From what I remember when I would go there, anyone saying negative stuff was pretty much blasted. I know it happened to me, by a demo agent no less - so I said goodbye. Maybe the attitude is changing as things don't improve as quickly as people would like? I dunno.

I hope SR continues to do well, but the new editions are not for me - not yet anyway. I'll get and read the fiction but that's about it.

I have not bought a new Wizard's Book since DnD 3.5 was actually supported. Largely due to dissatisfaction with the company and their direction. *shrug*

Same here, but have you seen the amount for 4th edition crap they put out? Meanwhile their biggest downfall was discontinuing support for the older edition in an effort to force people into buying the new one. Something that CGL has handled a little better at least.

You nailed it... Crap is exactly what it was.
Not a big fan of Wizards over the last 6-8 years or so.

Dumpshock isn't a great site (broken search function and only 3 pages of active threads) but the SR Tabletop forums aren't really any better or worse. It is strange seeing people affiliated with Catalyst in one way or another get into slapfights with the people paying money for the product (there's one guy there who puts people on his ignore list any time someone disagrees with him - wonder how he can even read the forums at this point?)

At least Dumpshock is more active than any ED forum I know of

which isn't saying much sadly . .

Don't I know it

How long ago was that? Because that doesn't sound at all like how things go over there. There's a certain standard of reasonableness, sure, but...

Month or two ago maybe?

*looks it up*

That... wasn't really to do with saying negative stuff about the game or CGL; you got 'blasted' in a conversation about his nickname for Dumpshock.

...that's, not really helping things if you blindly buy everything just because it has the name "Shadowrun" on it.


Yeah no; nothing like that.

Besides the a lot of discussion about the state of Run & Gun at release, we've also had people criticizing the erratic release schedule of Missions content and how Bull, despite all of his personal problems, apparently didn't hand the keys to the kingdom to someone else and to keep going without him.

I myself had been very vocal about the state of the Digital Tools Box, and as far as I can tell, I don't have any zealot mods trying to bring the banhammer down on me.

And the, of course, there's my commentary on technomancers, which has been far from kind.

Did you use a rolled up Newspaper?
I would.

There was more in PMs he kept sending.

Ahhh... But does he have a Logical Argument based after him? If not, he's a Piker.

I'm sorry, a what?

The vaunted TJ Fallacy.

As explained by phlapjack77
TJ fallacy:
A specific problem in a game is not really a problem if your table just ignores the problem or makes up reasons why it's not a problem through roll-playing.

Ex: "Yeah, I told Joe that using a rocket launcher in SR4 was stupid because of the messed-up scatter rules, but he totally threw down a TJ fallacy and said his table has never had a problem with them."

I am so proud...

I think RHat was actually wondering what a "Piker" is.

For those not familiar, "piker" is a term used down in Oceania to refer a person who withdraws from a commitment, similar to calling someone a flake, or saying they're all bark and no bite; or all bluster and no substance; or perhaps even all hat and no cattle? You get the idea.

~Umi

All mouth and no trousers?

...I was going to go with "All glitter and no wood", but ok.

(And if any of you can guess what I'm referencing, +1 Edge to you!)

you're only allowed to use weapons that have a wireless bonus now, so rolled up newspapers are disallowed. you have to bludgeon them to death with a cyberdeck instead.

(the irony of bludgeoning someone to death with a cyberdeck over how badly they screwed up technomancers is fully intended)

Well, Okay Then, I stand corrected.

The difference between criticism on Dumpshock and the Tabletop forum is that while the actual makers of the game totally ignore both communities, at least you don't get banned/have your posts deleted/put on ignore for disagreeing with the mods here.

I know I'm not the only one hoping someday someone with money and a clue buys the IP from Topps and fixes all the problems but I won't keep my fingers crossed. Hardy is embarrassingly incompetent at running a game and it shows with every new release. I honestly can't believe the IP didn't get sold off when all the Catalyst Lorne Coleman drama happened but whatever.

Probably a profound lack of interest, to be honest. It's pretty grim when a company can't afford an editor. The current job market? They're literally falling all overthemselves looking for any sort of work.

Not in the tabletop section.

There is a certain mod who goes after anyone who doesn't think 5th edition is the best thing ever. I say this as someone who thinks 5th was a massive improvement over 4th. But this person goes after fans of 4th and 3rd edition alike in almost any post where a comparison is warranted.

Which is kind of awkward considering all the retro old school gamers for Shadowrun Returns who are fans of 1st through 3rd and keep getting run over by these people. You can have your favorite edition without having to challenge every nostalgic old-school gamer who hasn't even heard of your edition. It gets ridiculous at times and it doesn't help when one person with a moderator badge often leads the charge.

What about 4th edition's ignoble start was in any way better than the big seller that was the initial release of 3rd edition? 3rd edition was the second best selling RPG when it came out on the market. I'll give you that 3rd edition went down the tubes under Fanpro, and that 4th edition actually got better and found its way into stores under CGL.... but the releases being what they were I don't think there is any objective comparison.

I have to challenge this assertion on the basis that said mod would have certainly responded in that way to a number of my posts.

The same.

Either things are not as bad on that forum as it's claimed, I just haven't encountered this guy, or I just happen to stick to the side of the forums where they aren't present.

Then again, I don't exactly frame my arguments or criticisms with a vitriolic tone or use toxic language that would invite mods to go after me, so take it for what you will.

You don't need to, simply having a different opinion put me on one guys ignore list and I have talked to others who have the same story.

This is a guy who has 10k+ posts on a fantasy elf game forum.

Oh no! Being on someone's ignore list. The horror. That's reason enough to go off yourself, because some random person on the internet doesn't like you and so vehemently disagrees with your position that he'd rather not interact with you.

Anyway, its not like people don't get banned here. Frank Trollman, anyone? And I think he was actually a freelancer for a while.

Yeah, but Frank had/has..... Issues.

It's not that being on an ignore list is the problem, it's that the guy who did it is a representative of Catalyst who can not interact with other humans who have differing opinions.

Pretty sure the demo team guys AREN'T representatives of Catalyst when not actually running demo stuff.

OR maybe some of you are talking about shadowrun4.com/shadowruntabletop.com, and others about shadowrun.com (because I don't remember Catalyst's site having a "tabletop section").

FWIW, I criticize the editing over at the tabletop forums on a regular basis and point out the inherently-flawed premise of RAW because the AW part is so sloppy on an almost-daily basis and I've yet to experience any sort of blow back.

Looks like Chandras "ignore" habbit is getting famous

Any news on the print edition street date?

If it's in the next coupla weeks, it'll be eligible for Origins Game Fair SRM events.




-k

They were asking this on that other forum and Chandra said he didn't know of any date as yet so might not make it for that, unless they vote on e-versions?

They might be waiting on several more products to be out as e-releases before they announce street days,mike how they announced the street dates for Splintered State and Firing Line at once.

Might explain why, despite the Digital Tool Boxes being out for 2.5 months, and not a peep about their physical releases...

Or they could just be too broke to physically print.

I wouldn't bet against it.

Indeed... Me neither.

To be honest, I think that tablets make about the best damn tabletop gaming device ever. While I do love having a hardcopy as I'm an old goat, a fully bookmarked PDF is quite adequate when it comes right down to it.

..................

The fuck did that come from?

We're talking about a game company that managed to "misplace" a million dollars a while back. Where do you think it came from?

~Umi

And what, by all that's sacred, does THAT have to do with anything with printing?

I believe the point was that if money disappears there may not be enough to print a book.

I'll take that bet. Name your odds, and I'll ttell you how much you will lose.

When you can charge $25+ for a PDF why bother spending money to release a physical book? Not saying that's what they're doing, but it may make sense from a business standpoint to move away from physical books entirely (though I seriously doubt that is their plan).