Not sure where either math is coming from actually...

With Karmagen errata'd (ability X5) base cost of attributes (the main 8 ) comes to 380, then add you edge of another 160 karma.
Karmagen unerrata'd (ability X3) I come out to a total of 327 including edge...

I'm sure I'm missing something here...

You and I got almost the same results in the numbers, GrimWulf. The only one I don't agree with is the 8 Edge karma cost, which I calculate at 165,

Version 1h adds correctly for me. The only things I can think of is a) there's a number in the Group Skill Expand Karma box (which deducts from the total karma spent), or b) the sheet did not finish all of its calculations (I've noticed an occasional lag in adding or removing skills and the total being changed).

Yeah, just redid math, think I added 35 twice instead of 40 for the last, so yeah 165 for Edge.

I almost forgot: mods included in off-the rack vehicles don't show up properly. For instance the Steel Lynx does not seem to have a weapon mount which could be modified (choice of weapon, gyrolink, ammo bins), only the description mentions it. The included autosofts are missing altogether (Defense 3, Targeting 3). The Dobermann has a similar problem and as of the Errata it should have a turret instead of a fixed mount.

Thanks for finding both of these estradling. Playtesting on the hacking page is always appreciated. Fixed both of these issues.

No worries, we're all here to help each other out.

And I hope we can hear from last_of_the_great_mikeys on this to see what's up

@DamienKnight: Just something to let you know about, if you don't already. There's been talk in this thread regarding the calculation of essence loss, particularly when it comes to stuff like suites, grades, and other stuff.

Another thing with weapon mounts: a visible fixed, remote-controlled normal sized one should cost 1 slot, not zero. There seems to be no way to differentiate whether your mount packs something bigger than an LMG or not, unless the mount is a turret.
Worst case scenario heavy internally-concealed armored turret should be 11 slots, not 10. See Arsenal p.145-148.

EDIT: There is no sidecar mod in the vehicle mod list. (Arsenal p. 143)

The only rules quote in that thread mentioned the example in Augmentation where it explicitly showed that modifiers are multiplied together against the base cost, rather than added and then multiplied. This is the basis for how the sheet multiplies modifiers to essence and money.

The vehicle rules are the exception. According to the books the modifiers to speed and accel are added then multiplied, which version i supports.

Until errata specify that essence modifiers are added before being multiplied, they will stay as they are in the sheet.



If you have gone through the trouble of figuring out the slot cost without the sheet, then could you find which specific part of the turret has the wrong cost on the sheet. Totals are nice, but the actual part that you think is off would be more helpful.

Also, just a note. I read the newest FAQ released and have updated the 'i' version of the sheet so that Cyberware/Bioware armor mods have no encumberance (like mystic armor).

By the way, Catalyst has followed their trend of trashing old mechanics in favor of ease of play, completely ignoring game balance. For example, they maintain that there is no limit to the number of targets a mage can extend their counter-spelling to... because tracking 'int' number of targets is too cumbersome (LoL!).

They also confirmed the Super Cyber Tank Armor Rule in the FAQ. Basically a starting character can have a 4 body and 20+ armor without any encumberance. w00-h00!

Thats right... if you save up for the right wares, you could even have a body of 1 and 22 armor while naked, with no encumberance! That is just smart rule writing. Period. I applaud their wisdom.

This confirmed feature will continue to be available on the SR4CG_DK, because I believe in peoples right to ruin their game balance and still enjoy a time-saving excel chargen. If people should have the freedom to drink themselves to death, then they should have the right to Gimp their games with broken rules.

In the words of William Wallace... FREEEEEEDOOOOOMMM!

I am noticing a problem upon starting up this sheet.
If I set Karma Build immediately then move into the the main sheet, the active skills section only has one rating's box area that can be filled.
This is after the first active skill row. The ratings are red, but they do show up on the character sheet.
Please inform.
Thanks.
-Marston

I am not sure I understand your question. One rating column is for BP, the other is for Karma. When using the Karma build system, you cannot purchase skills with BP.

As I see it, the placement part is wrong. It should be 1 for the mount itself or 2 if the mount is reinforced (i.e. for weapons larger than an LMG), +0 for external, +2 for internal and +3 for concealed visibility. The flexibility and part is OK, but there should be a mention that heavy turret flexibility only works with a reinforced mount and a vehicle of Bod 14 or greater.
The control part is off as well. it should be +0 for remote-control, +1 for manual, +2 for armored manual. Combining manual with remote-controlled operation does not add any slots, since the whole package is the sum of the parts. There would only be an increased slot cost if you wanted to have unprotected manual and armored manual (+3), but at least to me that sounds silly.

The torpedo launcher adds another slot to the total of the above options, and is also used for underwater-capable weapons other than torpedoes.

I hope that was more helpful.

Having to maintain LOS with all characters to be protected and needing to use a free action to include or exclude people from counterspelling is enough of a restriction for me.

DamienKnight,

I have yet to see this addressed and if I missed it I appoligise for duplicating a bug report.
On the weapons page you can not add a quanity to any weapon you are buying so the cost shows up as 0

If you are doing a cusom weapon it adds the costs just fine.

I think I may have noticed a cyberware cost error. Specifically, raptor cyberlimbs. Augmentation lists the modular lower-leg version at 25,000¥ for both legs, and the entry for them in the "you have modular limbs, buy them here" section is correct at 12,500¥ per leg, for a total of 25,000¥. However, the non-modular version in the spreadsheet (i.e., you bought raptor cyberlegs instead of normal cyberlegs) lists the lower leg version for 25,000¥ per leg, and the full leg version for 30,000¥ per leg. To contrast, plain ol' "I lost it in 'Nam" obvious cyberlegs are 10,000¥ for lower and 15,000¥ for full.

Unless there's a book I don't know about that says the permanent versions of raptor cyberlegs are that much more expensive than regular cyberlegs (which I'd be perfectly accepting of!), someone might want to take a look at that.

(one hell of an ambitious first post from a lurker, ain't it?)

Thanks for bringing that up. One of my gaming group pointed that out to me, but I dont know if anyone mentioned it in the forums. I unlocked the quantity cells in version i.


Welcome, thanks for posting. I agree with your assessment. I will change the full obvious raptor leg to 17500 per leg, and the obvious lower leg to 12500 per leg.

Something like this shows up.
This is with only the Karma Generation set TRUE, all other settings were left as default.

I noticed that too, but as the cells aren't flagging as an error (yellow field with red text) and everything calculates as normal, I just brushed it off as a display change.

And DK, in the thread I linked, there was talk about a German re-printing of Augmentation that changes how essence loss is calculated as well as an English errata that (for some reason) is yet to be released. Was just trying to give you a heads up about that.

This may seem like an odd sort of question, but is there any trick to the weapon selection screen?

I'm able to choose the weapons with no problem, but the "Quantity" column seems to be locked, and I can't select it to choose how many of the weapon the character possesses. Since I assume the Nuyen cost is based on quantity, with these rows remaining empty, the cost is stuck at 0.

Under Excel, the spreadsheet doesn't even let me click on the cell. Open office however allows me to click on the cell, but when I try to enter a value, it pops up a message stating 'Protected cells can not be modified."

To fix that error you need to enable your macros. If you look below the ribbin bar you will see a security wanring. you need to enable the macros to fix this issue.

Character Sheet 2 is missing the Augmented Attributes.

There are four implants called Nephritic Screen (1) instead of Nephritic Screen (1-4)

EDIT: In which book can I find the hunted (1-3) quality?

Version i is now available.

http://www.mediafire.com/file/4r2ammtcemm/SR4CG_DK_1i.zip

This is a minor update, including:

- Removed Cyberware/Bioware Encumberance
- Revised Adapsin to work from the 'Grade' column.
- Fixed Weapon qty column
- Various other tweaks and fixes

Martial arts does not define unique traits of a character, but a learned skill. Because of this, my group does not count martial arts towards the quality limit. To facilitate this, I have added an Option house rule called 'Martial Arts is Not a Quality'. When set to TRUE, the Martial Arts quality will no longer be available to select on the list, and all characters will have access to the Martial Arts area of the Main Sheet. Simply select a style and advantage, and you will pay either 5 BP or 10 Karma per advantage, and will be allow to purchase up to 2 maneuvers per Style/Advantage.

Very awesome to see this project still going. Way back in the day I modded the blackie sheet to add various stuff, so it's cool to see someone else having picked it up and done it a lot better than I ever did.

Just wanted to point out a few things I've noticed when I was tweaking around with it though.

1) AI's quality list doesn't include the Pilot Origins 5/10 BP quality for selection (it was an easy hack to add it in to the list on the hidden quality's page)

2) Chem - Drugs gear section doesn't include a number of the base book drugs (at least Jazz and Deepweed that I noticed)

3) The Hacking section mods dropdown doesn't include the 1-slot Customized Interface mod, but instead it's found in the Commlink-Accessory section as a 0 cost item for some reason.

4) When you select the Aptitude quality and set a skill to 7, it highlights it in yellow with red text. It'd be nice if that conditional formatting could be modified to check for the aptitude quality selected and not freak if there's a 7.

5) I'm not quite sure about this one, but I noticed today that the price in SR4A pg 232 for autosofts went up from SR4 pg 228 (rating 1-3 is now x500 instead of x200 and 4-6 is x1000 instead of x500). You're using the x10,000 cost for Activesofts that came from SR4A so thought you may want to use the cost for autosofts as well. (unless this is some sort of errata/faq bug that I've missed)


Anyways, thanks again for all your hard work in keeping this going. It's an awesome resource.

1) Book and Page reference please
2) Complete list of missing drugs?
3) Book and page reference, or at least list what the cost should be. Commlink-Accessory is a good place for it, but 0 is a bad price, I agree.
4) No, I like having 7s highlighted. Its like restricted gear... its a big deal, so it needs to be easy for a GM to spot when reviewing a character.
5) Thanks for finding this error, and the page reference. Auto-soft prices will be updated in the next version.


Thanks! I wouldve quit a long time ago except for the bugfinding and feedback I get from Dumpshock users.

1) Was in the document I sent you over wave.

Love the sheet. I don't know what I would do with out it. Something I have noticed while building a demolitions character. The Enfield GL-67 Grenade Launcher seems to be missing from the weapons sheet. I could have sworn I remember being able to select it in earlier versions.
-edit-
Also the off-road suspension vehicle mod sends the price of vehicles skyrocketing. It is adding 100,000+ to the cost.

The ArmTech MGL-6 seems to be missing from the weapons sheet as well. Arsenal p.31 for both.

Edit: It seems that naming custom guns breaks the first and third character sheets on the CharSheet tab; the Ranged Weapons "Type" column throws #N/A instead of the weapon's type in both. The second character sheet on that tab is unaffected, though.

I see somehow that the martial art advantages to clubs, blades, and unarmed are not adding into weapon damages like it once did. I've looked at the areas involved and I can't see way it's not working.

Edit: I found it the Named list is pulling up AM instead of AL which breaks it.

That reminds me I'd like to see Optimized Cyberlimbs,

Great Work by the way.

[Edit] APRIL FOOLS!

I was going to do a few more bugfixes and release version j before I quit, but forget it! I am too tired of this community, and tired of this sheet. I am going to be taking down all links to the sheet. I will be devoting my time to more fun endeavors.

Below is a list of all of the reasons I am quitting shadowrun and dumpshock FOREVER:

Cyberpunk is so 80s. It hit it's peak with Johnny Mnemonic, and was downhill after that.

Catalyst is lazy. They have removed realism from Shadowrun in order to make the dice rolling easier. Super Cyber Tank Armor is just one example of how broken they have made SR4.

Dumpshock is a headache. Everyone always complains. The sheet will never be good enough for you all.

My gaming group has broken up. They all went to play Warhammer 40k, and I think its dumb to spend hundreds of dollars on a STRATEGY game. Its not even role playing. I role play to immerse into a character who is more capable and interesting than myself. I dont just want gunfights... I want drama.

I no longer have time for the sheet, since I have a big responsibility setting up my Vampire family at http://twilight731.proboards.com/index.cgi?

Honestly, I can't image how I tolerated the annoying whiners on dumpshock. Not everyone... some people were helpful. But there are too many people who just get on here to complain about this or that, and I am done with it.

You guys continue having fun with your overpowered mages and rediculous cyber limbs... I am moving on. Goodbye.

If any of you are wanting to move on to a more mature and interesting role playing game, you are welcome to apply to join me. I am registered at the Twilight RPG as 'DamienKnight'. Send me a PM in their forums and I will help you apply to join my family (if you want to play a vampire character. No Stinky Dogs (werewolves) allowed!)

Don't be such a baby. I didn't say I'd never play SR again. I can't speak for everyone else but I need a break for a while. Don't try to use us as an excuse to play your stupid vampire game. Maybe if you weren't such a rule nazi, people wouldn't have started playing Warhammer which BTW is an AWESOME game so lay off.

Have a sparkling fun time with your new 'family'

Cloud

Wow! OK have fun with your new endeavor. I don't know if I added it or not but I was only trying to be helpful. Most things I suggest I do my self on the current sheet I have. I but do like to see how you go about it because my excel-fu in not as strong as yours. But anywho have fun man.

Happy April fools to you too DK! Appreciate all your work on this, and your sense of humour!






______________________
If it's not a joke, sorry to see you go, and please don't remove the links.

Do you really think it's true ... Any SR player knows Twilight is a travesty ! Happy April Fools !

@DK you are a god at Excel-Jutsu !

really yes he got me, I haven't been thinking about April fools all day. I work at a Jail so we don't get much in the ways of that funny stuff.

He got me 2 sec too... When I saw that the last post on that forum is so old !

Hmmm looks like I picked the wrong time to try and download an updated Sheet. I spent about 5 minutes looking on that twilight page for a link before I read the April fools post. That is five minutes that I will never get back... nor will the memory of that page ever leave me. That was a very elaborate site for a prank. Good work

All links have been restored. Just as a note, I did NOT build that twilight RPG page. Cloud and I cooked up the joke, then I went and found that website and thought it was too perfect!

Just to be clear:

- Johnny Mneumonic was great, but I do NOT believe it was the pinnacle that marked the decline of Cyberpunk. To the contrary, Cyberware research is just blooming, and making Cyberpunk fantasy all the more alluring.

- Catalyst is not lazy, but AWESOME. I met some Catalyst writers at GENCON indy and they are cool people. 4th edition is the best SR by far.

- Dumpshock is great. I have a nerdgasm every time I read a discussion on the technical possibilities of Armor in Cyberlimbs, or how it is just scientifically impossible that a single mage could provide spell defense on more targets than their Intuition.

- My Shadowrun group has not broken up. In fact we just started a new campaign and everyone is loving it. We were visiting a game store and saw some neat Warhammer 40k terrain recently, which gave me the idea.

I just saw 'New Moon' for the second time when it came out on DVD. Twilight is interesting. It crosses bridges between Drama loving wives and Mythicly-Cursed-Monster loving husbands. Twilight broadened my wife's interest enough so that she was able to watch Underworld with me and kinda enjoy it.

But... I would never play an RPG in their Teen-Girl-Targeted Drama world. Puh-lease. Thank you to those who saw the site and instantly realized it was a joke, you do me justice.

Now, back to business:



Thanks for finding this. It will be fixed in version j.


If you are talking about Attribute Optimization on cyberlimbs, the sheet already has it. Just go to the bottom of the mod list for the arm and you will see 'Customized Agility' etc.

In version J, I implemented a fix that will cause customized limbs to increase the availability of the cyberlimb they are installed on.

Nope, I'm talking about the limbs like Evo Kali, and Ultimate Champion Optimized limbs, I add then in but did really input the bonus.

Thanks,

Two quick things (flags) I'd like to see...

1) A flag for Adapsin

2) A flag for cyberwear suite on the limb/part replacement page

Adapsin is in the Grade dropdown menu now (not a flag), though it actually calculates for bioware as well (easy fix, don't select the adapsin version for anything but cyberware). A column for cyberware suites in the Cyberparts sheet would be nice (I can add it myself, but can't figure how to get the character sheets to group them).

A few standing glitches still. One is the vehicle mods for the Ferret and Lone Star iBall; while the Ferret does catch that extra four mod slots, the iBall isn't tagged, and both minidrones have a total of 8 slots while the sheet says 5. The Arsenal errata also adds a fourth option for the Firefight martial arts style, a +1 to dodge ranged attacks if in melee.

The Gearhead quality (RC, page 98) has two versions for 5 or 15 points. Also, great that Neoteny/Gnome now tracks on the character sheets, but only the first one works; the other two don't deduct the physical condition properly.

Running Wild, page 34 to 35 outlines a new skill group and four new skills that would be nice to have added to the list.

Beyond that, great work as always DK.

Added: Forgot to mention the additional lifestyle positives listed on page 39 of Running Wild.

Hello,

I was wondering if there is a provision in the generator that I have not located that allows for headware comlinks to be optimized like carried comlinks, with better ratings, enhancements and add-ons, etc? If not, is it feasible to incorporate this into a future release?

Love the generator, thank you for your hard work on it!

Respectfully,


Pax

1) RC 91 Pilot Origin Quality

2) There were more than I thought, looks like the original SR didn't have a chart for costs of these.
Bliss, SR 248, SRA 257, SRA 335 (Chart)
Cram, SR 249, SRA 257, SRA 335 (Chart) (wrong price in sheet, should be 10
Deepweed, SR 249, SRA 257, SRA 335 (Chart)
Jazz, SR 249, SRA 257, SRA 335 (Chart)
Kamikaze, SR 249, SRA 258, SRA 335 (Chart)
Long Haul, SR 249, SRA 258, SRA 335 (Chart)
Nitro, SR 249, SRA 258, SRA 335 (Chart)
Novacoke, SR 249, SRA 258, SRA 335 (Chart)
Psyche, SR 250, SRA 258, SRA 335 (Chart)
Zen, SR 250, SRA 258, SRA 335 (Chart)
Guts, AR 74, (not listed on the chart on pg 76 irritatingly)

3) unwired 198-199 (chart on 199). Since it takes a modification slot, I'd rather see it in the mod drop down of the hacking page (or both places) than in the accessories, but all good

4) Eh, no more restricted than exceptional attribute and you don't highlight those when maxing, but it's a trivial thing. No big.


Thanks

There should be the Eghost one too.

When you get a headware commlink, you just pay for the surgery and the additional cost of having the commlink put in your head. You can use the Hacking page to track the statistics of the commlink in your head.

This Negative quality is called 'Ghost in the Machine' and is only available to select if you are an AI. Change your character to AI and look for the negative quality, you will see it is already on the sheet.

Awesome! Added all of these. I put the Customized interface on the Hacking page, and also left it on the Gear listing, just added cost to it there.

The only drug I could not find in the table in SR4a was Bliss. I went ahead and made it 10 nuyen. Anyone have know if its price is mentioned anywhere in the books? Maybe in 3rd ed?

¿Anyone have tried it in open office?

Yes it's been tried in open office I some things were change for better stability for Open Office but I think it still has some trouble.

Yes, it works in open office. Open the file in open office, then save it in the Open Office document format.

The dice rolling macros will not work, but otherwise everything should work just fine.

I prefer Excel because it tends to handle complicated spreadsheets better. It just runs faster with the sheet.

Also, the sheet seems to have bad luck with OO 3 and XP. That may have changed with a recent update, but when I used it on an XP system with Open Office the sheet tended to crash a bit. OO 3 with Vista or Windows 7 will likely give you better results.

I do not show Adapsin in the grade dropdown menu, and for that matter, it needs to be calculated by a flag or marker somewhere, for later purchases on characters so it does not retroactively apply. On second thought, a marker is best.

It works fine on my sheet, using version 1i (I recall it working retroactively on version 1g, and without a working flag option).

Before I select Adapsin in the Cyberparts sheet the options do not show in the Grade list; it's only Used Std., Used Alpha, Std., Alpha, Beta, and Delta.

After I add Adapsin in the Cyberparts sheet, more options show up in the Grade list; (Adap) Used Std., etc. The essence cost is not retroactive to already installed cyberware. In fact, if you remove Adapsin from the Cyberparts sheet and you have anything with (Adap) in its grade, the whole essence calculation errors out.

Upgrading to 1i fixed the adapsin (darn you, 0.9g!) that just leaves the cybersuite on replaced parts page.

Changed Gearhead to (Specific Vehicle) 5 and (Type of Vehicle) 10. It lists both 10 and 15 for the costs (10 at the top, 15 in the body text). I think 10 is more appropriate.

Added Animal Husbandry Skill group and its related skills.

Added lifestyle qualities from Running wild. For Animal Lover One, Two and Three I put 'Animal Lover (Small)', 'Animal Lover (Medium)' and 'Animal Lover (Any)'.

I should put something in for pet owners...