SMDVogrin
Nov 3 2005, 05:11 PM
Question: If my starting Rigger buys a Pilot program (rating 4) to upgrade some of his drones, can he also use that program as an Agent on the Matrix? Or is the Agent/IC/Pilot listing for three separate program types with the same price?
The Reason I ask is because the listing is "Agent/IC/Pilot", and IC seems to be the exact same thing as Agent, so....
Would mean a very easy Hacker-in-a-Box for my Rigger.
hobgoblin
Nov 3 2005, 05:58 PM
from what i understand the pilot is more like the system of a comlink then a agent or ic. i have a feel that they cost the same as its a system(os) merged with agent code so that it performs the task of both.
hmm, i wonder, can i set up my home with a pilot equiped telecom setup so that my place can be given orders like a drone?
Vector
Nov 3 2005, 06:31 PM
I don't see why not.
hobgoblin
Nov 3 2005, 08:19 PM
just hope i never hear the phrase "sorry, i cant do that dave".
for one thing, my name isnt dave. for the other, that phrase creeps me out...
Demon_Bob
Nov 4 2005, 02:25 AM
QUOTE (morlock76) |
Making a rigger a much more viable profession as runner. I never liked the idea of investing VERY heavy into something external that could as well be stolen as was pretty much not replaceable ingame. Not the practice of a nice GM, but when making a char I pref to take a look at such an angle as well. |
Trouble is I have seen rigger players get overconfident in their Big Guns, then complain when security waits in a tactically advantagous position, and begins by gunning down the item of highest threat first. Same for Trolls.
Demon_Bob
Nov 4 2005, 03:17 AM
Was wondering if it was worth it for a decker to try to write progam upgrades during a campaign. If I remember right some of those intervals are in months.
How many time does a program type have to be purchased?
Can I buy Clearsight, Gunnery, ect. and and use it on all my drones?
If the signal of a device is 3 can I decide to reduce the signal strength to 0 for a short time because that is all I need at the moment, and it make overhearing the data stream harder?

Say I finally succeed at the +6 to hack someone's skillwires. (or happen to find secondary administrative commands in his employee file for all his cyberware, kept there as a security measureagainst the employee) Just what kind of negative modifiers could I cause him other than just turning off his cyberware?
A program flips a switch and the human goes to sleep.
hobgoblin
Nov 6 2005, 05:39 PM
from what i understand a program have to be cracked to be used on more then one "device" at a time.
(heh, it said problem before i edited it. i wonder where my head was when i wrote the original text as it obviously not focusing on the text being written...)
Eyeless Blond
Nov 6 2005, 07:39 PM
QUOTE (Demon_Bob) |
Was wondering if it was worth it for a decker to try to write progam upgrades during a campaign. If I remember right some of those intervals are in months. |
Indeed. Though the flavor text says that hackers write their own programs, the actual rules essentially say that, for all practical purposes, you can't. Writing your own OS takes Years; not something you're going to do during a normal campaign, unless your GM is uncommonly generous with downtime.
Just one more way the rules don't match the intent.
Valentinew
Nov 7 2005, 04:38 AM
So I've been making a Technomancer for our SR4 game starting soon, & submitted it to my GM. He sent back that it looked fine except I needed a smartgun link on my glasses. My thought is that techno's wouldn't need that because they can live in AR without the hook-up.
Am I correct? Or do I need an Image & Smartgun Link on my glasses?
SMDVogrin
Nov 7 2005, 05:10 AM
Yes, you'd need a Smartlink on your glasses. A Technomancer basically has a natural duplicate of a Commlink+Sim Module. A Commlink does not provide smartlink capability unless you have a Vision device with Smartlink.
Eyeless Blond
Nov 7 2005, 05:10 AM
Well, there's an argument for and against needing the smartgun link.
For: Your techno can "hear" the data being sent through the smartgun itself, but you can't understand it without the glasses interpreting it for you.
Againse: Technos appear to have an instincive "feel" for any and all protocols that transmit wirelessly; if this were not so then they wouldn't be able to access most Matrix-enabled devices, as most things will be using their own (often proprietary, see Microsoft's ActiveX) encodings and even protocols. Therefore technos must be able to instantly interpret and understand everything sent to them in any exotic data form instantly, as they have no organic storage memory to load a bunch of interpreters on like modern-era computers do.
A Smartlink is a very simple encoding to understand--surely it's no more difficult than trying to interpret a Flash program on-the-fly without an interpreter!
And an Image link would surely not be needed; if a techno can understand and immediately interpret all Matrix-based data in full VR mode then surely they can build up a "lesser" form in their own brains without help from an image link.
(NOTE): I happen to think that a technomancer interacting with the Matrix through a wireless organic transceiver is an inherently idiotic idea, so take the above with that slight ironic twist.
RunnerPaul
Nov 7 2005, 05:35 AM
QUOTE (Valentinew) |
So I've been making a Technomancer for our SR4 game starting soon, & submitted it to my GM. He sent back that it looked fine except I needed a smartgun link on my glasses. My thought is that techno's wouldn't need that because they can live in AR without the hook-up.
Am I correct? Or do I need an Image & Smartgun Link on my glasses? |
The smartlink is a specialized piece of hardware that among other things, generates a very specific form of AR Overlay that makes the gun feel like an extension of the user's own body. Because of the special nature of this overlay, and the fact that it's intended to be used in combat situations, dedicated electronics are needed to generate it.
This goes back to the eternal debate about what exactly the smartlink does, and why it's so much better than a laser sight, when the core of what they both do is put a dot in your field of view showing where the bullet will hit. There's the fact that smartguns calculate ballistic drop, but in previous editions, if you hooked up the smartgun to a set of smartgoggles, you'd still only get the same effect as a laser sight, so accounting for ballistic drop wasn't the answer by itself. This is why the explanation that the implant made the gun feel like a part of you came into play.
Now we come to SR4's time where a set of smartgoggles are as good as having the implant, and both are better than the laser sight. The only way I can account for it is that your smartgoggles have trodes that can feed the "gun as extension of the body" simsense into your brain. With 2050s tech, it wasn't possible to do that kind of thing over trodes, which is why to get the full effectiveness of it, you had to go the implant route. But by the 2070s, they've gotten a lot better at what they can pipe into your brain over trodes. It only makes sense, seeing as in the 2030s and 2040s, they had to dunk you into a sensory deprivation tank just to give you full VR.
So to sum up, unless your GM is letting anyone who has a commlink with sim module get smartgun bonuses, there's no reason for a technomancer to be able to either. And always remember, "Happiness is a warm gun." I think Hatchetman said that, when talking on the subject of smartlinks.
Vector
Nov 7 2005, 01:52 PM
I find it odd that according to the rules, Technomancers can use VR without any extra equipment but can't use AR at all without equipment. The technomancer in the book has no electronic equipment and somehow can still use the fake SIN they have...
Xeros
Nov 7 2005, 02:23 PM
technos can use AR, no problem. The problem is determining what you are doing with that AR. The way I see it, is a techno could see the smartgun's output in a "window" without the need of goggles, but that's of limited use since it's not integrated with the rest of your vision. The goggles overlay the results straight onto your field of vision, integrating it with your normal view of the world. You could skip the goggles, and still use it as a periscope, just looking through your node window, but to get the combat bonus, you need it integrated with your normal vision.
That's how I see it anyways. I also first made my techno without the goggles, but then I thought about how I would see the results, and realized that it might make sense for even a techno to have the goggles.
Valentinew
Nov 7 2005, 03:23 PM
I thought technos brains were able to translate AR (& VR) into a form her brain could understand...without any gear. She may not see things exactly like someone with an Imagelink up, but she probably had a close analogy.
I guess I don't understand why a smartlink would be different than any other wireless device. It seems to be implied that the smartlink is so completely different from any other kind of link that the techno would have no chance of using it effectively on her own, which I don't buy.
I'm wondering if the fact that no mods have chimed in here means maybe that's an ongoing discussion? Or are there articles/books that talk about this exact thing that I need to read?
Vector
Nov 7 2005, 03:39 PM
I thinik I'm planning to go a head on the assumption that Technomancers have something that functions like an image link. Almost all AR is intended to be overlayed on your vision. It would be silly for them to need equipment for something like that. Although, I suppose that would mean that they shouldn't need AR gloves or simillar things by the same argument.
I'd love to see an official ruling on this though.
RunnerPaul
Nov 7 2005, 06:38 PM
QUOTE (Valentinew) |
I guess I don't understand why a smartlink would be different than any other wireless device. It seems to be implied that the smartlink is so completely different from any other kind of link that the techno would have no chance of using it effectively on her own, which I don't buy. |
The book is very specific about what pieces of hardware a Technomancer's special brain gets to emulate: a Commlink with a sim module.
If you let mere mortals get smartlink effects if they have a commlink with sim module but no actual smartlink accessory or implant, then by all means, give that to your technomancers too.
While we're at it, why don't we just let anyone who has a commlink with sim module get free low light vision and vision magnification as long as they're running the Edit utility (or if they're a Technomancer with the equivilent complex form), after all, it's just zooming and cropping the image and upping the brightness; surely the Edit utility has those basic image manipulation features. Make all the accessories obsolete, and do it all in software!
Xeros
Nov 7 2005, 09:10 PM
I'd stand by the fact that a techno....or I think anyone with a commlink could see the smartgun image in a window, but using that would be like aiming a gun by looking at a tv screen. It can work, but you may be better relying on your own body's hand-eye coordination. The field of vision is a lot smaller, and the perspective is all wrong for your brain.
RunnerPaul
Nov 7 2005, 09:15 PM
I would say it'd have to be treated as a generic GM determined AR modifier per the "AR Modifiers" sidebar on p.208, and if the GM has any sense, they'd make sure it's a lesser modifier than what you'd get for using real smartlink hardware.
Valentinew
Nov 7 2005, 09:24 PM
QUOTE (RunnerPaul) |
While we're at it, .... |
I was just asking a question. I want to understand. I'm sorry if this has offended you in some way.
Vector
Nov 7 2005, 09:28 PM
It seems to me that you either have to go with the idea that Technomancers tend to only use VR (the book hints towards their strong preference towards VR) and so the lack of AR options without extra cyber or equipment is just part and parcel of being a Technomancer OR you have to rule that they also come with some basic cyber-like devices to percieve AR as well. The former being canon at the moment, the latter being what seems like more the spirit of Technomancers if not the letter of the existing rules.
QUOTE (SR4 pg 228) |
To technomancers, VR is “home”—most feel more comfortable here than navigating the meat world, even with augmented reality. |
Then again, maybe VR "only" (quotes because while they can access AR they cannot see, hear, or touch it without extra equipment) is the spirit of the rules.
Vector
Nov 7 2005, 09:32 PM
Edit: Nevermind. Oops.
RunnerPaul
Nov 7 2005, 09:38 PM
QUOTE (Vector) |
the lack of AR options without extra cyber or equipment is just part and parcel of being a Technomancer |
I strongly disagree. Technomancers have the organic equivalent of a commlink with sim module in their heads. (p.233)
Commlink with sim module is the "easiest and most common" way to access AR. (p.209, last paragraph under the heading "Augmented Reality")
Technomancers are just as capable as accessing AR as they are VR, with no extra hardware, acording to the letter and spirit of the rules.
NightRain
Nov 7 2005, 10:11 PM
QUOTE (Vector) |
OR you have to rule that they also come with some basic cyber-like devices to percieve AR as well. |
They do. It's called a SIM module
RunnerPaul
Nov 7 2005, 10:13 PM
QUOTE (NightRain) |
They do. It's called a SIM module |
And they get one free with their organic commlink.
Vector
Nov 8 2005, 01:29 PM
Yeah, I re-read that part and noticed it. I keep confusing exactly what a simmodule does and thinking that it only works for VR. I also keep confusing the smartgun link that is implanted (in you or in your glasses/goggles/whatever) with an imagelink rather than a specialized ballistics processor that
depends on an imagelink. Most of that realization was in my edited post above. Too much time spent poking at the smartgun components from SR3 and not enough reading the gear section of SR4.

But I appreaciate the clarification anyway.
hobgoblin
Nov 8 2005, 03:09 PM
just like the changes in magic from sr2 to sr3, this creates confusion as people try to use sr3 knowhow in a sr4 world.
Demon_Bob
Nov 14 2005, 01:26 AM
Not exactly sure on how hardware upgrades work.
If I take a comlink with a Response 4 Signal 5 and upgrade it to Response 5 Signal 5, does it cost me 250

; 4,000

; or 2,000

?
If I wish up upgrade my Firewall do I have to buy a new program or can I just patch in an upgrade for the difference in cost?
Valentinew
Nov 14 2005, 03:28 PM
I'm pretty sure the Response upgrade costs 4000
Not sure about the upgrade....
BlackHat
Nov 14 2005, 03:31 PM
QUOTE (Demon_Bob) |
If I take a comlink with a Response 4 Signal 5 and upgrade it to Response 5 Signal 5, does it cost me 250 ; 4,000 ; or 2,000 ? |
I'm not really sure on the rule either. My intuition tells me you could take the cost to upgrade some device to 5, and the cost to upgrade a device to 4, and take the difference between the two.
Otherwise, it'd be just as expensive to upgrade your R1S2 MetaLink as it would be to upgrade your R4S5 commlink... and that's just silly.
TonkaTuff
Nov 15 2005, 12:59 AM
I'm fairly certain it's the full listed cost - at least with hardware upgrades. It's like switching out the graphics card in your comp to the newest model. Most of the time you're shelling out the full price (minus mail-in rebates, I guess), not trading up.
There might be a more valid argument for software... if it's a completly legal, uncracked copy. It's just a download of extra or better code. But even then, most of the time your giant software corporations are gonna make you pay full price for the new version. And why not - it's more money for them. If you want it badly enough, you're gonna pay what they're asking. Or steal it, but no doubt the crackers are going to want their cut, too.
In any event, it's another instance of GM fiat. If they want to give you credit on the older bits to reduce the price of the new shinies, that's their decision.
Teulisch
Nov 15 2005, 02:03 AM
ugrading resonse is probably similar to upgrading the CPU, RAM, motherboard, and a card slot. It can get expensive fast. Plus, a lot of the cheap models have a lot of sub-standard parts.
I think the metalink, as the cheapest commlink, has a flimsy plastic case, and uses low-cost cheap parts. plastic screws. the kind of stuff that breaks beyond repair with one good solid smack. its probably small and lightweight, like a cheap cellphone.
The high-end commlinks, on the other hand, are going to have a sturdy case, possibly metal or some high-impact polymer. metal screws, good bateries that wont just die, and sturdy construction.
considering what upgrades cost, who would want the low-end box?
RunnerPaul
Nov 15 2005, 12:55 PM
QUOTE (Teulisch) |
considering what upgrades cost, who would want the low-end box? |
Someone who doesn't want to advertise the fact that they've got a expensive, top-of-the-line commlink?
BlackHat
Nov 15 2005, 01:21 PM
QUOTE (Teulisch) |
considering what upgrades cost, who would want the low-end box? |
Also, of the high-end commlink's pricetag.. .very little of it is the solid casing.
In real life, people buy custom cases for their computers all the time - and compared to the price of your monitor, or high end graphics card, its inexpensive.
I imagine that buying a metalink, upgrading it to "full power" and then slaping down

500 for a slick custom case would give you something just as durable as the top of the line stock commlinks. In SR3 you could even buy custom casings for your deck that had armor to protect the expensive insides. I don't see why that would have changed all that much (aside from there being no rules for it in the core book).
In any case, your upgraded commlink would be jsut as protected as a high-end stock-model, perform just as well, cost you less money, and depending on who's looking, you might even get the benifit RunnrePaul mentioned of them not being able to look at it and know what you've got on the inside.
The hardware argument is a good one. If I want to upgrade the CPU on my computer, I can't just buy an add-on, I have to replace it... and I won't get anything for the 3-year old one I have. However, that said, I don't see any reason why players won't all be rolling with (modded) MetaLinks instead of actually upgrading machinery that is decent to begin with. Because of that point, I would be tempted to rule you can "upgrade" that equipment even if it makes less sense to do so - at least until some better commlink customization rules come along.
After character creation is another story... but a response-5, signal-5 commlink should have the same "value" to a starting character whether it started as a MetaLink or as a Fairlight Caliban. There are minor differences based on the case, as people have said, but since hte rules don't support you ever accidentally breaking it, or anyone targetting it for an attack, there really is no advantage.
Thistle Burlapin
Nov 24 2005, 06:19 AM
Evening Folks,
Looking for some logic on this one, someone lend me an opionion or two...
From the read in order to run AR/VR you need a Comlink and Sim Module.
Sim Modules are available in Trode form
Simrigs are available in Trode form
Comlinks are available external
Does this mean that you can have a Matrix running "Decker" with no Essence cost? I'm sure I must be missing something here but I'm not sure what it might be.
Thanks
Feshy
Nov 24 2005, 06:40 AM
QUOTE (Thistle Burlapin) |
Evening Folks,
Looking for some logic on this one, someone lend me an opionion or two...
From the read in order to run AR/VR you need a Comlink and Sim Module.
Sim Modules are available in Trode form Simrigs are available in Trode form Comlinks are available external
Does this mean that you can have a Matrix running "Decker" with no Essence cost? I'm sure I must be missing something here but I'm not sure what it might be.
Thanks |
Yes. For clarity:
For AR, you need two things:
A Commlink, and an Image Link.
For VR, you need three things:
A Commlink
A Sim Module
A direct neural interface.
Commlinks are available as cyberwear, or external units.
Imagelinks are available as cyberwear (cybereyes) or external units (goggles, glasses, contacts, etc.)
Sim Modules are available as an addon to your Commlink (which means either internal or external)
Direct Neural interfaces are available with either a Datajack (cyberwear) or as Trodes (external)
So, you can do AR, or even full VR, with no essence loss at all.
RunnerPaul
Nov 24 2005, 12:54 PM
QUOTE (Feshy @ Nov 24 2005, 01:40 AM) |
Sim Modules are available as an addon to your Commlink (which means either internal or external) |
Note that if you have a sim module, and some way for it to output into the brain (Datajack, Trodes, etc) you can get AR overlay without having to have an external or implanted Image Link.
However, getting your AR Overlay via sim module leaves you open to simsense emotive-track spamming. While it's probably not complex to disable the emotive-track outputs of a sim module, that specific task is not covered anywhere in the rules, so it's up to the individual GM.
Also, all implanted cyberware commlinks come equipped with a sim module as part of the sticker price, and do not need any form of datajack or trodes, as it's wired directly to the brain during implanting.
Feshy
Nov 24 2005, 09:36 PM
QUOTE (RunnerPaul) |
QUOTE (Feshy @ Nov 24 2005, 01:40 AM) | Sim Modules are available as an addon to your Commlink (which means either internal or external) |
Note that if you have a sim module, and some way for it to output into the brain (Datajack, Trodes, etc) you can get AR overlay without having to have an external or implanted Image Link.
However, getting your AR Overlay via sim module leaves you open to simsense emotive-track spamming. While it's probably not complex to disable the emotive-track outputs of a sim module, that specific task is not covered anywhere in the rules, so it's up to the individual GM.
Also, all implanted cyberware commlinks come equipped with a sim module as part of the sticker price, and do not need any form of datajack or trodes, as it's wired directly to the brain during implanting.
|
Yes, I meant to include that if you have access to VR, the same equipment can give you AR. But the mashed potatoes where done (why yes, we *DO* have thanksgiving here at 2am. What of it?)
As for the other part... do implanted comlinks really come with a sim module? And "trodes" (or their equivalent?) The sim module I had always assumed that you needed the separate Sim Module Cyberwear. Having looked, I still think that is the case, though it *could* be a standalone module. The cyberware version references the Sim Module on page 318, the description of which sounds like a standalone module. The gear chart underneath that lists the prices, though, only lists it as an accessory.
I can't tell if that means you need to buy a "comlink with sim module accessory" as the cyberware comlink, or if you need to buy a cyber comlink AND a cyber sim module to get VR.
TonkaTuff
Nov 25 2005, 11:03 AM
QUOTE |
As for the other part... do implanted comlinks really come with a sim module? And "trodes" (or their equivalent?) The sim module I had always assumed that you needed the separate Sim Module Cyberwear. Having looked, I still think that is the case, though it *could* be a standalone module. The cyberware version references the Sim Module on page 318, the description of which sounds like a standalone module. The gear chart underneath that lists the prices, though, only lists it as an accessory. I can't tell if that means you need to buy a "comlink with sim module accessory" as the cyberware comlink, or if you need to buy a cyber comlink AND a cyber sim module to get VR. |
Not so sure if the headware commlink comes standard with a sim module already installed (thought I remembered seeing it, but going over my book, I can't find it). But having it shoved into your brain means that (more than likely) it's got a DNI connection - so no need for trodes or a datajack, unless you want non-wireless access to external devices, too. From the looks of things, you can either have the sim module built into the implanted comm, or get just a sim module itself installed into your brain, if you want. I'm assuming the latter option is there if you want the sim, but not a whole commlink stuck in there (though one would think there'd be an essence break for going with the partial)
The stand-alone sim module implant would useful for a number of reasons. You can turn it on or off without drawing attention by switching your commlink off or into stealth-mode. You can discretely slot your beetles w/o having them show up if someone scans your commlink (if you have a datajack). And it means you'll always have VR access, even if the device you've been forced to use at the moment might not have a module installed.
RunnerPaul
Nov 26 2005, 12:52 AM
QUOTE (Feshy) |
do implanted comlinks really come with a sim module? |
"Simrigs (both worn and implanted) and cranial commlinks also contain sim modules."
-- p.228, 2nd paragraph under the heading "Virtual Reality"
Which is the last place anyone would think to look for it, I would imagine.
Feshy
Nov 26 2005, 12:59 AM
QUOTE (RunnerPaul) |
QUOTE (Feshy @ Nov 24 2005, 04:36 PM) | do implanted comlinks really come with a sim module? |
"Simrigs (both worn and implanted) and cranial commlinks also contain sim modules." -- p.228, 2nd paragraph under the heading "Virtual Reality"
Which is the last place anyone would think to look for it, I would imagine.
|
Thanks!
I've noticed an awful lot of page-flipping required in this book. Rules seem to often not be where I would think to find them. This is a good example; I read the descriptions for implanted comlinks to see if they had Sim modules. Instead I needed to read the Virtual Reality overview. I don't know if it's the locations that don't quite make sense, or if it is my own . . . ah, shall we say. . . eclectic sense of "organization."
Anyone else having trouble with this?
Demon_Bob
Nov 26 2005, 01:09 AM
What does a Simrig contain that a sim module does not?
And if they are the same then why is the essence cost and price different?
Feshy
Nov 26 2005, 01:15 AM
QUOTE (Demon_Bob) |
What does a Simrig contain that a sim module does not? And if they are the same then why is the essence cost and price different? |
Simrig is for recording, sim module is for playback.
RunnerPaul
Nov 26 2005, 01:15 AM
The sim module is the thing that converts the digital data of a simsense stream into a form that's readable by the brain, when played back through trodes, or through the direct neural connection provided by an implant like a datajack.
The external simrig is an elaborate set of trodes that comes with a built in sim module for playback, but can also record the user's own sensory experience and convert it into a digital simsense datastream. The implanted simrig is the same playback & recording, but with direct neural connections instead of electrodes.
Seifer
Nov 28 2005, 04:15 AM
Here's a question I'm curious to know - the Implanted Commlink is headware, meaning that it's nestled right up there next to your brain. Now, the commlink itself is a wireless transmitter that's almost always on. So correct me if I'm wrong here, when you implant a commlink into your head, you will suddenly have a wireless antenna that's always on
right next to your brain.
Brain cancer, anyone? Jeez, and you thought cellphones were bad.
Eyeless Blond
Nov 28 2005, 04:28 AM
QUOTE (Seifer) |
Brain cancer, anyone? Jeez, and you thought cellphones were bad. |
The real problem is *all* cyberware is wireless-enabled by default now, and all of it is DNI, so you have potentially dozens of radio transmitters frying your brain all the time. And oh NO, people will LOOK AT YOU WEIRD if you decide you don't want brain cancer, and ask for all those transmitters to be disabled.
See, I've got my excuses all lined up.
RunnerPaul
Nov 28 2005, 05:12 AM
QUOTE (Seifer) |
Brain cancer, anyone? |
Wouldn't be the first time implants caused brain cancer. That's the in-game explanation for why Program Carriers never made it out of First Edition. Shame too, because "Decking Naked" was so fun to say.
So, does the same thing go for Technomancers?
Azralon
Nov 29 2005, 04:09 PM
There ya go, technomancy is due to a pandemic of a specialized form of quasi-Awakened Martian brain cancer.
RunnerPaul
Nov 30 2005, 03:21 AM
I was wondering when they'd get around to fleshing out that whole Mars plotline.
Danthrall
Dec 10 2005, 03:29 AM
I might have missed this info in the book, or missed the question on the board. If this is the case, I'm sorry.
How do you figure out vehicle or drone stats not listed in the chart on pg. 342? (i.e., Firewall and response. I'm assuming they all have a signal of 5, since on pg. 325 lists vehicle sensor packages as having such.) I realize the costs to upgrade them, but I don't know what their orriginal values are. Also, is there a printed way of upgrading sensors, or is that being held back until the Sourcebook?