Full Version: Shadowrun Online - The MMO
Im all for a 'Death has possible perment reprocussions" idea.
You'll never see a perma-death MMO that does well. Ever.
Perma-death will appeal to only a tiny fraction of your target audience. The percentage that would instead get pissed off and stop playing is massively higher.
It's all about numbers.
-karma
Perma-death will appeal to only a tiny fraction of your target audience. The percentage that would instead get pissed off and stop playing is massively higher.
It's all about numbers.
-karma
i also agree perma death would be a bad thing.... for a couple of reasons...
first, it just doesnt fit well in the MMO worlds
second, i think it would be kinda cool, although, not neccessarily SRish, if, upon death, you were forced into a hospital (the way a number of MUDs do it currently) and downtime would either be forced, or you can try and "break out" early, naked and BADLY hurt...
first, it just doesnt fit well in the MMO worlds
second, i think it would be kinda cool, although, not neccessarily SRish, if, upon death, you were forced into a hospital (the way a number of MUDs do it currently) and downtime would either be forced, or you can try and "break out" early, naked and BADLY hurt...
sr dose not fit into the MMO mold at all, if you make a MMO of SR it will suck. you will have the matrix online. only worse. in the process you will hurt the SR public imagen and drive players from an already all-to-thin gameing group.
HOWEVER! if you were to make SR into a MMO. that might be a truley awsom game. to do this you will have to unlearn all of what you know from other online games. it would have to be a whole new animal.
lets face it 99% of the MMO's out there realy suck, alot, and i can pick huge holes in the 2 or 3 good ones. what is missing is a truley living world online. that is what SR whould HAVE to be. that means real death, real social links, real interaction with the world.
ppl will get used to mortality on the web. it is not that far out. it is just different. it will draw a diffrent crowd.
IF YOU DID NOT WANT TO BE DIFFRENT, WHY DID YOU TRY FOR AN SR MMO. JUST MAKE ANOTHER EVERCRACK CLONE AND LET IT GET LOST AMONG THE PILES OF CRAP WITHIN GOOGLE!
HOWEVER! if you were to make SR into a MMO. that might be a truley awsom game. to do this you will have to unlearn all of what you know from other online games. it would have to be a whole new animal.
lets face it 99% of the MMO's out there realy suck, alot, and i can pick huge holes in the 2 or 3 good ones. what is missing is a truley living world online. that is what SR whould HAVE to be. that means real death, real social links, real interaction with the world.
ppl will get used to mortality on the web. it is not that far out. it is just different. it will draw a diffrent crowd.
IF YOU DID NOT WANT TO BE DIFFRENT, WHY DID YOU TRY FOR AN SR MMO. JUST MAKE ANOTHER EVERCRACK CLONE AND LET IT GET LOST AMONG THE PILES OF CRAP WITHIN GOOGLE!
Ya know razor, despite my above post, i do find myself agreeing with you, but like most things...ground breaking... timing will/would be EVERYTHING in regards to this sort of thing.
However, in all honestly, permadeath isn't really a "new" thing, as i remember playing a MUD by the name of Dragonrealms, which was a fantasy genre game, that has "favors" that were used to prevent the complete loss of you're character. if you died with favors and were rezzed, everything was good, if you died and couldnt be rezzed, everything was fine, you just lost a favor. however, die without favors, and if you couldnt be rezzed, you could perma die... and if you did get rezzed, the cleric brining you back would loss a favor.
However, in all honestly, permadeath isn't really a "new" thing, as i remember playing a MUD by the name of Dragonrealms, which was a fantasy genre game, that has "favors" that were used to prevent the complete loss of you're character. if you died with favors and were rezzed, everything was good, if you died and couldnt be rezzed, everything was fine, you just lost a favor. however, die without favors, and if you couldnt be rezzed, you could perma die... and if you did get rezzed, the cleric brining you back would loss a favor.
| QUOTE (Lindt) |
| Im all for a 'Death has possible perment reprocussions" idea. |
Like "not being alive anymore?"
One should be able to not die if one play it safe.
I know there is nothing new since Rome, but a true death experience is not present in the mainstream MMO world. it is far to "out side the box" for any corporate sponsor to like. I have the Odd profession of making blimps (yes like the goodyear blimp, no not THE goodyear blimp, and yes in RL). I know all about marketing and fund/investor rasing. it is hard to push crazy things like logic and innovation onto investors. they like formula. xyz made n$ last time so it will again. is how they think.
I'll I'm saying is this.
If i see a naked raid WOW style on aztech, i'm going to laugh, then i'm going to cry. then i'm going to make my own RL shadowrun to destroy some mainframes.
and on a tangent note i would like to volunteer my time and knowledge twords this project. programing is a week spot for me, but i can offer much more.
I know there is nothing new since Rome, but a true death experience is not present in the mainstream MMO world. it is far to "out side the box" for any corporate sponsor to like. I have the Odd profession of making blimps (yes like the goodyear blimp, no not THE goodyear blimp, and yes in RL). I know all about marketing and fund/investor rasing. it is hard to push crazy things like logic and innovation onto investors. they like formula. xyz made n$ last time so it will again. is how they think.
I'll I'm saying is this.
If i see a naked raid WOW style on aztech, i'm going to laugh, then i'm going to cry. then i'm going to make my own RL shadowrun to destroy some mainframes.
and on a tangent note i would like to volunteer my time and knowledge twords this project. programing is a week spot for me, but i can offer much more.
| QUOTE (KarmaInferno) |
| You'll never see a perma-death MMO that does well. Ever. Perma-death will appeal to only a tiny fraction of your target audience. The percentage that would instead get pissed off and stop playing is massively higher. It's all about numbers. |
that depends entirely on how you do it. for instance, you could make it very hard to die, in most cases--but make even minor damage have effects harsher than a simple reduction in your red bar. if people experience steep penalties when they take damage, which get steeper and steeper the more damage they take, then most people will try to avoid taking damage (rather than simply trying to avoid dying, the way it works in most MMOs). if you make perception and targetting a larger part of gameplay (ie, no more tab-selection), wounded people will be able to go to ground more easily when they are wounded.
in other words, make it more like SR than D&D.
| QUOTE |
| You'll never see a perma-death MMO that does well. Ever. |
Correct. No one will pay a subscription fee for the ability to lose a character one could theoretically spend months creating and developing. The only multiplayer game that ever accomplished this well was Diablo II, and later issues involving lag, connectivity and exploits lead to much grumbling about it.
If you read on earlier in this thread, you'll see that the permadeath issue has already been addressed ad nauseum.
| QUOTE |
| If i see a naked raid WOW style on aztech, i'm going to laugh, then i'm going to cry. then i'm going to make my own RL shadowrun to destroy some mainframes. |
You are more than welcome to raid Aztechnology naked. They will appreciate the donation in experimental material, and DocWagon will appreciate donation in nuyen when they tow your corpses away.
Unless it's a Million PhysAd Raid.
Then Aztech will be all "wtf, yo?" and DocWagon will be all "YAAAY! WE LIKE YOUR MONIEZ!"
And yes. Greypawn is right. If I'm going to be donating my moniez to the up and coming megacorp-to-be SRO, Inc, I damned well had better not find months and maybe even years of roleplay and time spent leveling up down the toilet bcause I lagggggggggggged, or because some griefer fuck got his griefer fuck friends together and gang banged me.
Yes, it's a threat in real SR. However, in real SR, I'm not paying the DM.
Then Aztech will be all "wtf, yo?" and DocWagon will be all "YAAAY! WE LIKE YOUR MONIEZ!"
And yes. Greypawn is right. If I'm going to be donating my moniez to the up and coming megacorp-to-be SRO, Inc, I damned well had better not find months and maybe even years of roleplay and time spent leveling up down the toilet bcause I lagggggggggggged, or because some griefer fuck got his griefer fuck friends together and gang banged me.
Yes, it's a threat in real SR. However, in real SR, I'm not paying the DM.
i supose if i had to choose (a non-purest) system for dealing with death in SR MMO i'd go with an "ashron's call" GTA mix. maby some time lag on the rez depending on who hard it is to get you body out.
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