Full Version: Ask tisoz about SR4
Thereīs propably not any modifiers to dodge and dmg resistance mostly, right? In SR3 only shotguns and grenades modified dodge as far as I remember. So my hope lies in much less modifiers to the attack roll. Is it really the same as before?
| QUOTE (tisoz) | ||
Looks like bs. -1 modifier or GM can declare they can not try. Edge can augment. |
So i guess most PCs are going to sit close to the 50% BP limit for attributes, depending on GM's implementation of Defaulting judgement.
| QUOTE (hermit @ Aug 19 2005, 06:20 PM) |
| It seems noone has noticed, but ... Wired 2 still costs comparably much essence (3), but it's nuyen cost has been *divided by ten*! Does this mean such combat cyberware will be more common now? Will we see a rush of wired-to-the-teeth gangers? Will every character need reaction bossting equipment to be even remotely feasible in combat? If every skinhjead can have Wired 3 for the price of a car, I guess most non-cybered characters are gonna think twice before going out ... |
Remember it is not available under standard chargen rules.
Maybe all the other ware hat did get an essence reduction will make everyone forego Wired 2?
| QUOTE |
| Also, with wired 2 costing as much essence as before, how will this treat bioware'd characters, like the essence0.1 streetsam with a bio index of 2? Will they suddenly die and wither away in 2070 because their bodies notice their system actually never could cope with all their cyber and bio ... or what? I though cyber waqs gonnna be less essence to compensate for bio using essence up now, too ...  |
I think it will be hard to convert many played characters. Hope your GM lets you remove some cyber or upgrade the grade to make it all fit.
What all did he have and I'll see where some savings may be. Like a smartlink is .1 essence. It also looks like it doesn't matter if the smartlink is all cybernetic or not for the modifier.
Tisoz, are you sure that Wired Reflexes 2 are above starting availability? I mean, the Street Sammie example you posted had them (alpha, to boot).
Oh, and I can't find where you explained about the new megas.
Oh, and I can't find where you explained about the new megas.
The link for the new(ish) megas is here (scroll down about halfway)
| QUOTE (JongWK) |
| .... Specialization (+2) Take Aim (+1) .... |
What?
Page 84 max availability at chargen is 12.
Page 334 - Wired Reflexes 2, availability - 16R
Page 303 - cyberware grades. Essence and cost multipliers but no mention of availability other than yes or no at chargen.
Looks like erratta somewhere.
Evo was Yamatetsu, NeoNet was Novatech was Fuchi.
Page 334 - Wired Reflexes 2, availability - 16R
Page 303 - cyberware grades. Essence and cost multipliers but no mention of availability other than yes or no at chargen.
Looks like erratta somewhere.
Evo was Yamatetsu, NeoNet was Novatech was Fuchi.
| QUOTE (Serbitar) |
| seems like dodging is REALLY crucial. Bacause you wont be able to shake off that damage. edit: ah, too late. What does "full defense" mean. Is that a complex action, or cant you do anything else in that rurn, or what ? |
Yes, Full defense is a complex action. It can be used when needed but uses up the characters next available action as long as not surprised. Can carry over to next combat turn.
What does WR2 do fgor youL
| QUOTE (blakkie) | ||
What? |
Specialization adds 2 dice and (IIRC), aiming adds another one.
| QUOTE (tisoz) | ||
Yes, Full defense is a complex action. It can be used when needed but uses up the characters next available action as long as not surprised. Can carry over to next combat turn. |
Only once or can you dodge multiple rounds with dodge skill?
| QUOTE (JongWK) | ||||
Specialization adds 2 dice and (IIRC), aiming adds another one. |
No, i mean what is Specialization...other than something i want to have to be badazz? And how can i Take Aim?
Taking Aim is a simple action is SR3 (-1 to TN). Apparently similar in SR4, except that it adds a die.
| QUOTE (tisoz) |
| Page 84 max availability at chargen is 12. Page 334 - Wired Reflexes 2, availability - 16R Page 303 - cyberware grades. Essence and cost multipliers but no mention of availability other than yes or no at chargen. Looks like erratta somewhere. Evo was Yamatetsu, NeoNet was Novatech was Fuchi. |
What cyber grades are listed, and do they operate the same way as they did in SR3?
Can specializations exceed the skill cap of 6? As in Firearms Skill Group 6 (spec:Pistols +2) for 8 dice?
Any word on how Shapeshifters or Regeneration work?
| QUOTE (Serbitar) |
| How does initiative work now ? |
Initiative Attribute is Reaction + Intuition. Make an initiative roll, edge may be used. (Does this mean all dice explode?) Add hits to Initiative Attribute, this is initiative score. Act high to low, ties go at same time. If imperitive to break ties compare edge, initiative, reaction attributes in that order.
You have to roll more dice but you donīt have to add as big numbers together for the result that way... guess itīs more in line with how rolls work in the rest of the system, though I was a bit taken by the fact that itīs more dice than before.
| QUOTE (mintcar) |
| Thereīs propably not any modifiers to dodge and dmg resistance mostly, right? In SR3 only shotguns and grenades modified dodge as far as I remember. So my hope lies in much less modifiers to the attack roll. Is it really the same as before? |
Some Defense modifiers.
Defender unaware of attack, no defense possible
Defender wounded - wound mods
Defender defended against previous attack, -1 modifier cumulative for each additional defense roll
Defender prone, -2 pool mod limited to melee and ranged combat within 5m.
Defender running, +2 moDefender in melee combat, -3 pool modifier vs ranged attacks
Attacker firing burst or shotgun, -2mod vs wide bursts, -5 vs long wide bursts, -9 vs full auto wide bursts, -2 vs shotgun on medium spread, -4 against wide spread.
gaah. Looks just like the old edition. I guess Iīll have to go with blind faith that this one is faster.
About the initiative system. Wouldnīt this make it far less certain that a wired character goes before an unwired character in the first pass?
About the initiative system. Wouldnīt this make it far less certain that a wired character goes before an unwired character in the first pass?
So how do reaction enhancing cyber / powers / spells affect initiative? When you have more than one action / initiative pass, do you take them all at once?
Also, can you still take two simple actions or one complex action per turn/initiative pass? If yes, then Take Aim would be worthless, because situations in which you'd trade shooting twice for shooting once with an extra die would be exceedingly rare.
If not, what is the new action system like?
And, damn... How do those "super extra wide bursts" affect the power of shots? It seems like shotguns are still as stupid as ever.
Also, can you still take two simple actions or one complex action per turn/initiative pass? If yes, then Take Aim would be worthless, because situations in which you'd trade shooting twice for shooting once with an extra die would be exceedingly rare.
If not, what is the new action system like?
And, damn... How do those "super extra wide bursts" affect the power of shots? It seems like shotguns are still as stupid as ever.
| QUOTE (blakkie) |
| What does WR2 do fgor youL |
Makes me a burnout.
System includes a trigger to turn on and off. +1 to Reaction and +1 Initiative pass per rating point. So +2 Reaction, +2 Initiative passes (roughly +20 initiative?)
What are initiative passes and how do they work? I'm guessing something along the lines of actions per round?
| QUOTE (mmu1) |
| Also, can you still take two simple actions or one complex action per turn/initiative pass? If yes, then Take Aim would be worthless, because situations in which you'd trade shooting twice for shooting once with an extra die would be exceedingly rare. |
That is exactly what occured to me, which is why i asked about the Take Aim.
It was already not much use without a lot of dice in SR3.
| QUOTE (JongWK @ Aug 19 2005, 06:55 PM) | ||||
Specialization adds 2 dice and (IIRC), aiming adds another one. |
Specialization?
[edit] JongWK is correct, the info is in the chargen section, but not listed on the ranged combat modifiers table. Somethings stay the same.
Smartlink gives +2.
Wow, lots of great information here.
What skills belong to the Athletics group, the Electronics group and the Mechanic group?
(Actually I would love to see the full list of active skills, but I won't ask that of you.)
Does the adept still buy powers with his magic rating? How are the power costs compared to third edition?
- Magnus Jakobsson
What skills belong to the Athletics group, the Electronics group and the Mechanic group?
(Actually I would love to see the full list of active skills, but I won't ask that of you.)
Does the adept still buy powers with his magic rating? How are the power costs compared to third edition?
- Magnus Jakobsson
| QUOTE |
| System includes a trigger to turn on and off. +1 to Reaction and +1 Initiative pass per rating point. So +2 Reaction, +2 Initiative passes (roughly +20 initiative?) |
Eccept it wont guarantee going first like it used to. Isnīt going first the most crusial thing of all?
| QUOTE (Serbitar) | ||||
Only once or can you dodge multiple rounds with dodge skill? |
Under Full Defense it says you dodge until your next Action Phase. Under Defense modifiers it says for each attack dodged since last action, you get a cumulative -1 modifier. Sounds like you can dodge several attacks.
| QUOTE (bclements) |
| Taking Aim is a simple action is SR3 (-1 to TN). Apparently similar in SR4, except that it adds a die. |
Looks that way.
| QUOTE (JBlades) |
| Can specializations exceed the skill cap of 6? As in Firearms Skill Group 6 (spec:Pistols +2) for 8 dice? |
You can't specialize with Skill Groups, but you could do so with a single skill (Pistols 6/Automatics 8... the extra dice does not count for the skill limit).
For those who wondered: I know take aim is of limited use, but the example was for someone who was wondering if a man could be killed in *one* shot (if it was me, I'd shot him once to do a little damage, then use Edge for the second, killing blow).
| QUOTE (mintcar) | ||
Eccept it wont guarantee going first like it used to. Isnīt going first the most crusial thing of all? |
The odds of going first are still pretty damn good... Look at two characters with a base initative of 6 - one with WR2 and one without. As long as the wired guy gets at least one hit on 8 dice, the non-wired guy needs to get 4 hits on 6 dice to beat him. That's hardly ever going to happen.
I do fail to see how this, or anything having to do with combat so far, is appreciably easier or simpler, though...
| QUOTE (Samoth) |
| What cyber grades are listed, and do they operate the same way as they did in SR3? |
Alpha, -20% ess., cost*2
Beta, -30% ess., cost*4
Delta, -50% ess., cost*10
Very little info, but all accessories need to be same grade as base implant.
| QUOTE (JBlades) |
| Can specializations exceed the skill cap of 6? As in Firearms Skill Group 6 (spec:Pistols +2) for 8 dice? |
Specialization is a modifier to the dice pool, not an increase in skill, or that's the way it looks. Your example is wrong about the skill group, but is on target if applied to Pistols 6, specialization semi-automatics for 8 dice + Agility as base dice pool.
| QUOTE (White Noise) |
| Any word on how Shapeshifters or Regeneration work? |
Not as PCs.
| QUOTE (mintcar) |
| gaah. Looks just like the old edition. I guess Iīll have to go with blind faith that this one is faster. About the initiative system. Wouldnīt this make it far less certain that a wired character goes before an unwired character in the first pass? |
Each level of Wired reflexes gives you an extra pass + other stuff. I covered it earlier.
| QUOTE (tisoz @ Aug 19 2005, 08:01 PM) | ||
Each level of Wired reflexes gives you an extra pass + other stuff. I covered it earlier. |
But you have to have the high Init roll + Initiative (or win on a tiebreaker) to go first, although the extra Reaction is going to help there?
| QUOTE (mmu1 @ Aug 19 2005, 07:31 PM) |
| So how do reaction enhancing cyber / powers / spells affect initiative? When you have more than one action / initiative pass, do you take them all at once? |
[edit] It creates phases within the turn, similar to if a character had initiative over 10 in SR3.
| QUOTE |
| Also, can you still take two simple actions or one complex action per turn/initiative pass? If yes, then Take Aim would be worthless, because situations in which you'd trade shooting twice for shooting once with an extra die would be exceedingly rare. |
1 Free action anytime during Pass, 2 simple or 1 complex during action phase. Similar to SR3, but no more Free actions on anyones phase.
| QUOTE |
| And, damn... How do those "super extra wide bursts" affect the power of shots? It seems like shotguns are still as stupid as ever. |
There are Narrow and Wide bursts and autofire. Narrow increases damage, wide increases likelyhood to hit. With shotguns there are basically 3 choke settings that allow you to hit more targets, and/or make it harder to dodge and decrease the power of the attack.
Who's President of the UCAS?
What are the six core settings? We know of Seattle and Hong Kong already.
Are shapeshifters, vampires or the regeneration power listed for NPCs/critters?
What are the six core settings? We know of Seattle and Hong Kong already.
Are shapeshifters, vampires or the regeneration power listed for NPCs/critters?
| QUOTE (JBlades) |
| What are initiative passes and how do they work? I'm guessing something along the lines of actions per round? |
I was thinking Initiative worked like SR3 where you get an intiative score and work your way down subtracting 10. WRONG! (Info on Wired Reflexes is flawed.)
You get an initiative score and work your way down. If no one the ability to get extra actions, the turn is over and intiative is determined again. If someone can take extra actions they get to go again in order of highest intiative. No one can act in more than 4 Initiative Phases in a combat turn.
| QUOTE (Magnus Jakobsson) |
| Wow, lots of great information here. What skills belong to the Athletics group, the Electronics group and the Mechanic group? (Actually I would love to see the full list of active skills, but I won't ask that of you.) Does the adept still buy powers with his magic rating? How are the power costs compared to third edition? - Magnus Jakobsson |
Athletics, think about it. Running, Jumping, climbing, swimming. Now I'll check.
Damn, it was gymnastics instead of jumping.
Electronics is now more computer, so computer, hardware, software, data search.
Mechanic, aeronautics, automotive, industrial, nautical.
Adepts buy powers the same way. Adept powers cost pretty much what they used to cost.
You are my hero tisoz.
| QUOTE (Toa) |
| Who's President of the UCAS? What are the six core settings? We know of Seattle and Hong Kong already. Are shapeshifters, vampires or the regeneration power listed for NPCs/critters? |
Angela Colloton
Core settings are mentioned as the Matrix and the astral plane. I do not see much mention of Seattle or any other City as a default setting.
Regeneration and Vampires. Ghouls but no shapeshifters.
| QUOTE (Jrayjoker) |
| You are my hero tisoz. |
thanks.
One last question about hackers, with a sub-question about Technomancers: Is there still the concept of flux, as in a transmission range, with wireless communication? If there is what is the native flux (range) of a Technomancer's body/brain/nerveous system?
After that feel free to ramble on the subject that hasn't come up at all yet, vehicles and rigging.
After that feel free to ramble on the subject that hasn't come up at all yet, vehicles and rigging.
Flux looks like it is now signal. Technomancer signal is Resonance/2 (round up).
Signal 0 - 3m
Signal 1 - 40m
Signal 2 - 100m
Signal 3 - 400m
Signal 4 - 1km
...
Signal 9 - 400km
Signal 0 - 3m
Signal 1 - 40m
Signal 2 - 100m
Signal 3 - 400m
Signal 4 - 1km
...
Signal 9 - 400km
Thanks, with that i think i'm to the point of being at ease enough with them. So i'm not going to ask about the existance of Digital Fireballs and risk ruining the moment. 
Thanks a lot, and have a good night.
P.S. You might want to check out that release party. If you are lucky you might be able to snap some blackmail pics to use in extorting yourself a LE.
Thanks a lot, and have a good night.
P.S. You might want to check out that release party. If you are lucky you might be able to snap some blackmail pics to use in extorting yourself a LE.
Oh, and if you come across that 'runner team i sent tell them i "want to meet with them to discuss a job better suited to their unique talents" and i'll split 50-50 with you whatever i get for them at the organleggers.
| QUOTE (tisoz @ Aug 19 2005, 08:45 PM) | ||
Angela Colloton |
Oh, man. This is gonna be great.
| QUOTE (blakkie) |
| Oh, and if you come across that 'runner team i sent tell them i "want to meet with them to discuss a job better suited to their unique talents" and i'll split 50-50 with you whatever i get for them at the organleggers. |
I suggest cutting our losses and having your otaku tribe use Info Sortalige, this forum and the preview PDFs to reconstruct the whole PDF.
| QUOTE (SL James) | ||||
Oh, man. This is gonna be great. |
The Brigadier General will have those pussy USAC bueracrats whipped into shape in no time!
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