something Paul wrote made me laugh. Harlequin and the Vatican! Pope Harlequin I

Hoi Chummers, I GM Shadowrun allot and really think that a Collections of all the Reference Tables from all 3rd edition books is necessary.

Something about the size of the Shadowrun Character Dossier. Forum Members are always looking for "Shadowrun GM Crib Sheets" . With 3rd Edition Erratas and Revised editions (some entering 5th printing) It's time has come.

Thoughtfully

QM

People keep talking about how they want SR to be grittier. Well the way to get gritty is for there to be an elephant in the room that no one wants to mention: It's all falling apart. We've passed the point of no return (or just believe we have) and every we do now is just reorganizing deck chairs on the Titanic. It doesn't matter if we're talking saving the envrionment, stopping the megacorps or just trying to get people to give a frag about anything. Hope need be a rare commodity.

Now as for what I would like, how about Target: Seattle? Yea, I know about New Seattle, frag, I've got it and the old Seattle Sourcebook, but they both have the same flaws, they stop at the Seattle border. Our power comes from the fusion plants in Olympia, how's about some info on Olympia? Where does our water come from? No way we grow enough of our own food, how much, if any, is grown in Salish? The land around Seattle ain't a part of the city, but it's part of the city's lifeblood.

Okay, don't know if someone has mentioned these....

In SrComp someone briefly explained the 10 most frequesnt types of jobs. My problem with the last two books was the more academic tour-guide feel I got from them. That's why I mention job-types. Make sure that Shadowtalk either fleshes out these jobs or tells you how commonly they occur. IE Denmark is a haven of datasnatchers but the nearest wetwork is in Finland.

I like the world source books. After you finish them, Target: Industry (spotlight) -style books might be nice.

On to the rules....

Don't add any new ones until you are ready to simplify the old ones. The only reason that I can use the system as it stands is because I've been playing for 10+ years. I don't want gritty rules, I tell gritty stories and sometimes the rules cause my mind to train-wreck when I GM.

Rigging and decking both use versions of ASIST tech but when you look over the rules I see no crossover. Adepts and magicians don't have this problem. I could go on but please just simplify and integrate these two rule sets. I know too many players and GMs that are intimidated by the _rules_, not the concept.

Art-wise, I reitirate the call for a return to the photo-realistic style of art. Go for groundbreaking stuff, edgy.

I would like to toss my hat into the ring and see if we can't get some GOOD minis.
I don't know who did the last batch (Ral Partha?) but they didn't do the setting justice. (maybe you can licence it out to Reaper...or someone) 35mm (about the scale of Reaper's Warlord series) would be cool. There are ton's of possiblities for some awsome figs. Anywhere from a tooled up troll street sam to a number of security goons.

Now for an off the wall suggestion. I think it would be neat for some one to compile/make a list of Shadowrun fire arms (and possibly other equipment) using photos of real life weapons modified buy photoshop to look like Shadowrun weapons. I always thought that the (few) illistrations given where too blocky and cartoonish. maybe it could be done as a down loadable pdf that comes with stats or whatever. Anyhoo just a thought..

-Cheers!

Well, I say that the matrix should be like the real world. Programs being like skills,and the deck being like stats. The computer skill could be used for defaulting, and or dice pools.Also for programing and everything else you do not need a "program" for.

The playing field is already insanely stacked for better gear over better skill. That would just make it worse.

~J

And the feilds of street sams aren't the same way? You could do more to add the skill playing in it.Maybe make the compoter skill only a +1 defult, or limit the rate of program by the somputer skill..But as it is now it has a whole set of rules that don't really pass themselves as hacking and reqire players and GMs to learn a new set of rules.

Okay, I've read most of this thread now, and although most (if not all) of my desires have been mentioned, it can't hurt letting the Powers-That-Be (?) know there's further interest in them. So, in no particular order:

Harlequin III - I want to see a campaign along the lines of the usual format, with Harlequin as the brains behind the scenes (along the lines of the first one, where the runners don't realize he is involved until after several adventures). Keep the runs fairly street level, with some travel, but avoid direct contact with dragons and IEs for the most part.

Target: Astral - More info on astral constructs and other astral phenomena. More detail on the metaplanes, with some info on specific ones. More astral entities and spirits.

Threats of Society - Like a mix of Prime Runners and a Target: book; detailing on old and new prime runners, and high-level movers and shakers, as well as up-and-comers. The book should be done as a 'leaked' corp document detailing and advising against these individuals and groups, and include some new plot hooks and some new relevant gear.

Shadows of Asia - Self explanatory

Exodus - Seemingly unrelated adventures regarded the efforts of the Network to rebuild Deus and fulfill his plans. Varying from very gritty, street-level runs to more high-profile corp runs. A short 'mini-campaign' of a few runs, and a few others linked to the overall plot. Maybe not a conclusion, but a furthering of the plot. Ideally this should involve some new tech, more of Deus' interesting experiments, and new drone-types.

SOTA: 206x - More info on genetech, and some expanded rules for creating genetically engineered beings (and they do exist - see Shockwaves). And I'd like to see Nanotech expanded upon - despite the mentioned problems. Making it slightly unreliable and greedily kept in the hands of it's creators should do the trick until at least 2080 sometime. Things like a rogue nanotech virus sweeping an area (plot hooks or campaign possibilities) could be cause enough for the Corporate Court to put strict guidelines on further research.
I also want to see upgraded technology for Cyberarms, some more weird/experimental cyberware pieces, more bioware (especially related to the people mimicing SURGE, and more powerful versions of existing 'wares like the ones that crazy gang has), the Matrix Monocle(!!!), Some long-range stun weapon technology (it's viable today, and with the spur from Dunkie's will should exist in SR), and finally revamping and re-introduction of the Boosted Muscles cyber from the Tir na nOg sourcebook - their combination of bioware/cyberware has interesting possibilities, even if the availability is extreme.
More robotic drones of varying uses (from labor to SSG-style household drones to security and military application).
Magic wise I am really looking forward to the promised adept expansion (very happy to read that!), and I'd like to see more metamagical techniques. Also, I'd like to some examples of, and maybe new rules for, low-powered gritty street-level magic. Maybe an influx of magic users even more limited than aspected mages/adepts

Target: Ancient Civilisations - well, not quite - but I'd like to see more ED crossovers pop up. Info on archaeological digs, magical artifacts and new types of foci, new developments in magic...

Looks like you're going to be a very happy fan for the next few books...

These are all interresting ideas that would be really feasible for the books not already in preparation. I don't like the idea of having another Harlequin story however. I think the story must go forward and new events must start. Same thing for Deus and the Network, but this story isn't concluded yet so it would be ok to release a final adventure with Deus.

why bother? if your mainly haveing combatants on foot with some drones or the odd vehicle around then use acceleration as the movement score. but if your going to do a vehicle chase where everyone is inside some form of vehicle then break out the vehicle combat system (and that is just a wraparound system to the main combat system anyways)...

Ah, I see. I was thinking in terms of damage.

I still think it's a bad idea, but I'll give it some more detailed thought when I get back from work.

~J

What would I like to see for Shadowrun?

-.) 'Realism' (plausibility) over 'Game Balance'

As an example of what I am talking about: A lot of people on this thread are complaining about magic overpowering tech ... well, what do you expect? You flat out ignore the capabilities of technology because it is "too complex" for you to "keep track of it all". Add in the arbitrary and non-sensical stupidity of 'Essence' and 'Bio Index' as limiters on human augmentation ... *sighs*

Look at it this way. A Drone Rigger is effectively a Conjurer with unlimited services and a massive bank of "summoned spirits" (Drones); something the Conjurer can never equal. A Decker can ruin your life in so many ways it is not even funny AND have their own "plane" where they are the masters. And a wired Sammie can kill you so fast you do not have time to think let alone cast a spell.

-.) Advanced technology that is actually, you know, advanced.

Excepting the human augmenation technologies (cyber, bio, etc...) and the mind-machine interface, current day technologies are nearly the equal of Shadowrun's 'advanced technologies'. We have gene-engineering, we have viable cloning, we have power-armor, we have remote drone networks (especially aircraft!), we have battletac networks, we have ... well, you get the idea.

We have not perfected it, yet these technologies are in our grasp. And we are working on the mind-machine interface right now; and then where is the science fiction part of the game? Everything is real-world. And if I wanted to play a modern-fantasy game, Shadowrun would not be it.

-.) More EarthDawn Links.

I love the Horrors, really, I do. So many ways to run a cyber-thriller with a supernatural being of absolute hate that hungers to consume your soul ...

Winglings would be very cool characters to have, as would the Obsidiman and Tskrang. Wanna watch what happens when that rock you were digging up opens it's eyes, blinks in the light, then screams as it realizes how many of its kindred you have dug up and murdered by taking them apart? And how fast it is going to tear you limb from limb for the offense? *evil GM grin*

Immortal Elves are not important to me, and neither are the Great Dragons, yet they both make interesting additions to the game. Immortal Elves for the sense of history they possess, and the Great Dragons for both their raw power and their social-political influence on the world around them.

...

I do apologize if the above reads as a rant, it is actually what I want to see more of. I desire more plausibility/realism in the game, technologies that exceed what is current by more than a decade (at the very least!), and the introduction of more EarthDawn (4th Age) elements into the game.

Okay, I take note. Plausibility, realism, living rock and little flying humanoids

Just a note, Shadowrun cannot realistically be called science fiction. It's not meant to be and it isn't, hence the non-hyperadvanced tech.

~J

What would happen if cyberware became a reality? What if strange genetic anomolies occur and spontaneously transform half the population into new metatypes? What would happen if magic returned to the world? What would it be like if people could place their consciousness in a vehicle? What would it be like if all of those elements and more all came to be?

Shadowrun takes a scientific scenario (amongst others), extrapolates a world based on its impact, and then bases stories around that world. That's practically the very definition of "science fiction."

Perhaps someone was researching it and someone else figured out how too hack the nanites and cause them to "fog" their way into a new shape. Not to handy when you're nanites have created a building or a nice supporting column to a building, etc. To a certain extent, any example of things we might be able to do now that don't exist in the Shadowrun universe could be explained away by with a similar rational.

Maybe I'm missing something, but the nanites described in the last M&M quote are more like termites on crack. They're not creating or altering anything, they're "eating" the buildings away.

It's easy to destroy a Faberge Egg. Anyone can do it. But precious few people can actually create one without extensive knowledge, experience, and practice. Same difference here. The nanites mentioned above are just dumb demolitionists that destroy anything they come in contact with (which is why they're so hard to control; they don't know when to stop). They're not sophisticated engineers capable of rearranging matter.

I was referring mostly to your comment of:

Nanites in Shadowrun haven't even gotten the "respond to computer command" thing down.

~J

Sunrunner, your descriptions of advanced and hyper-advanced are pretty much arbitrary. Our technology in 2004 is advanced compared to 2002. Not especially advanced, but advanced nonetheless. I think we both agree that SR shouldn't be hyper-advanced, but how advanced should it be?

Well, look at what we had sixty years ago (1944), especially considering that the twenty or so years previous our technological advances were primarily in the areas of war (thanks to WWI and WWII). Given the difference in tech levels, how advanced should technology be 60 years in the future, given that our computer architecture was reduced to rubble, the entire world was thrown into rebellion, a whole new field of science appeared (magic) and environmental problems have forced our focus to be on how to cram the most people into the least space.

Logically, our advances in magic should be huge, and they are. Similarly, advances in housing, feeding and supporting a huge population should have been pretty major, and they largely have been. Medical technology has grown in leaps and bounds, computer technology has reinvented the wheel and then some. IMO, space should have been a LOT more important than it was, but they do have a self-sustained orbital, which required a ton of new technologies. Are nanotech or cloning as cutting edge as they could've been, if corps had put their focus in that? No, not really. But I think it's apparent why, there were bigger money markets out there.

I would say, considering how much they had to invent and reinvent, I'm actually surprised SR technology is as far as it is. List out all of the discoveries people have made and you'll see why. Nanotech is useful, but not as useful (and not as quick a return on investment) as say... growing enough food for all your consumers. (Before you comment on how nanotech can build food, remember that ROI, that's the one and only factor the corps look like. Given that, they're going to put their cash in mycoproteins and hydroponics. Let losers like Fuchi waste money researching nanotech.)

Once you have nanites which can respond indivudually to a remote binary command you have the preconditions for a utility fog as I read it (though I'm picking up the argument as a I go along). Presumably grip/ungrip would give you 90% of what you need, and to the extent it didn't it's really not that hard to imagine nanites going from 1-bit logic (grip/ungrip) to a 2 or 3 bit logic (grip all sides, grip top, grip left, grip right, grip bottom, grip none) - there might be size issues for the processor but it's not like you're talking orders of magnitude more complex.

The more relevant question is whether you can send orders to nanites in a swarm individually - if you have to tell them all to grip/ungrip as a unit then you're screwed, whereas if you can tailor a signal to say "nanites 1 through 10,878 grip left, nanites 10,879 through 872,380 release, the rest of you keep doing what you're doing" then you have what you need. I'm not sure if the canon examples display this quality, though I can't help but think that getitng a nanite to recognise whether it's "call sign" preceeds an order wouldn't be too challenging even at that scale.

For those of you wondering exactly what's in the upcoming releases, FanPro has uploaded the intros to SOTA64 and Mr Johnson's Little Black Book. I think you'll find that these books cover a number of ideas that have been proposed on this thread so far.

Cool. Your so dead on it´s scary.

If the reason isn´t simply that your filling in the obvious gaps you´ve left in the previous books. Not a bad thing in itself.