Starting to walk is like SR3, you didn't start until your action, when you declared what you were doing.

I said walking did not even take an action, but needed to be declared, so you still have a pass with all your actions intact and unused when walking.

Now you're obtuseness is making me look up again what action declaring running uses, running requires a free action. While I am at it, sprinting (the use of a skill to increase running distance) takes a Simple Action.

With any of these movements a character can carry out an additional action they are alloted for the pass. (Do we need to go over again what actions may be taken in a pass?)

Running imposes a -2 dice pool modifier to any action except charging attacks and defending against attacks.

So by this I take it successes in Athletics skill then no longer augment movement as in the past.

Running is a skill that's folded into the Athletics Skill Group. "Hits" on the Running + Strength test increases your movement rate. I don't know how much simpler someone can make this. You can roll either your Athletics Skill Group (if you have it) or your Running skill. Note that they are mutually exclusive... you can have either one or the other, because if you break off the Running skill from the Athletics Skill Group, you divide the whole skill group into individual skills.

I expect that many of the "omissions" will be included in a later supplement.

So what is going to replace Headware Memory? This was an indespensable tool not just for Deckers (hackers) but anyone who needed to store data or other information in a more discrete manner. For example I have a CyberSnoop who basically has an entire audio/vid editing studio in her head. Key to this is her memory implant which can store over 2 hours of vid.

As stated, Headware Memory is obsolete. Somewhere earlier in this thread (or maybe another one), it was written that Storage Memory is assumed to be so advanced that you'll have more memory than you can ever use in your cybernetic devices, not the mention the ease of transferring data to a remote wireless storage location. So if you have cybereyes or a datajack, or simply a recording system, the onboard storage is always assumed to be more than enough. The GM can stop you before it gets ridiculous (no downloading the Library of Congress to your smartlinked Assault Rifle), but there ya go.

While they may have improved the Cerebral booster, the Math SPU would still be much less expensive. (in M&M the CB 2 was 110,000 base cost while the top line Math SPU was somewhere around 16,000 - 20,000)

Again I have a feeling it is not so much obsolete as it ill appear in the SR4 "version" of M&M.

Ahh...integration. Makes sense...saves essence.

Yoikes! That's like 18% of the SR3 cost. Man, I hope my local store gets the book in soon.

Lifestyle costs are still approximately the same. I think it's slightly different (Low is now 2,000 nuyen instead of 1,000 nuyen, while Squatter is 500 instead of 100), but comparable.

EDIT: Middle, High, and Luxury are identical to before. Street is pretty much the same.

Cyber/Bioware costs are reduced across the board, pretty much. A simple datajack is only 500 nuyen (but datajacks were always inexpensive). A cyberarm costs 15,000 nuyen (a HUGE reduction in cost). There are some that retain their old costs (Enhanced Articulation), but in general, most Bioware with Ratings have reduced costs (but higher availability). Wired Reflexes 1 is 11,000 nuyen, 2 is 32,000 nuyen.

Not sure what "justifies" the price drop, other than the tech getting better and game balance issues. Cyberware used to be the biggest character creation money sink, so much so that it made no sense for a runner to have such expensive cyber instead of retiring on that cash.

Maybe. I don't think i'd have a fixer pay more than 10% of list unless the team was really good and reliable at cleaning the vehicle before the handoff. That Westwind is likely going to have some choice gear protecting it, and usually not left unattended in an insecure location. The more consistantly available Americar fair, at maybe 2K to 3K a job isn't that particularly lucrative.

I submit that Grand Theft Auto: Seattle 2070 could be awesome.

In my game, the PCs won't work unless they're guaranteed a payoff of 50,000 apiece--minimum.

That is one thing I do like about 4th edition. I had 3rd edition characters that spent a few million nuyen on gear and equipment over the course of their careers. Dropping the costs makes it more plausible that people could afford 'ware, and that companies or the military would spend the money to implant it in their employees. The lower payments for runs also make it more plausible that corporations would use Shadowrunners as a resource.

Is there any tactical advantage in wielding two weapons instead of one then? Provided you have ambidexterity, I mean. If you split the pool and get shorter reach because you are using two short swords (say, reach 1) than your opponent who's wielding a no-dachi, then you don't get any more dice than the other guy - if fact, you get two attacks with half of your dice, if I got this right - but you still suffer from the reach.

Is there any advantage to the second attack? The other loses one die on his defense against the second one, I think. Is that it? If two opponents with equal skill face each other with the same reach but one wields two weapons, does it give him any kind of tactical advantage? Or will he just waste all of his more numerous attacks instead of getting fewer that actually have the chance to do some damage?

I like the SR3 mechanic because it reflected well the fact that when you parry an attack - or just get your opponent's weapon out of the way - with one of your weapons, then you create a potential opening for your other weapon to strike (which was represented by the half-you-skill dice bonus you got for your off-hand).

If you need twice the number of dice of your opponent - on top of ambidexterity - for two-weapon melee combat to be at all effective, then you might as well stick with one weapon and cut your opponent in half on your first attack.

If your weapon has a really high base DV, and you feel reasonable sure you can get at least 1 net hit?

Hence the reason nobody uses two weapons in real life. It's inefficient and likely to get you killed.

I beg to disagree. Just look at Arnis/Eskrima/Kali. These martial arts especially teach the use of 2 weapons in close range combat. And it works extremly well. You start with rattan sticks, but advanced pupils may train with knifes or short swords. The techniques are the same. It is quite effective if the opponent has only one weapon.

Wouldn't that then translate to treating using the two weapons as a single weapon that took a Specialized Melee Weapon?

So, what do you think of two-weapons melee rules in SR4? Do they work? If not, how would you fix them? I guess a specialization in two-weapons (say, two-short swords) would give an extra die on each attack. If two-weapon melee combat is only learnt in specific martial arts, then maybe it'd be best as a maneuver? Hmmm... Or as a specific bonus you get when you learn a particular MA anyways, like the +1 to resist knockdown/knockback from Kung Fu strikes. Yeah, that seems better than a maneuver. Too bad we won't see any of that until much later, if at all. I'd have absolutely loved to have MA in the BBB. Oh! Well...

A completely separate skill, you mean? Like "two-blades", "two-clubs", etc.?

Effectively - yes. At least in the three mentioned MAs the movements would suggest this.

Don't know yet. I need the book first, and then i will playtest it myself. But your suggestion might work fine.

The problem I see with that is that you could just take a specialization in any melee weapon and it would give you the tw-dice bonus. It wouldn't give anything specifically for using two melee weapons at the same time. I guess I might convert martial arts really soon. Or try anyways... Once we all have the book, I'm pretty sure we'll be able to figure out something that works.

To be more precise:

Blades (Katana) 6 ( 8 )

Blades (Twinned) 6 ( 8 )

There's no advantage to using two weapons. The mechanics are exactly the same if you make it only one attack.

EDIT: ( 8 ), not (

Oh! Ok. Sorry. I thought splitting dice applied to both melee and ranged combat, but I had asked about melee and ranged combat at the same time, so I probably just misinterpreted Bull's words.

I guess it only makes special ammunition that much more relevant.

I'm not sure I get the logic behind making the fourth shot tougher to dogde than the first. Obviously, the more rounds you shoot, the more likely one of them will hit, but you already get more attack tests for that. Autofire is something else as it is one test and possibly even more rounds.

I'm not too sure what the difference is between a wide burst and a long wide burst. (Burst-fire vs full autofire?) But I guess it should be looked at when considering defense penalties for shots after the first.

Personally, I'd be tempted to link the defense penalty more to the number of people shooting at you than to the number of semi-auto shots [a single guy shoots at you. EDITED FOR CLARITY] I mean: If you got out of the way for the first shot, why should you be more exposed for the third or fourth? Inertia, maybe? If you dodge to the left, the shooter can re-adjust and hit you more easily? Still, I think the penalty is more appropriate when there are many people shooting at you. It's one thing to get out of one guy's line of fire, but it's something else getting out of the line of fire of tens guys shooting at you simultaneously. Am I making any sense?