Help - Search - Members - Calendar
Full Version: 5E Wish List
Dumpshock Forums > Discussion > Shadowrun
Pages: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20
Tanegar
QUOTE (Umidori @ Jan 6 2013, 08:44 PM) *
I definitely like the idea of specialized wares that are ONLY available as Beta or Delta. Things that are the cutting edge, that take things up a new level of power, but that have to be specially built into the person using them, at great cost and difficulty.

~Umi

+1
NiL_FisK_Urd
There is one already, the CCU for Cyborgs is considered Deltaware.
Umidori
Aren't player characters normally forbidden from being cyborgs, much like Twisted Mages? And even if they weren't, there's still the problem of cyborgs having crippling mental health issues and insanely short life spans.

Now if Ghost In The Shell style cyborgs were possible? Maybe it'd be something to even consider aiming for. As it is, there's very little real reason to want to play a cyborg. First, convince your GM to let you play one, despite the books telling the GM outright that it's a bad idea. Then, cope with the high costs and availabilities. Then, cope with the psychological negative qualities as well as the negative social repurcussions of being a jarhead. Then receive expensive and hard to acquire weekly maintenance to keep you from going to pieces. Oh, and also make a monthly Sanity test to see if you get even more negative qualities.

Then die.

Unless you're building a suicidal timebomb for a one-shot kinda deal, I don't see the appeal, especially when a non-cyborg character with the Borrowed Time quality will give you greater bang for your buck.

~Umi
_Pax._
Honestly, you'd do better to build a Pilot-origin Metasapient AI than a cyborg, IMO.
NiL_FisK_Urd
A Pilot-origin Metasapient AI that seized a cyborg and killed the brain inside - or a cyberbrain gone e-ghost inside his cyborg.
Umidori
That... that actually works.

That negates the mental health issues, the maintenance requirements, the sanity checks, the short lifespan, and to some degree the GM allowance. You'll still have to cope with the costs and availabilities of the cyborg drone body, as well as social modifiers for your not-quite-human appearance, but it's a much better balance of costs and benefits, I feel. Plus, now you're actually a Ghost in a Shell. Win-Win.

~Umi
Fatum
Or if you want to play a cyborg you could just use the fan supplement written for that.
Juuuust saying. nyahnyah.gif
Umidori
This is the very first I've ever even heard of such a thing. And you suggest this fan supplement, but then fail to provide a link or even a useable google search term. So uhh... yeah.

~Umi
bannockburn
or you could click the link in his sig wink.gif
Umidori
If he said "my" fan supplement, maybe I would have thought to. Otherwise, why the fuzz would I bother with his signature link?

As it stands "the fan supplement" suggests there's some well known semi-official work that I should be aware of, rather than some obscure homebrew from someone who I can't tell from Adam. Please stop treating me like I'm an idiot for not being in the know about his personal house rules collections.

~Umi
bannockburn
Please stop exploding?
In no way did I mean to question your intelligence. I know that a lighthearted tone does not come across easily via the internet, that's why I've put up a smiley. Thanks, and have a nice evening.
Kyrel
Hmm...Off the top of my head as a wishlist for changes to 5th ed., I think I'd like the following:

Easier and more accessible rules for hacking, and a better description of how hacking and drone control actually functions in the game.
Going into and out of full VR taking a full minute each way, or causing severe disorientation (i.e. -6 dice pool on all actions until the brain and senses realign). Goal being to keep the players in the same world.
Change to the rules for breaking encryption. Basically stating that you can't break an encryption with a higher rating than the program you are using to decrypt it with.
Longer times to break encryption. I.e. a threshold equal to Encryption Rating^2.
Complete redo of Ritual magic so that it becomes useful and not inferior to using a high force spirit with the spell you want to cast at the target.
Changes to some of the essence costs for purely cosmetical stuff.
Higher Drain cost for Stun spells.
Bonus dice to defend against magic for people with lower essence. (If it's harder to heal them, why not harm them as well?)

Probably a few more things, but these are what I can think of just now.


Tymeaus Jalynsfein
QUOTE (Kyrel @ Jan 8 2013, 03:10 PM) *
Hmm...Off the top of my head as a wishlist for changes to 5th ed., I think I'd like the following:

Change to the rules for breaking encryption. Basically stating that you can't break an encryption with a higher rating than the program you are using to decrypt it with.
Longer times to break encryption. I.e. a threshold equal to Encryption Rating^2.
Complete redo of Ritual magic so that it becomes useful and not inferior to using a high force spirit with the spell you want to cast at the target.


Ummmmm...
Decryption is already a Threshold of Encryption Rating x2 with a 1 Combat TURN (not pass) Interval.
Also, Ritual Magic is a LOT more useful than a Spirit casting a Spell already. Also, the Spirit is not likely to be able to trace a target using Search halfway across the world before your Ritual spell takes effect, since your threshold for locating the target adds the number of Kilometers away the target is. At a range of several thousands of Kilometers, good luck on that one. smile.gif
Draco18s
QUOTE (Kyrel @ Jan 8 2013, 05:10 PM) *
Bonus dice to defend against magic for people with lower essence. (If it's harder to heal them, why not harm them as well?)


Actually, it makes perfect sense already: you don't have to work as hard to kill flesh when half of it is dead already.
Tymeaus Jalynsfein
QUOTE (Draco18s @ Jan 8 2013, 03:31 PM) *
Actually, it makes perfect sense already: you don't have to work as hard to kill flesh when half of it is dead already.


Indeed.... smile.gif
Umidori
That doesn't make sense. Magically speaking, healing someone is no harder than harming them. You're using mana to effect a change in their physical form. If 'ware gets in the way of using mana to rebuild flesh, it should also get in the way of using mana to damage or destroy it.

~Umi
Tymeaus Jalynsfein
QUOTE (Umidori @ Jan 8 2013, 03:44 PM) *
That doesn't make sense. Magically speaking, healing someone is no harder than harming them. You're using mana to effect a change in their physical form. If 'ware gets in the way of using mana to rebuild flesh, it should also get in the way of using mana to damage or destroy it.

~Umi


It has always been easier to destroy than to repair. Makes perfect sense to me. *shrug*
Lionhearted
Ware can make you quite resistant to magic... if you get too much enough of it.
All4BigGuns
Seems to me that that's just another case where the ones who primarily play Awakened want Augmented nerfed to oblivion. That said, you see the other side always wanting Awakened nerfed to oblivion too, generally on that side they use things like accusing people of playing "MagicRun" for not liking something that nerfs Awakened.
Nath
QUOTE (Umidori @ Jan 8 2013, 11:44 PM) *
That doesn't make sense. Magically speaking, healing someone is no harder than harming them. You're using mana to effect a change in their physical form. If 'ware gets in the way of using mana to rebuild flesh, it should also get in the way of using mana to damage or destroy it.
That's when the second law of thermodynamics get some air-time. It's always easier to go to a random disorganized state than to return to a given organized state. Magical healing of a lung requires to rebuild a complex tree of bronchioles, large enough for air to circulate and thin enough for oxygen to pass into the bloodstream. Magical tearing of a lung is always going to be simple in comparison.

So actually, if it had to make sense, harming should always be easier than healing, before even factoring Essence in. Then, the magical healing of any organs connected to highly artificial microelectronic components is going to be even harder.

I nonetheless considered giving additional dice to resist spell equal the missing Essence, but that was only for game balance considerations.
Stahlseele
QUOTE
That's when the second law of thermodynamics get some air-time.

That went out of the window once magic was introduced.
ShadowDragon8685
QUOTE (Kyrel @ Jan 8 2013, 05:10 PM) *
Hmm...Off the top of my head as a wishlist for changes to 5th ed., I think I'd like the following:

(1) Easier and more accessible rules for hacking, and a better description of how hacking and drone control actually functions in the game.
(2) Going into and out of full VR taking a full minute each way, or causing severe disorientation (i.e. -6 dice pool on all actions until the brain and senses realign). Goal being to keep the players in the same world.
(3) Change to the rules for breaking encryption. Basically stating that you can't break an encryption with a higher rating than the program you are using to decrypt it with.
(4) Longer times to break encryption. I.e. a threshold equal to Encryption Rating^2.
(5) Complete redo of Ritual magic so that it becomes useful and not inferior to using a high force spirit with the spell you want to cast at the target.
(6) Changes to some of the essence costs for purely cosmetical stuff.
(7) Higher Drain cost for Stun spells.
(cool.gif Bonus dice to defend against magic for people with lower essence. (If it's harder to heal them, why not harm them as well?)

Probably a few more things, but these are what I can think of just now.


1: Yeah, this would work.
2: Dear sweet demon fuck in hell, no! No, no, no! Not only no because OMGWTF this is terrible for the game, but no because it makes absolutely retardedly no sense for technology which worked perfectly well in the past to suddenly stop working that well in the future.
3: Errr, how about no, because suddenly all a corp has to do to have their encryption be basically unbreakable for a chargen hacker who isn't a TM is to just have a server with a rating 7 Encryption program.
4: How about no, unless you're talking about initiative passes? That just makes the game un-fun.
6: Agreed. Preferably an Essence cost of 0.00.
7: It should probably be equal to the drain for lethal mana spells.
8: I'll agree, but only for mana spells and healing spells. Physical damage spells do their damage by setting you on fire or crushing you with force or something, that doesn't give a damn about how whole your soul is. It should be exactly as hard to attach a positive spell to someone with low Essence as to attach a negative one to them.
Nath
QUOTE (Stahlseele @ Jan 9 2013, 03:33 AM) *
That went out of the window once magic was introduced.
Only because magic doesn't try to make sense. Which was my point, even if
disgressed a bit.
DuckEggBlue Omega
Having wrapped up an SR3 campaign recently due to people moving away, I thought I would try SR4a+2050 since the more straightforward core mechanics of 4th would make it easier to get new players. That's now on hold pending 5th, but what I'd like is some rules in the book about running a 2050 game (assuming it's not compatible with 2050). Not heaps, maybe just a short chapter on fluff, feel and gear/magic/ware limitations.
Dolanar
for what its worth, the problem for healing always seemed more of a Mana inhibition problem, the Cyber & the "unnatural" aspects in the body made it more difficult to allow the positive effects to work.
ShadowDragon8685
QUOTE (Dolanar @ Jan 9 2013, 05:33 AM) *
for what its worth, the problem for healing always seemed more of a Mana inhibition problem, the Cyber & the "unnatural" aspects in the body made it more difficult to allow the positive effects to work.


It's always been nothing but a blatant "balance" hack, a way of saying "screw you, no magical friends for you" to those with augs.

Which, really, if you're gonna have it be that way, fine, just make it consistant. Make it harder to attach negative mana and healing effects, too. If the soul is that hard to find because of all the augs, it should be hard to find for negative effects, too.
_Pax._
QUOTE (Kyrel @ Jan 8 2013, 05:10 PM) *
Going into and out of full VR taking a full minute each way, or causing severe disorientation (i.e. -6 dice pool on all actions until the brain and senses realign). Goal being to keep the players in the same world.

... so you LIKED it when the Rigger was the "I stay in my hyper-armored Van of Doom, 24/7/52" ...?

NO, thank you very much.

Draco18s
QUOTE (ShadowDragon8685 @ Jan 9 2013, 05:35 AM) *
If the soul is that hard to find because of all the augs, it should be hard to find for negative effects, too.


On the other hand, if the soul isn't very well attached, it's easy to shove free....
Fatum
Away from books now, but aren't all health spells harder to cast on low-essence targets, both positive and negative?
UmaroVI
QUOTE (Fatum @ Jan 9 2013, 10:05 AM) *
Away from books now, but aren't all health spells harder to cast on low-essence targets, both positive and negative?

No. Only Heal.
nezumi
I do like the color of magic and cyber being somehow opposed. However, 'no healing' is a pretty heavy penalty for the cybered guy. My inclination would be to shift the penalty to something less damaging, such as time to cast or requiring a spell matrix or somesuch.

Alternatively, you could make cyber reduce the impact of ALL aura-affecting magics, but that might nerf magic to a large degree.

Tymeaus Jalynsfein
QUOTE (nezumi @ Jan 9 2013, 09:14 AM) *
I do like the color of magic and cyber being somehow opposed. However, 'no healing' is a pretty heavy penalty for the cybered guy. My inclination would be to shift the penalty to something less damaging, such as time to cast or requiring a spell matrix or somesuch.

Alternatively, you could make cyber reduce the impact of ALL aura-affecting magics, but that might nerf magic to a large degree.


I don't think it would nerf it all that much, since it is likely to be a dice penalty if done similarly to how Heal Works.
Lionhearted
QUOTE (DuckEggBlue Omega @ Jan 9 2013, 08:49 AM) *
but what I'd like is some rules in the book about running a 2050 game (assuming it's not compatible with 2050). Not heaps, maybe just a short chapter on fluff, feel and gear/magic/ware limitations.

I wouldn't want this in the core book, as a file on converting characters for the 2050's sure, but in core? No.
For two reasons.
First it might confuse newer players on when and where the game is set, it makes the product feel more scatter brained.
Secondly, the same reason I don't want "before expansion XYZ" servers in MMOs. The timeline should continue moving forward and tell new stories, without the creators feeling obliged to please the crowd prefering the older stuff.
With tabletop RPGs this is even more valid as the old stuff is still there as it was just in the days (while MMOs suffer from power creep and having higher level players around, making the experience "not the same")
If you hate the rules you just use another ruleset and keep the fluff. Like when I decided I wanted to run bug city and did so in 4th.

QUOTE
Spell matrix

We're in Earthdawn now?
Fatum
QUOTE (Lionhearted @ Jan 9 2013, 09:37 PM) *
I wouldn't want this in the core book, as a file on converting characters for the 2050's sure, but in core? No.
That one's solved with using consistent rules for any timeline, and production dates for gear. Well, maybe half a chapterette on structured networks and grounding.
Sure, that Rating 6 custom commlink is becoming an Excalibur, but mechanically it's the same. BLAM.

QUOTE (Lionhearted @ Jan 9 2013, 09:37 PM) *
We're in Earthdawn now?
Well we have matrix spells already...
DuckEggBlue Omega
QUOTE (Lionhearted @ Jan 10 2013, 04:07 AM) *
If you hate the rules you just use another ruleset and keep the fluff. Like when I decided I wanted to run bug city and did so in 4th.

But that sounds like work and I'm sooo lazy. Otherwise you'd have a valid and well presented point.
Bigity
QUOTE (Fatum @ Jan 9 2013, 12:14 PM) *
Well we have matrix spells already...



The second windlings show up, I'm outta here! Little bastards
Stahlseele
QUOTE (Bigity @ Jan 9 2013, 08:08 PM) *
The second windlings show up, I'm outta here! Little bastards

so . . what's a pixie?
Tymeaus Jalynsfein
QUOTE (Stahlseele @ Jan 9 2013, 12:11 PM) *
so . . what's a pixie?


Heh... Pretty sure they are Windlings for Shadowrun. smile.gif
*watches as Bigity runs away in horror*
CanRay
QUOTE (Bigity @ Jan 9 2013, 03:08 PM) *
The second windlings show up, I'm outta here! Little bastards
QUOTE (Stahlseele @ Jan 9 2013, 03:11 PM) *
so . . what's a pixie?
QUOTE (Tymeaus Jalynsfein @ Jan 9 2013, 03:13 PM) *
Heh... Pretty sure they are Windlings for Shadowrun. smile.gif
*watches as Bigity runs away in horror*
And they wear boots!
Stahlseele
QUOTE (CanRay @ Jan 9 2013, 08:30 PM) *

nice pci, something my girlfriend would like, but it needs something to give a size relation to really make it work in this context i am afraid.
i'm thinking something like Inky from the Realm of Atland Webcomic.
Lionhearted
Why is this thing so iffy with images -.-
Stahlseele
QUOTE (Lionhearted @ Jan 9 2013, 08:38 PM) *
Why is this thing so iffy with images -.-

because embedding images has been disabled on dumpshock for good reason.
Draco18s
QUOTE (Stahlseele @ Jan 9 2013, 02:39 PM) *
because embedding images has been disabled on dumpshock for good reason.


Except when they randomly work for some inexplicable reason.
Lionhearted
No I was refering to my DS it refuses to load image files over certain resolutions. Mostly because it loads them in the cameras for whatever reason
Stahlseele
QUOTE (Draco18s @ Jan 9 2013, 08:40 PM) *
Except when they randomly work for some inexplicable reason.

it doesn't work anymore, it worked some months ago for a week or two.
then i posted one and it was disabled again.
QUOTE (Lionhearted @ Jan 9 2013, 08:41 PM) *
No I was refering to my DS it refuses to load image links over certain resolutions.

ah, right, i forget you're a bit limited right now.
Halinn
When discussing pictsies, I really prefer the Nac Mac Feegle.
Nae king! Nae quin! Nae laird! Nae master! We willnae be fooled again!
Stahlseele
QUOTE (Halinn @ Jan 9 2013, 08:56 PM) *
When discussing pictsies, I really prefer the Nac Mac Feegle.
Nae king! Nae quin! Nae laird! Nae master! We willnae be fooled again!

*nods*
those are awesome.
Lionhearted
Aye, ye must watch yerself with them wee bastards, buggers will chib ye and take ye heed straight of, every shug and his ma canne tru that.
Glaswegian faeries really?
Apparently scots is recognised as it's own language upping my total language count to 3½ biggrin.gif
Do you speak scots?
_Pax._
O_o

Wow.

That's ... it's just ....

Wow.

...

...

That is SO going to be a useful resource, for writing proper Scots dialogue in play-by-post games .... biggrin.gif
nezumi
QUOTE (Stahlseele @ Jan 9 2013, 02:43 PM) *
then i posted one and it was disabled again.


So YOU are why we can't have nice things! >(

I don't even want to know what you posted.
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.
Dumpshock Forums © 2001-2012