The term for it is synaesthesia, and if I knew some reliable legal way to expirence it, I would happily give it a go just for the whoa.

Sadly, it seems to be a random side effect of illegal drugs I've barely even heard of or exotic diseases that generally ruin your life in a not-so-fun way.

And if it weren't for all the addicts in the gang I'd suggest we didn't need more rules that whipstich suggests. You plug in, tune out, and do it at least as often as your addiction demands (at least. I've never heard of an addict that could go a week between regular fixes. A week without seeing pink elephants, sure, but just for his fix? Daily, at least... )

Really, for SIM Porn and Trips and Dreams, you really don't need rules, just IC guidelines... if that. Mood chips you can wear walking around, so maybe they need something (roll Will to go against the specific mood or something idiot simple like that) and P-Fixes... well, I'm inclined to think low level possession rules are sounding pretty keen actually. As long as you don't let the chip climb above a force two or three it shouldn't be too bad....

I shudder at the thought.

We'd be willing to consider another player. However the "hand holding" that has been going on in this thread to this date is drawing to a close. Really almost any answer to chargen questions can be found in this thread or the original recruiting thread. Specific questions of course will be answered, usually best done by PM'ing the GM or Me or Slipshade.

What we'll need from you is: a couple of paragraphs on the concept the more detail the better. Once we get a better feel for your character concept and idea of their background we'll be able to offer you provisional approval and allow you on the wiki to build your character and complete the various pages before review (Stats, Gear, Background, Takes).

Be advised you are going to have to impress us with the concept and backstory because there are a couple of red flags to the character
1) the age. It really is going to have to go up to at least 13 (late middle school to high school aged characters)
2) the whole Tir Nobility thing has got to be seriously explained as to how he ends up in the Barrens. Plus ALL ties are going to have to be severed to the Tir before and during his run in the Barrens if you REALLY are married to the concept.
3) we're not recruiting for ANY magical characters right now, just a heads up since I know you didn't mention it, but just wanted to be sure that we're all clear

Anybody else seen the story for Dallas where the 12 year old was working as a stripper? Because of the way the local laws are written they can't shut down the club for it either. Also, same city, different club, 13 year old prostitutes, but yeah I understand the reasoning for at least 13 years old, since I've been working on Twiggs, came up with another concept for a younger character, hopefully won't have to use it though, that's why Twiggs has starting Edge of 3, hopefully he's a survivor.

[edit]meh[/edit]

So, does anyone else like the idea of giving BTLs actual benefits and drawbacks like other drugs? I think it would make the production side a lot more fun too.

I'm not saying that there aren't 10 year old runaways in the Barrens, or in bunraku parlors, or in the kiddie porn brothel in the 'Gate. What I AM saying however is that in this gang Eyeless is kinda setting the low bar for the age game with a 14 year old. I have a little problem seeing older teenagers/young 20-somethings wanting to play "babysitter" for a 10 year old Unless said 10 year old was some kind of impressive wiz-kid (literally) or brought something absolutely needed to the table, what would be the purpose of keeping another mouth to feed around... save for a nice shield when the bullets start flying I mean when was the last time you wanted to hang out with your much younger sibling?

Keep in mind the above is more from a personal standpoint than a GM'esque standpoint, but I can tell you the age thing caught EVERYONE's eye when we discussed it

I do like the idea of reasonable benefits and drawbacks to them beyond the 'escapist' or 'puppet' aspects of them. Especially since the books to talk about how BTL's are replacing the street drugs for a "quick fix"...

Honestly for P-Fixes I think the downside is that they suffer at least Disorientation (p. 245 BBB) for a certain amount of time post use dependent on how long the chip had been in play as they come back to their senses and back to their real selves.

I'm up to my eyeballs in getting stuff together for you guys right now and prepping a new character of my own on the sidelines so I don't honestly have more than that right now... but it was the first thing that popped into my head as the discussion started...

Jaid - This is not a rules discussion thread. This is a thread for the purpose of recruiting players interested in playing a specific game. You have already established you are not interested in playing this game. Therefore, please refrain from commenting on whatever we do or do not do because it no longer concerns you.

If you are interested in discussing the issue in more depth, by all means start up a thread in the Shadowrun forum. Regardless, please do not continue to clutter up our thread with your opinions, which frankly are irrelevant, given your lack of participation in the game in which we plan on using these rules. Thank you.

Eyeless - I actually really like the idea of giving BTLs concrete benefits and drawbacks like other drugs. It makes their usage more material to the game as a whole. I would like the proposed BTL rules to move forward under that premise. Note there doesn't necessarily have to be benefits; some of the drugs (IIRC) have only drawbacks, and their 'benefits' are primarily fluff, in describing a feel-good or high.

I don't want to get into another extended debate here, so I'll say this as my last response here. Primarily the reason to suppose is because of how coding your own programs has worked in the past, I realize that SR4 is different, but some things were just better developed in the past.
It doesn't make much sense from a game balance perspective for your Hacker who is running his tweaked out comlink for max effect, that cost him over 25,000 to build, to jump on to a 5,000 tortoise (kit) to crank out his programs, especially when he could be in VR getting a +2 to his actions for running hot sim.
In the BBB (SR4), it is not mentioned under the Software skills description that the proper tools are needed, unlike most other technical skills, which specify so, this suggest that you do your software coding directly onto your comlink. It also mentions that specialized tools or unusual parts may need to be acquired separately. (ie. The Specialized Edit Program) As always you are free to do as you wish, but I don't see you getting away with paying 5,000 to get a programing suit that let's you start cranking out rating 6 programs that you could sell to hackers for large loot, let alone let you start mass manufacturing BTLs with it.



I don't like this idea, I think if people start abusing their neg qualities, then IC repercussions should be applied, similar to what happens with ignoring social skills, but I don't like adding game effects to BTLs, though I have no real issue with people suffering from Disorientation after un-plugging, but that's just me.

<EDIT> I wrote this post before realizing that WR had already weighed in on the subject, but you got my two worth anyway, and I'll still be glad to contribute to the process, including coming up with benifits/drawbacks on BTLs.

I don't view it as abusing negative qualities; drugs have benefits and drawbacks, but the real negative of the quality is the Addiction.

So I view BTLs as being a similar circumstance, where there would be potential benefits/drawbacks, but ultimately they don't really matter because your real problem (and true source of your nearly inevitable downfall) is the Addiction to using them that will eventually destroy you.

Sigh.

As requested, Maus is just a little less impressive on first meeting, but he's a slightly bigger badass in combat.

Sigh.

Oh, BTLs... yeah... um... nah, I got nothin'.

Heh, though not as quickly as in SR3; at least here you have a hope of getting clean. In SR3 your first smoke pretty much doomed you within a month or two.

WR's note that we're cluttering the recruitment thread is very apt, and really applies to more than just Jaid. Adding all of these rules discussions is causing us to ignore new players, trying to get in on the action. We need to move the rules discussions over to another thread...

Specifically this thread: Gutter Rules Discussions

Also, in response to a PM discussion, I've also started another thread that some of you fellow gutter trash ought to be interested in.

Eyeless - Thanks for creating those discussion threads. I know we (WR1, Vegas and I will) will not be able to keep track of those threads and everything else, so I would suggest that when you have a concrete set of rules that you all feel are good, you PM WR1 with them.

Same probably goes for the Brickhouse Boys.

Thanks again. Now back to the task at hand....Character Development!

Hm. I'm calling my Doberman "Red", my primary commlink "Shadow", and my backup commlink "Buster."

What would be a good dog name for a GIANT WHEEL?

Duh... ROVER!

Oh, duh!

Hm, but now I'm tempted to stat up a mechanized pogostick so I have a good candidate for "Tigger".

Oh god... you have to do that in game... scavenge the pieces/parts and put it together while holding a conversation with a toaster or microwave

Just out of curiousity: any idea when Drip and the other new guys will populate on the wiki? The takes page? I ask because I noticed the change to add Alex to the template, but otherwise have no visibility on him. Should I be prodding... who is it? Eyeless? to go through the steps to get Drip on the wiki? I mean, as a fellow Brickhouser...

Given that I'm having to correct more typos than not, I really need to see to this internet is more important than sleep addiction I've got going on...

Spike

You guys can add Drip to your takes pages on your own too.. I can't ALWAYS get EVERY new character added to everyone elses takes pages each and every time. Right now I've already added a number of new characters (nearly 7) to 13 existing sheets and updating the new guys with the newer guys that have come afterwards.

It's completely possible that I miss a sheet every now and then, I'm human not a machine or an AI

I may get around to adding them to people's takes pages, but it's a big task when there are a lot to add.. so if you beat me to it, so be it. I can always format the take to match the others later, but it shouldn't be too hard for you guys to figure out. if you can't do the linking, I can always do that.

OK. I couldn't sleep tonight (as evidenced by the fact that I'm still logged in and posting) so I added all the new potential PC's to people's takes pages. I HOPE I got everyone, but I'm not making any promises right now. I'm a little loopy but still can't seem to fall asleep.

you are talking to someone who managed to wipe out their own takes page with a single mouseclick... but I'll see what I can do...

Okay, mechanics side of Drip (Main/Gear) are complete. Still working on the Background and Takes, as these will depend on what the lot of us Brickhousers end up with for our feeder gang, but I don't anticipate anything already posted to change.

And yes, I did in fact name all of my major electronics, with dog names. I found a good site for them, so I fully intend to name every major appliance and vehicle in the ganger HQ at some point.

as long as a page gets *saved* we can revert it back. I can't do anything if you do a bunch of work but don't save and it goes bye bye into the digital ether

Ok, here's the bit of stat I would give to BTL.


And this is stat of BTL, with advantage and disadvantage.


Comments?

First comment: take it to the rules discussion. This is the recruitment thread.

That's why we made the rules thread; we were getting too many different conversations going in this thread, and we kinda lost one of the people who wanted to join.

Uh.. quick question... where is rules thread?

Ikim - Go back one page and you will find it. Your search-fu is weak.

Whipstitch, Dantic, Spike - Congratulations, you three are approved for DITG! I will include your PCs' intros in my Event 3 post, which I'm working on now. Welcome aboard and I'm looking forward to GMing for you guys!

Dantic - You didn't answer question 20, but Vegas and Slipshade let you through, so I'm assuming you already talked to them about this. I'll expect this to be answered after you actually join the October Ravens.

Glee.

Oh, I didn't put in any info for starting cash other than it's coming off the low lifestyle table. How do you guys prefer handling rolls? Should I roll it myself from a particular online roller, do you guys do it or do we work via the honor system?

Either one is fine.

Figures. I remembered where I'd found rolling guidelines (under combat) about a minute after I posted. Darn DS and the no deleting posts.

Arrgh, so much for mechanics being complete. I just found a fundamental flaw in my character's design that I need to correct, but it rather cuts to the core so it's going to take a little while. Um, will have things wrapped up in 24 hrs, probably.

Sorry for being so anal about Drip; I'm still getting used to the SR4 matrix/rigging rules, and I want to keep the landmines to a minimum, both to keep me from having headaches and to ensure that everything goes smoothly for the game, and thus the GMs.

Fixed to 2/4 physical


sorry about that, I thought I was doing a good thing by using local contacts. I even erased a couple I had in favor of local guys. I'll fix that ASAP.
Smokey Joe is an NPC, proprietor of the "U Lock U Store".



I should be done with this by the end of the day.

Wheeeee! Yeah, will answer 20, ASAP after actually joining up boss.

Woot, finally got some takes on Maus to read. Fun fun fun! Got a chuckle at Rico's takes when I got down to Thumper....

Anyway, I'll go and change the Maus starting money to reflect the roll. Hopefully he'll survive long enough to make the long process of getting on board cost effective

Just wanted to point out that I've just put up 'My History' of teh Brickhouse Boys in the Community Projects thread. Anyone want to take a gander and give me/us some feedback that'd be awesome. Of course, while doing it I half felt like I should have statted up and tried to play Crowbar....

...


Or not. Dead guys is no fun...

Nice work, Crowba-- er... Spike.

----

Related: What are the prevailing road conditions in the Barrens regarding vehicle movement?

Okay:

I've added to the existing timeline for the Brickhouse Boys to cover their entire existance as the 'Brickhouse Boys', that is this newest, and most recently destroyed, incarnation. Ok, so by my reckonning the only 'destroyed' incarnation...

I've expanded the rivalry between the AK's and the BB's a bit. Some of it is in the rough draft history still being polished in the other thread (waiting for more input before its retyped and approved), some of it occured to me during the 'timeline' phase.

Essentially the Boys went down for a couple of reasons:

Arrogance, believing they were more capable than they were, enhanced by membership bloat (lots of 'part time' boys who dropped out the moment things turned nasty) and the fact that the Asphalt Kings were not able to really focus on them until the truce that lead to the Kingsgate War.

Moving out of the Yard: The tenements that make up the Brickyard neighborhood are massively populated and the building themselves are a virtual fortress by urban standards. Had the Boys restricted themselves to petty landlords in the Yard they might have thrived, but Crowbar was a booster by nature, and his Boys needed cars to steal and garages to run, that meant taking turf outside 'Fortress Yard'. By itself, not a fatal weakness, but to help direct his gang's moneymaking prospects, Crowbar moved his entire operation out to the chopshops. Without a strong defensive bent (being used to the relative safety of hte Yard) they were extemely vulnerable to a decapitation strike, which is exactly what happened.

Decapitation: Crowbar was the entire driving force behind the Boys expansion. While a capable leader, he wasn't much of an organizer or planner. Ambition coupled with a throughly average intellect. Since no other Boy had yet developed his ambition internally, when he went down with his lieutentants on 19 October, all that was left were the hard core Peacoats with no real idea what to do next, and the 'rest of them' who hadn't really been that excited by the entire 'move out of the yard' idea anyway.

Schism: this was the real killer. Trojan and Johnny Soho (and Maus and the rest of us new guys) were basically cut off from their support structure when the old guard Yardies closed ranks and ditched the Peacoats. Some may still have ties and access to the tenements while others (Maus in particular) are utterly out in the cold. While the 'peacoats' were out getting revenge, the rest of the 'gang' fled, leaving the second Chop Shop unguarded, along with any other assets they couldn't haul back to the tenements with them. The survivors of the revenge mission found themselves with no where to hole up, and a lot of working girls and other street assets found themselves with no one at all protecting them.


In an alternative world, Crowbar might have survived the hit on the chop shop. This wouldn't have stopped the schism, but it would have possibly reduced its impact. The BB's might have holed up in their second shop, or been able to retreat back to the Yard (having more old Yardies in the Peacoats, and Crowbar being a Yardie as well) despite the loss of most of their numbers. It is debatable if such a move would have stopped the war, or if the BBs could have simply ridden out the storm from 'Fortress Brickyard' until they'd learned a few more survival skills as a gang.

In short, they got too big too fast and a combination of too much good luck (early on) compounded the effects of too little good luck later (when Crowbar went down...)

not that anything is set in stone until WR1 gives us the nod....

Well, no one's done any maintenance on them in ~40-50 years...

Ever drive around LA?

LA's not that bad. Although road are narrow, parked car on each side, and all the drivers in LA's not a very good driver (Asians, Uh!), it's still drivable.

PS. I'm not offending any Asians out there right? If it helps, I am Asian too

Dear God! Even the Asian drivers are bitching about Asian Drivers?!?

I'm one to talk, I drive like I'm in a race... and yet I rarely speed... its a mystery

Are you still looking for players?

I suggest you put up a teaser and see if one of the GMs bite. Some of us are still working on builds, so I think there's still plenty of time to sign up.

Officially this Recruitment phase is over, but If you really look over the links at the beginning of this thread (That means read all of the character creation rules on the wiki and abide by them) and come up with a concept that we really like, you can still get in.

Though if I hear one "I know this goes against the rules, but can I...." Or one "Can I just tweak...." or anything to that effect you can forget it.

Oh and NO adepts or mages!

Of course if WinterRat1 comes by and says no then you are out of luck. He has final say on all recruitment.

Havok

Just to echo Slipshade's comments, I left this in response to your previous request back on the 28th. We hadn't forgotten you, I think the reply just got lost in the shuffle.

I have a couple of different concepts that I'll post later for you guys to look over. I don't have time to post them tonight but I'll work on it first thing tomorrow.

Here's some rough ideas, I'm not married to any of the concepts. Give me a holler if you're interested, if not I've got plenty more. Only one of the concepts is underage, and that is Feeler

Dante, former combat biker
Dante was living the good life up until fairly recently as the rising star of combat biking. He was good. Really good. And in that statement was his problem, because Dante was also cocky as hell and not afraid to show it. And being cocky in the world of combat biking gets you killed, real quick. His real ability was his speed and maneuverability, having had the money to pay for Wired Reflexes 3 was a real asset. Unfortunately, he wasn't quick enough one night, as Ludo's trollish bouncers started to work on him. Dante survived, but barely, and his Wired Reflexes were damaged in the fight. At the same time, there was a new prodigy on the field by the name of Flash McGee, an adept with lightning-fast reflexes and a penchant for berserker rages. Dante was finished... Destitute, nowhere to turn for help, Dante turned to the only people who were ecstatic to see him... the gangers. Those who could afford a TV knew who he was, even if they didn't know what had happened. He had just "worked his way up" to the Brickhouse Boys before that fateful night happened, and his reflexes were the only thing that saved him from the carnage that night. Notes: Dante has a malfunctioning Wired Reflexes (3) unit with a funky side effect. It functions just as a Wired Reflexes (2) except that sometimes his unit will spasm and basically send him into a seizure (up to the DM when this happens). To counter that, he needs to spend every round he has the Wired Reflexes active performing at least two actions per round. This leads to him constantly twitching and pacing. Has skills in Monowhips, Bikes, Intimidation, and Dodge.

Todd Mcclain, the guy to go to
Everyone has a dealer, a guy to buy stuff from. Everyone has a fence. Todd used to be that guy. The guy that knows everyone worth knowing, the guy that can get you the stuff you need without asking questions. Then he made the wrong sell to the wrong people and started a gang war, or at least people are happy to blame him for it. Now, cut off from his former contacts in the big gangs, Todd is trying to work his way back up from the damned streets once again. The promising gang he'd had his eyes on, the Brickhouse Boys, well now they'd just gone and gotten themselves shot up. What the hell was the world coming to anyways? Notes: Has a lot of contacts in gangs like the Ancients, the Spikes, even shadowrunner contacts, but has the Hung out to Dry flaw and can't buy it back with Karma. He has to roleplay re-initiating those contacts and oh yeah they've all changed their numbers. Has a lot of social skills and a lot of contacts. Still has a fair amount of money left over from his dealing days, and a lot of the former Brickhouse Boys know Todd and/or bought from/sold to him when he was a "big boy".

Doc Havok, street doc
Everyone needs love sometimes, even gangers. And love is about all Doc Havok is good at. Sure, maybe he used to be a great doctor. Maybe he used to be one of the pioneers of cybertech. That was all before the alcohol set in. Now, the gangers are the only ones willing to trust their lives with someone as shady as Doc Havok has become. Notes: Being one of the former forerunners in cybertechnology, Doc has a 3 in cybertechnology with a specialization in bodyware giving him a 5 total, with a 4 in first aid. To balance that out, he has Addiction: Burnout (Alcohol) and is often wasted when operating on a patient. If the gang can get him back on his feet, he could prove a powerful asset (Any and all karma earned MUST go towards buying off his alcohol addiction before Doc can advance any of his skills, and the gang has to take steps to help him get over his addiction.) Has medical skills, knowledge skills, and a high intelligence tempered by alcohol poisoning.

Axe, ganger soldier
Ever heard about the guy you don't fuck with? "Yeah, that's Axe over there. Dont fuck with him" is right. Axe is one of the most brutal and violent of all the gangers in town. Not only did he survive the bloodshed on that fateful night, Axe thrived on it, hunting rival gang members down in the streets howling for blood. If only he had been a troll, the Spikes might have taken him, but nobody cares about a lone orc wreaking havoc in the streets. Axe barely manages to keep himself contained at the moment, but the first person to piss him off better watch the fuck out. Note: Due to the nature of this character, he may be inappropriate for this game. Axe is by far the most likely character to incite war among the gangs again, and if theres not a powerful leader figure to keep him in check he might very well bring doom down upon the ganger family. He's a very powerful, very durable soldier and a great asset if used properly, but I won't bring him out unless theres a PC leader figure who's willing to step up and put him in his place. On the other hand, if there is a strong leader figure, Axe will follow him to hell and back.

Feeler, techiebopper
Feeler is that kid that just wants somebody to love him. Since the tender age of 2 years old, Feeler has been taking toys apart and putting them back together. The kid is a technical genius, and can not only drive your car to him remotely, he can have it kick you out and then start taking itself apart. Feeler can tear down and rebuild almost anything the gangers are likely to encounter, and is unfailingly loyal to one of the PCs, but beware. If his loyalty is even once damaged in the slightest, it will be shattered forever. Needs a strong father figure to play under. Note: Feeler was a 13 yr old technojunkie manning a chop shop who was just kicking back and having a good time until the war. Now, the war changed something in him and his ideology has been shattered. Has mechanical build/repair skills, and not much else. Slightly obsessed with one of the PCs, Feeler even goes to the point of idolizing him and has a shrine somewhere in his shop.

I was definitely getting a 'reoccuring theme' vibe off those guys...


Did you feel it?


I felt it.

Lol if you're going to be in a small-time gang trying to claw its way up from the abyss, its good to have psychoses