remember ..the mage with the body of 2 only has 9 boxes of condition. Those 6 boxes of damage translate into -2 dice to your pool...thus you won't be able to use that body to soak anything...you really REALLY wanna do that??

Yeah..to clarify, IF you buy into awakened status, you start with 3 magic points....and it BLOODY expensive to keep buying up. But then attributes seem to be pretty hefty in points cost

Oh to qualify that first paragraph...I don't know if I mentioned...every 3 boxes of damage (on both condition monitors, Physical and Stun) translate into a -1 to your dice pools. So you'll get less adept at doing things as you get hit. Rob noted in the Origins presentation, although he thought it was less easy to be instakilled in this version of the game, it was a damn amount easier to get knocked out...so then the Corps have a mind to screw with (for mean GMs like me)

Oh and Hobgoblin is on about how drain works...it's damage just like combat IIRC

Oh..Thanos...if you can remember it...what was the automatic success thingy?? I remember liking it (something like if you had more dice than the threshold you could trade in 4 pool for at least 1 automatic success...but I may have misheard that..and don't remember seeing it in the book) if you happen to be able to remember that post that for the good folks

Thanks Synner.


Okay, not trying to be argumentive, just trying to understand:

Argg Demonseed was quicker on the draw.

Just to clarify since there's a lot of dicsussion, it's 8+1/2 Attribute for condition monitor.

Bull

that depends, if he is wearing a lot of armor he may well go down from mental damage (rember that any damage thats stopped fully by armor converts to mental/stun damage).

so while he may just be seeing stars or birds he is still out for whatever fight thats going on. and most likely he will be behind bars unless the team wins

up I assume...average human 3 body...= 10 boxes of condition..but that's an assumption cause I didn't look closely at it, but I seem to remember a 3 body character having 10 boxes of physical

On another note Kage has been kind enough to host the vidoe I shot...you can now see what a crappy photographer I am..and remember this is the Srun4 stuff...not the whiole thing

it's down now...so I will remove that link

As posted in the other thread, it's been pulled by request. Sorry for the inconvenience to all involved.

~J

Biotech (Bioware?) now affects essence? Definitely a minus, particularly since it already costs more than comparable cyber implants. The elegance of Bio was that it had a better stealth factor than Cyber since it had a lower "impact" on the character's metahumanity.

If it has lower essence costs and it's done well (by not simply duplicating cyberware, but having different, more natural-seeming abilities), then it could retain its magic-friendly feeling (or even enhance it). If it's just a different way to spell "betaware", then that's rather dull.

Okay is boosted reflexex bio or cyber....

Look Why would have having cat eyes make you more human than cybereyes? i wish they would get rid of the socail bullshit. let's face metal bones do not make people react to as if you were a freak. If they can't see the ware, they shouldn't be acting if you were different.

Alright, though this is off topic I'm going to reply to it anyway. According to the BBB once your essence hits 3.5 or lower you should start suffering social penalties rather the 'ware is visible or not. This is because as a person loses essence they also start to lose empathy with other people. It's not a reaction from others seeing him as a freak for his 'ware. The +1 per 2 essence lost rule does only apply to visible 'ware, any sort of reflex enhancements that are active are classified as visible 'ware because the effects are apparent.

Alright, on topic, reading over this thread's getting me anxious. It sounds like the new rules are going to be a nice change of pace. My question is if there's any word on adepts and what direction they'll be taken? I really liked some of the less combat intensive powers published in SoTA and hope to see more of the same.

Looking back at them, a lot of them seemed to be dice mods which should be ported into Fourth Edition relatively easily.

Yeah. I'm wondering if Adept powers have been balanced differently. But it seems I read somewhere that the main book will include rules for converting the older stuff.

Any news on Knowledge skills? I always felt that was a good change from 2nd to 3rd. Allowed for alot of fleshing out of a characters interests through them.

No, the conversion rules will be on the website.

I would not want to try "converting" a character from SR3 to SR4 except by converting them into karma/build points, and rebuilding with the same goals in mind. There are all sorts of aspects of a character that could have been signature characteristics which are now effectively impossible (for example, if I'm understanding the attribute comments correctly, you can no longer have an elvish bodybuilder who, unaugmented, is as strong as most trolls, even after devoting tens/hundreds of karma to developing strength). There are all sorts of reasons for past choices that no longer exist (being a shaman instead of a hermetic because you needed fast access to spirits). There are all sorts of barriers to converting mechanics (+3 TN does not have the same effect as -3 dice or +1 threshold), cyberware (bio index + essence being collapsed to essence will make characters run out of room, or have extra room, or both), deckers (they had to learn new skills and get new hardware in the intervening 5 years anyway), and so on.

Adepts might have the easiest time of it, since dice bonuses map well onto dice bonuses. Those things that give bonuses to combat pool are less obviously dealt with, however. Assuming they're in there at all, I would not worry about adepts changing terribly much (I think overall they worked pretty well before), although I suppose it's possible they could change things substantially just to be different.

While I do agree with your technic for conversion, I would hardly consider a shaman being converted in a hermetic mage ... Because I would probably end up with a very different character (since you use your totem as background and roleplay)

That and now it's a role-play vs. meta-game factor. i like this. Also, I'm sure with the tradition building rules, you can come up with some funky hermetics and some studious shamanic.

If they're new Traditions, why would you be using the term "Hermetic" and "Shamanic"? Those are already in the main book.

Tradition in the sense of Dog shaman vs. self-taught street mage with a copy of grimmorim for dummies,v.1.0

But those aren't Traditions. They're variations on a theme. I wouldn't even consider each totem a sub-Tradition, nor the Paradigms from State of the Art.

Ah, then we have differing views of traditions I think.

LOL. Those powers suck for Johnson's. Half the fun sometimes is lying to them. now, if they don't immediately act on those lies and the group has no idea of the powers, then we have some interesting turns to take.

Clears throat, so no clue on knowledge skills then?

As far as conversions go, I hope bioware conversions cause less issues then the 2nd-3rd cross did, though from what I'm reading I sort of doubt it. Bioware has always been one of my favorites. I'm also hoping it will retain it's nigh-impossible to detect by cyber-scanners factor.

Actually I am anticipating watching a large numbher of my characters suddenly drop dead from 4thEDitis as they will now have too many wares

why?

If I would hazard a guess, I'd say .01 Essence and plenty of Bioware.

It's certainly not guaranteed, but not a wholly unreasonable assumption.

~J

i am reasonably certain that this will not be an issue.

Good to know.

Didn't someone mention a reduced pricing scheme in cyberware? It's reasonable to extrapolate from the incorporation of bio and cyber ware into one mechanic for impact of the body, mfb's comment, and the general idea that a viable 3rd edition character should not just up and croak cause a new got published that the essence costs are overall reduced, possibly significantly. To that end, i hope they rectify the atrocity that is the cyber-eye camera and video camera implant.

I'm not sure if reduced price means not only a reduced -cost but also a reduced essence cost. I hope so, even more when having in mind that bioware now will also cost essence.

Fair enough