I think netlich has the right idea. The only thing Celia has said IC is that she is looking for information from Wang. She has not mentioned the previous mission at all in-character (that was Jack alone), so the information she's looking for could theoretically have nothing to do with a mission or the team at all.
She has approached the team and after being told to be blunt she revealed that she's looking for information. Shadowrunners bread and butter is the acquiring/selling of information. I really do not see why somebody approaching you asking after some information would immediately mean they must be killed. Sure it would be greeted with suspicion and sure thoughts of how best to kill this person and get rid of the body if necessary would be going through a runner's mind, but that would only be used if it became necessary. I would expect many runners to be all too willing to hear about what information she was after.
1) If they have the information and it doesn't compromise them, they could make some easy cash without any effort at all.
2) The type of information sought would likely point to whoever is looking for said information. The runners could then evaluate the threat. If it were just some bum that got pissed off at Wang for not giving him some spare change, then there would be nothing to worry about and the runners could just rough up/kill the bum and be done with it. If it's somebody bigger then they still would want to know who so that they can plan a better defense and/or escape method.

I really think some of the OOC information that has been mentioned might have been leaked into some of the thoughts behind IC posts. And I know it ruins any suspense, but I've already said that this is really just a case of jumping at shadows, certainly something that should happen in a game like Shadowrun, but I don't see why it would need to ruin the game for people.
It was mostly just something to bring in new characters to the team.

Shalimar, I'd like to hear your thoughts on this. I know you've said that you want to leave the game, but what are your thoughts on the various comments that have been made since you last posted. Are you still deadset against continuing in the game or would you be willing to continue it a bit forward?

I would certainly not let Celia or Jack out of my sight at all, it would be possible to never see them again, and that would just totally screw things over.

Tempty's problem is that anyone can claim anything they want. Celiea can say she isn't out to get everyone, but that doesn't make it true. Celia could claim to be a great dragon for that matter, just because she says something doesn't make it true, and to a runner, who is by definition paranoid...well.

I think with all the turn over, and the ret-con, new people being introduced, old people leaving, the game has lost something for me. I would continue but the further we go, the less sense the game is making to me. I'm sorry. I'll bow out before Tempty does something irreconcilible with your plans for the game.

@Shalimar: Well right now it looks like the game is dieing, but the final blow has yet to be dealt. netlich, gobogen, and Cold-Dragon have all expressed the opinion that they would like to see this to the end, whatever it may be.
With everything that has been said, it looks like that end will be a fight between players, so lets go ahead and let the fighting begin.

@All: I believe we had stopped at the point where Hammer had suggested that everybody meet up the next day after tempers had cooled. Let's go ahead and pick it up from there. What is everybody doing?
Once Celia and Jack leave the club (if you even let them do so) I would imagine that there would be some discussion of setting up an ambush from the members of the team and possibly Jack and/or Celia doing things to prepare in case its a trap.

Tzaz here..I really really do not want to fight other players..
1] I brought in a player to help the team not fight it. If Hammer holds a barn still. I might hit it with a shotgun at 5m.
2] I really apoligize if i caused this team breakup. kill off jack and continue your game.
3 food for thought:
a} Hammer in this story every security personnel in Garlands club knows you are a cyber monster. They checked you through security.
b] Tempty the staff knows you are a shadowrunner becuuse you go armed all the time and the cleaning staff picks up after you when you get hurt.
c] Taku you got hurt also at the tuffer shack and how did you get it fixed. Kill the street doc You have a sensei who trains you, kill him? Kill all the students who were in your classes?

All of you have people who know you are shadowrunners from fixers, contacts, other rumnners, service personnel, street docs, and etc.. You do not kill everyone who knows you work outside the law. They might not know which job you did last night but they know you do jobs. Nobody is an island.

Wow...a game where the idea is to fight the other players...I hope the next one doesn't turn out this way. >.<

as far as things that Celia does....

No peaking, Slacker only.

bought the movie equilibrium and watched it. All i was thinking of was gun bunny and Tempty. Making out my will now. movie was worth a rental/

Hey hey Tzaz, it's not like you're all alone. You could ask me for help. *shrugs*

And on a side note, it's possible beating the snot out of those attacking (no offense to the attackers) can provide us with the needs to continue forward.

Sinuous lady aka Snakelady. we do not have the same agenda. I want to help Wang Chi, you want info out from him. The Gang of three are out for themselves. I will ask for help if they go after me, but so far IC they look like they have the same agenda as me. Look out for Tempty's dildo in her boot though. There will be two blows struck if I am in a fight. One when they hit me and one when I hit the floor. We are in a group setting. How do I ask you for help against them. Taku and hammer will have me deead before your snake can help..

You ask 'outside' the club silly. ^-^ *rolls emoticon eyes* or ask for my commlink number, lol...or things like that.
You're also a mage, and supposedly you do or do not know I am one too, you could ask that way somehow.
A low level spirit going after me shouldn't have much trouble locating depending what info you give and when you do it.

Hehehe, spiralling out of control again....


Ok let us not re-open the issue of professionalism and whether someone blundered in the scene. I think we all have more than expressed our opinion.


Now a new offer is on the table. Let us talk about that. From Mark's point of view there would be reserach first and killing later. Of course depending on the reactions he would get from Tempty and Taku he migh tbe convinced to do the killing first. My concernes would be about the obvious ties that can be easily gleaned by someone who traces back the two "nuisances" dissappearance; if they had someone watching their backs or if their employer gets involved(I do not yet know they work on separate agentas and have not proven their words- another reason I am not willing to off them).

Mark is something that in public view kinda sticks in memory. he is not the definitive Street SAm as he was no really obvious cyber-limbs. But a closer inspection will give of he is chromed to the brim (Wired Reflexes and Dermal plating especially). Tzaz is twice that. So if Tzaz was to dissappear I think the most rudimentary underground research would point at them two having met at Garland's. And from there more detailed investigation could easily lead to connection's with Ceilia, Tempty and Taku.

On the other hand if I do my homework learning as much as I can while ensuring that the next meets with the duo are in controlled environments where they cannot be linked, the trail will slowly fade out the more days that passed. One sighting of us together is not what I consider a liability after days start rolling. But if that sighting is followed by the dwarf and mage's dissappearance in the same night or following day things are a bit worrying and could lead to me.

Anyway- if I had my way I would start the following from as soon as I left the club, hoping to get as much as possible done by next night:

Get in touch with Zelda and ask her the following (She isn't my contact but this involves her too so I can't see why she wouldn't want to help):

> Who called Wang Chi outside the Stuffer Shack....Whether there were more than one phone calls outside the Stuffer Shack - See if she can pick up traces on the Matrix and whethe rshe can get the actual conversation (I dunno how much isactually doable but if it is nodays it should be in 2070. Then again as shadowruners we should have some basic protection so I dunno.)
> Check whether there was any Camera, AR trails of what happened outside and inside the store. (I know that IC everything went down as soonas the gang hit us- MArk doesn't though and perhaps there was some form of surveilance outside that may have picked somehting)
> See if she can dig up Anything on Celia and Tzaz, but this I want her to do as untracable as possible. (Tzaz's info provided could be easily doublechecked in public catalogue's though)

Street Doc connection
> What is the word on the street? Who is after Wang chi and co.
> Anything on Celia and Tzaz, Again this is through her connections but I want to make this untracable. I would rather she doesn't find anything than find some juicy info and leave a trail that can then be traced back to her and me.

Police Contact
> Australia burglary. I want to see if he can get his hands on any info on the item we retrieved and what really happened in Autralia.
> Stuffer Shack. I want him to get me the Lone Star's version of the incident and any details.
> Give him two more stupid unconnected jobs to research in (Pick up tonight's electro-paper and find two crimes. Then ask him to get me info on them two) so as to throw him off waht is important to me.

Of course I would not expect allthis to be accomplished inone day (perhaps Zelda's part) and I would expect the Lone Star officer to ask for money.

@Tzaz: Sorry, but it just seems like there is no way to avoid a fight between players at this point. It's definitely not how i'd like to see this end, but I would like to see the game through whatever the case.
I don't believe fighting is going to be breaking out in the club this night. You should have at least the next day to contact Celia or anybody else you might want to.


@netlich: When i get back in the creative mood i'll post something IC, but for now i'll go ahead and give you some results:
Contact Zelda:
She says she'll try hacking Wang's commlink to find out who called him (of course, if that was Wang's damage commlink Celia had, that won't actually do anything). Unless Wang records all his conversations, typically a bad thing for shadowrunners to do as it leaves evidence that could later be retrieved, she can't think of any way to retrieve the conversation(s).
Checking for cameras that might have seen something will take her a while as there are a lot of different places that she'd have to check. She does remember that it looked like the Stuffer Shack's security had been deactivate for a while before she hacked in.
What kind of information are you giving her to base searches on Jack and Celia? Jack reveal a few details, but really all you know about Celia is her name. It would likely be difficult to find anything based solely on a first name.
Contact your StreetDoc:
He hasn't heard anything about somebody hunting you. He's willing to ask around, but he reminds you he's a street doc and as such he isn't the best at the cloak-and-dagger drek.
Again, what information are you giving him to base inquiries about Celia and Jack on.
Contact your Lone Star Officer:
He's upset that you are trying to bring all this stuff to him at once. Just because you're friends and all, doesn't mean he can instantly get all that. You'll owe him one, a big one, but he'll try. Really he doesn't think he'll be able to get access to the open case file on the Stuffer Shack incident, it wouldn't be filed yet and would only be in the hands of the detective(s) handling it.
Oh and do you tell your contacts you want a rush on the info or give them a time frame to work in? And just what time are you contacting them at, depending on their schedule they may be upset that you are calling them while they are in the middle of work or trying to sleep?

I guess I'll make the first post then, just to get the ball rolling and bouncing. ^-^;

with a little flashforward and this and that....*tinkers*

There is no real point to playing out a fight. A single Mage with time to prepare could wipe out 3 runners with no major effort, simply by summoning and binding a force 6-12 Elemental, there would be no real reason to play it out when its 2 mages vs 3 relatvely mundanes. Heck one of the Mages could cast a force 10 or 12 stunball and down all of us at once, and still probably only take 2 or 3 boxes of damage.

This is also why I said I was ok to with seeing this through...

A) If things wen tthe way I imagined them then Mark would probably not be intersted in offing them just now but could be dissuaded by the other to runers (tempty and taku)...

B) If he did decide to off them we would try to do it the best way possible and this to his mind is first elarnign more about them...If he realised that at elast one of them was a mage/shaman (might be possible with Jack) then that would mean extra work and definetely not a as soon as possible confrontation...it just doesnt work this way...

C) Which is why he would have to wait until he got some satisfying results on his previously mentioned research. He definetely doesnt expect to get the results in one day.


Now if we really wanna go down with this I would rather we do it properly and IC...I am not 100% interested in just playing out another Shadowrun FireFight...If the rest agree(which doesnt look like) I am in just fo rthe fan of it - it will give me some feedback on the character. Although as Shalimar said I am not expeecting much more feedback than : Mark is weak against mages, especiallyif they are prepared and he doesn't get a bullet in...

If we wanna keep on playing then I will prepare a more detailed answer to how my research is gona pan out based on Slacker's post and questions...
Or iof battle commences (!) then let us move forward to the scene in question and lets get some dice rolling

Slacker asked me once again to make a post for him while he's at work:

I am all up for the Destruction Derby... This would have been my favourite way to handle the game...Let it move as we all think it should and see what happens...

Ok, let's all RP the way we think we should. I like it.

Im in lets see where it goes

Are we actually doing this and everybody is busy working via PMs with Slacker? Or are there second thoughts?

I am starting to have worrying feelings about the health of this game...

Currently, you are the only one that has been sending me PMs about the game netlich.

I was really sort of waiting on a post from Shalimar, to see if she had any objections to everybody leaving the club.

heeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeey!

I talked with you a little too Slacker, lol. I also did that one post, but thus far it's really everyone else and shal we need right now, or so I thought.

I can't roleplay my own death and demise at th same time - it's just twisted.

I'm not really interested in playing out Tempty's death.

Ok - sorry to see you go Shalimar...

Are we still interested in continuing this game and if yes does Taku want to discuss any details with Mark. Mark does want to fill Taku in on what has happened and get his opinion and could do so as he gives him a ride somewhere if the phys-ad came by public transport. Mark definetely not wants to say any more inside the club...Too much might have already been overheard by others he fears...

@Shalimar: Who says you are going to die? Since you are obviously already metagaming, might as well take it further. Jack isn't even a full mage, he's a mystic adept with more points in adept than mage. If i remember correctly he only has one offensive spell; and Celia isn't a combat mage. Besides from their character's stand point you could probably convince them that you wanted to work with them, so they wouldn't even expect an ambush. If you did get the drop on them, they'd have no chance at all against you, Taku (who is an adept and could handle himself against a spirit), and Hammer (who likely could handle a spirit too, if his last character was any indication).
But whatever, if you don't want to play, you don't want to play. I guess we'll just go on with you.

@Everybody Else: Since Shalimar seems set on leaving the game, Tempty will likely just tell Taku and Hammer that she doesn't trust those two. And if they'd take her advice, they would leave town immediate. After that she goes to pack a few things, warn her lover that people have been sniffing around the place, and then do her best to get out of town quickly and quietly.

Metagaming wise I will agree to Shalimar's thoughts.... In most combat scenarios I would expect the magical group to win... It is all a matter of a charm spell - Get me to go mental on the rest Our only hope is mananging to resist such a spell or getting th efirst bullet in...But anyhow I do nto want to start another tangent on hwo things MIGHT go...Let's see how they really go; like I said I need some feedback on my character's style and abilities

Ingame-wise my thoughts on how to deal with Tempty being out would be IMO to have her and her boyfriend go silent for a few cause their clubhas been compromised probably....They leave us to do the research while they look to their own problems...Liek who else knows that Garland is a place that Tempty hangs out a lot...etc etc...

That might be a reasonable excuse methinks for the gunbunny to graciously bow out of he picture...And would offer a nice way for her to come back in (hint hint to Shalimar) shoudl the coast clear without making it sound too bad game wise....

I was kind of waiting for in game feed back from shalimar's character. If she's like: let's ambush and kill those two, they represent a security hole for us. I would be like, right on let's do it. By himself, Taku knows too little right now. Eventually he would clearly decide to do that by himself and probably set up something for the next day.

If nothing else happen, he'll just invite Mark to go back to his place and discuss some more.

And yes Taku did get there by public transportation, was planning on taking the taxi home or something.

That's true, it could happen, or something like that.

and that is an alternative for Shal too, depart for a little and come back if things become more sensible or whatever.

Now if we could just get some posts, lol...

I am asleep in a coffin hotel..I am waiting for a phone call. Commlink is off except for 1145-1215 each day for 3 days. If no call I am taking the train back to Portland. Finding the largest forested park in Seattle area. Scooping the Park out.
Buying an old fashioned walkie-talkie pair and a blow up doll and a set of clothes with hard hat. Going to the stripper club called foxes on 128th and I5. Hitting the rock stores, dwarven clothing stores and the latest in firearms.

First of all for the sake of clarity let us assume we have already decided on a meeting place and that tomorrow we will call Jack to verify. Either that or Celia has left us a commcode to contact her too in order to arrange for a place to meet.

AS for the ride around Seattle here's what I tell Taku.Essentially give him my version of the story as obejctive as I can

i.e.

After the ran Mark did with WAng Chi and the rest he left as he was not feeling hungry for a bite at Stuffer Shack missing thus all the action. the next day he tried getting in touch with the mystical adept for a basic debrief and customary bragging on their succesfull mission. Of course he could not find the man which led him to speak with Tempty and arrange to meet her this night.

But then Jack and Celia showed up. Jack came in indicating he knew about had happened in Stuffer Shack. That was trouble since it was only 24 hours after the incident and the dwarf seemed to know details like the mystery troll with the cape and mask. At the same time throughout the conversation the dwarf claimed he was a friend of Wang Chi, a paramedic from the Tir who came to Seattle to trade stones and also met with the mystic adept in talismonger shops to talk magic and trade this stones he dealt in. He claimed to be out of the loop as far as Shadowrunning was concerned although he might have met Tempty a month or two ago in behalf of Wang Chi.

Apparently he had been approached by Celia who introduced herself as an old associate of the mystical adept and was now concerned for the man and his running companions. Taku was present when Celia introduced herself and heard her say she was after information of a select nature that did not directly relate to the runers.

Mark would be using the next hours to get his contacts on overdrive to research the info on Jack and Celia, check the word on the street about th epossibility someone was out for them, and finally he would investigate more the previous job they did fo rhe was getting suspicious about it. Incidents occured to close between one another for comfort...

He would be contacting Taku the next morning at 11:00 unless he discovered more crucial info earlier...

I am just posting this all here rather than put them in IC properly and save us some time....

Ok netlich, what you're doing is fine.

Let's discuss OOC for conveniance's sake.

Taku thinks that we are not safe in the presence of either of the two individuals that arrived and is not sure what to do about it. He agrees with not knowing where the other lives or anything of the sort, by the way. Taku is not the smartest man, nor does he like risks on his identity being known and possibly revealed by strangers, non-shadowrunners to boot. The two intruders were very blunt and direct and that should mostly be answered with suspicion in his mind. They are a huge liability and they seem to know much about Wang Chi. Thing is, Taku cares more about himself then Wang Chi at this point.

He honestly says that whatever happens he'll leave the Seattle sprawl for a while and leaving soon. Before that he wants to cover his tracks since it's the safest thing to do. That involves erasing Jack and his friend since they seem to be the types that stick their noses everywhere, and that's particularly bad when they're looking after your own activities. He suggests to meet to prepare a an ambush of some kind on the other two.

Well I can see where you are coming from but there are two points where Mark would dissagree...

One, Erasing the duo now only removes the leafs of the tree- we know nothing of the trunk or the root. The troll is interested in finding out who is behind them in order to cover his tracks too. Which to him means keeping them alive for awhile. Let alone he would not go into wetwork with his pants down. He sincerely doubts the both of you will find enough info by tomorrow to organise an ambush and to him taking on two unknowns no matter how unprofessional they seemed is a big no-no unles he really has too.

Two, the duo's bluntness could be used against them if it comes down to that. But it is that blundness that hints to Mark that they are either too stupid/inexperienced (that is IC opinion based on th elimited facts of the scene we played people I am not trying to offend anyone's roleplaying here - we have gone through this subject in almost two pages worth of fourm discussion ) to play in the shadows or they are not AFTER the runners or even Wang Chi. In fact he suspects that both previous statements are true which is why he wants some time to research them and their story. If they are kept in the dark so to speak they won't be any trouble unless their objective is to harm Mark and the others which, even if it is the case, the way they handled things up to now has no chance of success...I mean i fyou wanna find info on/or harm a shadowruner you won't go meet him and chat with him now will you?

Let me mull on this for a bit as I don't want us to go back in circles again - I want this to progress and I will post again with some suggestions from Mark

I'd like to point out that Celia tried to be 'polite' as far as the topic went, but everyone else just told her to spit it out and say what she wants. Essentially, Jack got everyone wriled up, so when I showed up, I was already dealing with frayed nerves.

Of course, I tend to agree with most everything else being said. So I withdraw to my cell until I get the shock treatment, lol.

Yeah what you say makes sense and Taku agrees with most of that coming from Mark. I just said what Taku's instincts were and that hasn't changed. On the other hand it might be smart to wait for a bit and do as you suggested. The two of them should probably agree to work with the duo for a while looking for Wang Chi, even though that's not a priority anymore. The underlying agenda would be to learn about the two of them and who might employ them and for what. Also, we should try to find out how much of what they know has gone to some third party.

As an aside, wouldn't Celia be mad at Jack for the possible troupe he's put her in. Wouldn't she try to reason him in some way? Just saying though..

If Celia had more experience in this sort of thing, quite possibly she would be mad at Jack. However, for all she shows more tact in some things, the shadow world is still a bit new to her. She's aware of the dangers in what happened, but she thinks (in somewhat distorted experience) she's safe for the time being: Just don't forget to be cautious, lol.

That, and in IC/OOC outlook, we both feel that Jack is in more danger than us if he keeps bewildering trolls. hehe (No offense to you Tzaz, just fun and all with the hijinxs that went on)

Zelda quit also?

I haven't gotten any response from Whizbang and haven't seen her on AIM to ask her directly. So, at least for the time being, Zelda will be handled as an NPC. Zelda has been busy working of something of her own, but I've already discussed some things with netlich that Hammer would have her work on, and she may be able to continue handling some hacking duties for the team.

*evil grin*
muhahahaha- big brother (or sista in this case) is watching you!

This looks both good and bad for me? lol...

At least the likelihood of being shot has decreased, I think...

We are almost there I should post an IC post tomorrow on the call to Jack and the a-ok for the meet...Just some calrification on something I am a bit hazy on : Have we pre-arranged the meeting point or are we looking for one and arranging it over the phone? If so then we have to assume that either Celia left us her commcode which I really doubt or that she will get in touch with Jack? Can I get a heads up on that?


Additionally I just realised after reading the bloody rules book more carefully this time, that Cyberware and Bioware can be combined but they are tracked separately in essense costs. And then the lowest cost in essense is halved. If that is true then I am a dissgrace to cyberzombies around...DAMN! I will need to have a Cybered Up Troll-Wall version III now for a next game! And here I thought I had exhausted that possibility

I left my contact number..I also said I would meet in a public park. the meet is prearranged.

I guess we presume I show up there was well then, as 'friend' to Jack.

As far as cyber and bioware...yeah, you pretty much can wear them both, lol. The only thing I'd worry about is if drinking Buzz cola will kill any of the bioware or rust the cyber stuff.

Hehehe- naaaah its allright I got me my doctor's prespriction for that...A glass of machine oil each morning...Shaken, not stirred....


Anyway - let's get this meeting going shall we....?

sounds good to me...hopefully we still have more than us and Tzaz playing too, lol.

Sorry, I haven't posted anything for a few days. I've just been busy with RL stuff. I'll try to post something/reply to PMs this evening.

One question though, what kind of place were you planning to meet at? From what Tzaz had said, I was thinking he wanted it to be a public park or something along those lines. The only one I know of off the top of my head is Freeway Park which is in downtown Seattle (i.e. AAA security level), so I'm not sure that you'd want to meet there.

So where would you like to meet and is there a particular security level you'd desire or some level you'd like to avoid?

East Seattle: I405 and I90
Cougar mountain Regional Wildlife Park

Provided it meets Mark's requirements then am ok with it:

a) It closes at night - meeting is to be held at 12 midnight. We will be there illegaly but will have noone around besides animals and maybe scant patrolls (so a triple A park might not be best).

b) Send privately to SLacker

Meet is between us , i.e. Wang Chi associates, professed friends, or long-time aquaintances...No third party involved. Obviously just because Mark accepted the meet does not mean that either [c]Celia[/b] or Jack have come clean. It means that he is willing to hear their case out and see what he can offer and he can get in retrospect; he has obviously dropped the 'I dunno what a Wang Chi is?' attitude now...

*has limited geography skill, especially in game* So I'll have to take everyone's word on that....

Hopefully the slump is ending then! Every thread I'm in seems to have taken some days off, lol...

Cougar mountain Regional Wildlife Park it is then.
The rain has finally stopped (at least for the next day or so), but the ground is still quite muddy.
Security is likely to be light with the occasional park official patrolling the area and possibly a random scattering of cameras to watch out for poachers, vandals, and/or early signs of forest fire.
Since all commlinks have a built-in gps, i'd imagine that you exchange a specific set of coordinates rather than meeting at a landmark that may be difficult to find for runners unaccustomed to the wilderness and at midnight (popular landmarks would also be more likely to have higher security). Does that sound right?

If everybody could either post in spoilers or send me a pm of their exact setup plans, i would appreciate it. For the most part though, the ball is in your court now. Unless I decide to throw something extra in the mix, it looks like you can get on with your meeting between characters.

An wildlife park has no power, guards except at the entry places on the roads. There is an open air (roof , no sides building] that is used for an information center and jump off point for the campers and hikers.This is still virgin land..No man. More cougars than guards..lol THis is my kinda of place.